So I bought a Tikka T3 varmint heavy barrel in the. .308. It shoots great with factory match ammo at 200 yards. Consistently sub MOA. Now I want to shoot at 500 yards and have the opportunity to make some hand loads with some borrowed equipment . And wanted to shorten my load development time by finding out what works for other people. And to hear about the things other people have tried.
Need help with 500 yard. Load development for my new Tikka
- Thread starter Sullivan
- Start date
Are you hunting or target shooting? Have you loaded cartridge's before? If you aren't used to reloading the first thing to do is get some manuals and do some serious reading.You gave weights of bullets but not the type whether they are match or soft points,who made them etc.What powder's do you have on hand?
I am shooting score able targets at 500 yrds . I do have some reloading experience. the bullets are 150 grain sierra game king spitzer boat tail. the 168 grains are sierra match BTHP . and the 180 grains are Nosler Partition spitzer. with flat base. im using federal match once fired brass. Win LR primers and I have not chosen a powder yet.. I've always shot Federal match 168 factory ammo , and always planned on reloading that weight bullet. but last summer I started shooting 300yrd and 500yrd competition at our local fish and game club. and wanted to tighten up my groups for this summer . The plan was to see if I got better performance out of a lighter or heavier bullet in my rifle. 1:11 twist 24"long barrel. There is a ton of information out there for Rem.700 barreled actions ,, but no info for a "stock" Tikka T3 varmiter.. The first competition this year is in May , so either I have a ton of shooting ahead of me to find the right load , or I was thinking I could build off some suggestions and successes of other people and cut my development time down..
also I forgot to say, powder selection is hard because here in Vermont the temperature could change 45 degrees in a day which also creates humidity change and great mirage out at 500..
So any help from the shooters out there would be much appreciated
also I forgot to say, powder selection is hard because here in Vermont the temperature could change 45 degrees in a day which also creates humidity change and great mirage out at 500..
So any help from the shooters out there would be much appreciated
Shynloco
You can lead a horse to water, but ........
Sullivan,
I haven't shot a Tikka T3 and name brands don't do anything for me per se. But, the .308 caliber has been a long time favorite of mine and one I've shot for more than 30 yrs. So what I'm going to say is based upon my personal observations in testing and reloading. Now I'm not sure if you are locked in on those three bullets or are more flexible. For target shooting and score, I'd forget the 150's for sure and you are, IMHO on the border with the 168's. That's what I shoot pretty much exclusive, but I'm using them 100-200 yds. And based upon a conversation I had with the Sierra folks a few years back, I'd be starting my testing using a 175 gr bullet and trying to get my groups tuned with that bullet weight. But you have the 180's so might as well test with those. And what I'd do to find a starting point, I'd refer to my Sierra Manual and look at the velocities listed for the different powder loads. Now hopefully you have some reference from past shooting as to the velocities at a given distance where you rifle seems to perform. So I'd try and match up that velocity listed in the manual and and use that as a starting point and fire say three/three shot groups and see what she gets you. From there I'd increase my powder by .02 - .03 and see if you groups tighten up or open up. At least you'll know if your powder is right for your bullet. Taking someone else's load (again IMHO) is almost useless as each rifle is different. And if your loading manual has an "Accuracy Load" listed, by all means give it a try also if you have the powder to match it. And knowing it's a .308, I'd be loading the seating depth to the recommended OAL until you've found the right powder for your rifle and then start moving the bullet closer to the throat for fine tuning. I know one barrel I had on mine loved the jump and hated the jam. Then when I changed barrels to a Hart MG barrel of the same twist, that one loved the jam and hated the jump.
Hope that gives you some ideas of what and how to try. That's just the system I've developed over the years for me and again in IMHO, there just isn't any substitute for testing simply because each rifle is different and what works in one, won't necessarily work in another when it comes to target shooting and loads.
Good Luck and have fun in your shooting.
Alex
PS. The powders I'd be using would be either Varget, IMR4895, RE15 or even Benchmark if you were restricted on the powders available.
I haven't shot a Tikka T3 and name brands don't do anything for me per se. But, the .308 caliber has been a long time favorite of mine and one I've shot for more than 30 yrs. So what I'm going to say is based upon my personal observations in testing and reloading. Now I'm not sure if you are locked in on those three bullets or are more flexible. For target shooting and score, I'd forget the 150's for sure and you are, IMHO on the border with the 168's. That's what I shoot pretty much exclusive, but I'm using them 100-200 yds. And based upon a conversation I had with the Sierra folks a few years back, I'd be starting my testing using a 175 gr bullet and trying to get my groups tuned with that bullet weight. But you have the 180's so might as well test with those. And what I'd do to find a starting point, I'd refer to my Sierra Manual and look at the velocities listed for the different powder loads. Now hopefully you have some reference from past shooting as to the velocities at a given distance where you rifle seems to perform. So I'd try and match up that velocity listed in the manual and and use that as a starting point and fire say three/three shot groups and see what she gets you. From there I'd increase my powder by .02 - .03 and see if you groups tighten up or open up. At least you'll know if your powder is right for your bullet. Taking someone else's load (again IMHO) is almost useless as each rifle is different. And if your loading manual has an "Accuracy Load" listed, by all means give it a try also if you have the powder to match it. And knowing it's a .308, I'd be loading the seating depth to the recommended OAL until you've found the right powder for your rifle and then start moving the bullet closer to the throat for fine tuning. I know one barrel I had on mine loved the jump and hated the jam. Then when I changed barrels to a Hart MG barrel of the same twist, that one loved the jam and hated the jump.
Hope that gives you some ideas of what and how to try. That's just the system I've developed over the years for me and again in IMHO, there just isn't any substitute for testing simply because each rifle is different and what works in one, won't necessarily work in another when it comes to target shooting and loads.
Good Luck and have fun in your shooting.
Alex
PS. The powders I'd be using would be either Varget, IMR4895, RE15 or even Benchmark if you were restricted on the powders available.
Thank you . That's just the sort of no nonsense info I was looking for . My tikka has a ton of "free bore" and I was told that was the kiss of death . That's most of the reason why I was looking to see what other people were doing . SAKO recommends the 168 grain SMK bullet for target shooting and their other target bullet listed was a weird 122grain thing probably for short range , or "reduced" loads .
Shynloco
You can lead a horse to water, but ........
Sullivan said:
Sullivan,
Sounds to me like someone has their specific calibers confused about the "122 gr thing." That bullet weight is for a 30BR and not a .308 proper. Same caliber but the casing is way different in length. In case you aren't aware, a 30BR rifle takes a .30 cal bullet alright (most used are 110 - 125 gr bullet that's shot through a 1:17 - 1:18 twist barrel) but the casing is a necked up 6mmbr casing. And hence the powder loads are way different. No way is that related to what you are attempting to achieve. And don't sweat that bull about the too much freebore being "a kiss of death." There are ways to correct too much freebore that a good gunsmith can take care of.
Alex
I have a Tikka 595 in 22-250 that also had what I consider extreme long freebore. At first, I was trying to approach the lands but with a 14 twist, it was just not in the cards for those weight bullets. Finally, I decided to jump farther and farther out all the way to where the base of the bullet was at the neck/shoulder junction and....I found a spot that was about 130 thou off the lands that was and is very sweet. Lesson I learned...don't be afraid to jump...a sweet spot is there somewhere. I jumped at 30 thou increments and then fine tuned when I saw a tightening.
Best Wishes
Best Wishes
Use the 168 or the 180's. Don't over look IMR 4064 for the powder for the .308, it is also available. IMR 4064 is a pain to run thru the measure because of the grain length but it will shoot good. Powder Valley may still have "factory seconds" 175gr match bullets for sale, they would be a good bullets for your 500yd shooting. Load your ammo "long" to be loaded single shot, the long throat may be OK for single shot and not use too much case powder space.
Simply duplicate the seating depth of the factory ammo that shoots well and use the same bullet. Use 4064, H4895, or varget. Pick a shave starting point, and load up a ladder in 0.3 grain increments for each powder . Run 1 wet patch and one dry patch before each powder change. Pick the middle of your best node and shoot it at 500. If needs fine tuning, adjust powder up or down by 0.1 grain. Make all 3 shot groups at 500
I have a .308 Tikka CTR, I think the 11 twist 20" barrel is a bit thinner profile than your heavy barrel.
I have three good loads with 168gr Nosler CC's that may or may not provide some areas of interest for your load development.
43.5gr IMR4064, 2.86" OAL, CCI 200, Hornady case
45gr Varget, 2.86" OAL, CCI 200, Hornady case
42.4gr Ar-Comp, 2.86" OAL, CCI 200 Hornady case
As always, work up your own loads, you'll probably have to use shorter OALs if you are using factory plastic mag
I have three good loads with 168gr Nosler CC's that may or may not provide some areas of interest for your load development.
43.5gr IMR4064, 2.86" OAL, CCI 200, Hornady case
45gr Varget, 2.86" OAL, CCI 200, Hornady case
42.4gr Ar-Comp, 2.86" OAL, CCI 200 Hornady case
As always, work up your own loads, you'll probably have to use shorter OALs if you are using factory plastic mag
Sullivan,
There is lots of good information represented here, as usual.
But there are also some other thoughts which might prove useful in the yardages you wish to shoot and the type of bullets you might select. But first a comment about the SAKO information. Being Scandinavian, the four countries comprising their local and then the European communities dictates a slightly different idea of hunting. The 'weird 122grain thing' is the Speedhead which is their 122 grain Full Metal Jacket bullet usually reserved for small game hunting where pelt damage should be kept to a minimum.
As to the rest of the questions...
Long free bore is nothing to be discouraged about these days. With the shapes of bullets ever changing the concept of jam vs free bore is changing as well. We are seeing reports every day on longer, sleeker bullets jumping significant amounts before engaging the rifling without a loss of accuracy.
Lighter vs heavier bullets or shorter vs longer bullets can be a little misleading when distances are limited to 5-600 yards. Case in point; my shooting partner and I were invited to a competition with some very different limitations from what we were used to shooting. This one called for lighter rifles, shorter distances and shooting JUST the .308 Win. Bullets and powder were our choices of course. We wound up shooting the Berger 155.5 grain Full Bore over a full case of IMR-8208 XBR for some excellent velocity and accuracy. This is a super combination for anything on paper between 100 and 1,000 yards although it really doesn't compete with those arrow-like heavier VLDs. Currently, the newer Ramshot Wild Boar and Alliant AR-Comp have proven to be possible alternatives if we run out of the 8208.
The only other bullet I shoot in the .308 Win. currently is the Berger 175 grain VLD over IMR-3031 or H-4895.
Regards.
There is lots of good information represented here, as usual.
But there are also some other thoughts which might prove useful in the yardages you wish to shoot and the type of bullets you might select. But first a comment about the SAKO information. Being Scandinavian, the four countries comprising their local and then the European communities dictates a slightly different idea of hunting. The 'weird 122grain thing' is the Speedhead which is their 122 grain Full Metal Jacket bullet usually reserved for small game hunting where pelt damage should be kept to a minimum.
As to the rest of the questions...
Long free bore is nothing to be discouraged about these days. With the shapes of bullets ever changing the concept of jam vs free bore is changing as well. We are seeing reports every day on longer, sleeker bullets jumping significant amounts before engaging the rifling without a loss of accuracy.
Lighter vs heavier bullets or shorter vs longer bullets can be a little misleading when distances are limited to 5-600 yards. Case in point; my shooting partner and I were invited to a competition with some very different limitations from what we were used to shooting. This one called for lighter rifles, shorter distances and shooting JUST the .308 Win. Bullets and powder were our choices of course. We wound up shooting the Berger 155.5 grain Full Bore over a full case of IMR-8208 XBR for some excellent velocity and accuracy. This is a super combination for anything on paper between 100 and 1,000 yards although it really doesn't compete with those arrow-like heavier VLDs. Currently, the newer Ramshot Wild Boar and Alliant AR-Comp have proven to be possible alternatives if we run out of the 8208.
The only other bullet I shoot in the .308 Win. currently is the Berger 175 grain VLD over IMR-3031 or H-4895.
Regards.
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