Neck sizing only question

[tstowater]

Searched a lot of threads but not sure what the answer is. I've got two 20 Vartargs, one in an MGM barrel on an Encore and the second is a Criterion barreled 700 Remington. Both are shooting Remington 221 Fireball brass. Post firing necks on both is .230. Brass for each gun has been kept separate. Guns are used exclusively for varmint shooting and single shot only.

I want to work the brass as little as possible so I would like to neck size only (type S Redding die). I have a body die to use if necessary. Plan is to use a .228 bushing and stuff a bullet in. I have a .227 bushing if needed but want to keep neck tension at a minimum. Do I need to shoulder bump or am I safe to keep the brass separate for each gun and just neck size. Loaded a lot, but this is the first time at the neck sizing game.

What an I missing?

 

[DaveTooley]

Full length size every time. What happens is if you wait until you determine the brass needs FL sizing it has work hardened at a larger diameter. Sizing will get it back in the rifle but the brass remembers it's larger size. Upon firing it goes back to that and you have the same problem. Life is too short to fight stubborn unruly brass.

 

[boltfluter]

Searched a lot of threads but not sure what the answer is. I've got two 20 Vartargs, one in an MGM barrel on an Encore and the second is a Criterion barreled 700 Remington. Both are shooting Remington 221 Fireball brass. Post firing necks on both is .230. Brass for each gun has been kept separate. Guns are used exclusively for varmint shooting and single shot only.

I want to work the brass as little as possible so I would like to neck size only (type S Redding die). I have a body die to use if necessary. Plan is to use a .228 bushing and stuff a bullet in. I have a .227 bushing if needed but want to keep neck tension at a minimum. Do I need to shoulder bump or am I safe to keep the brass separate for each gun and just neck size. Loaded a lot, but this is the first time at the neck sizing game.

What an I missing?

Why neck sizing only? Just curious is all. Bumping shoulder may be necessary at some point, depending on how hot the load is. Body dies are great for this. Good shooting to you.
Paul

 

[K22]

While I believe in F/L sizing for all applications, this is especially essential if you are a hunter which you stated that your intended purpose is varmint hunting.

If you F/L properly, there will be no decrease in case life or accuracy. Plus you will have the assurance that your reloads will chamber without issue. I speak from experience. I believed the myth promulgated in the 60's that neck sizing increases case life and accuracy. After many years of reloading and shooting experience, I can attest that this is NOT true.

To properly F/L your cases you need a bump gauge. I recommend the Whidden caliber group specific gauges since they are single piece, no interfaces due to inserts. They are inexpensive. There is a preponderance of posts on here on how to correctly F/L size. If you have difficulty finding them or need additional help, PM me and I will gladly help.

 

[DHD]

This question pops up a lot. As other very knowledgeable guys above have stated, full length sizing is not going to cause you any issues. Heck, it saves you the hassle of possibly having an issue (tight ammunition).

If your chambers allow it, the FL sized cases may chamber in both. However, that single shot will want ammo that drops in without any arguments. I have and shoot a couple falling block BPCR's and they DO NOT appreciate tight cases.

 

[Big Mc]

Searched a lot of threads but not sure what the answer is. I've got two 20 Vartargs, one in an MGM barrel on an Encore and the second is a Criterion barreled 700 Remington. Both are shooting Remington 221 Fireball brass. Post firing necks on both is .230. Brass for each gun has been kept separate. Guns are used exclusively for varmint shooting and single shot only.

I want to work the brass as little as possible so I would like to neck size only (type S Redding die). I have a body die to use if necessary. Plan is to use a .228 bushing and stuff a bullet in. I have a .227 bushing if needed but want to keep neck tension at a minimum. Do I need to shoulder bump or am I safe to keep the brass separate for each gun and just neck size. Loaded a lot, but this is the first time at the neck sizing game.

What an I missing?

Don,t neck size. Only leads to trouble. Tommy Mc

 

[LVLAaron]

 

[D-4297]

View attachment 1553157

Cute ! But just a "little" harsh . I like it though .
Been a lot of conversation on whether to anneal or not , but if it's case life you are after , then I would suggest annealing after every firing , if possible . I shoot in TR with a .308 and "moderate loads" , Lapua SRP Brass , and have over thirty reloads on this brass . Redding ; Type "S" F/L Die .

 

[Clancy]

I’d just order a Forster FL sizing die honed to .227 or .2275 (can’t REALLY predict spring back) and use that. Anneal regularly.

There’s a guy on here that makes 20 Vartarg brass, neck turned and all, should you ever run out.

Neck sizing is problematic, should be dead by now, but it keeps popping back up. I’m in no way talking down to you either- I once thought it was a mighty fine idea.


EDIT: I didn’t see you said POST-FIRING neck is .230. You need to be .002-.003 under a loaded round, not a fired case.

Thanks @Coyotefurharvester .

 

[Coyotefurharvester]

Your missing: post firing size is 0.230, the neck bushing will be determined by the LOADED cartridge neck diameter -(minus) the amount of neck interference (neck tension). So if the loaded neck diameter is 0.228 you would use a bushing 0.226 or smaller based on testing/ preference and spring back(brass can spring outward with bushings) . I run 0.002-0.0035 under on hunting rifles, 0.003-0.004 on my AR's. Careful comparator use and fully fire formed brass from both rifles may show that the brass could be full length sized with the die set the same, and brass still kept separate or used in both. I have ran varmint rifles both ways with prairie dog accuracy.

 

[Bill Norris]

I agree with what others have said up top. Neck sizing may minimize brass movement for a few firings but at some point you will need to F/L size it. Some F-class shooters say by allowing the brass to move that small amount will hamper accuracy as it does change the brass slightly at each firing.

 

[Homerange]

Searched a lot of threads but not sure what the answer is. I've got two 20 Vartargs, one in an MGM barrel on an Encore and the second is a Criterion barreled 700 Remington. Both are shooting Remington 221 Fireball brass. Post firing necks on both is .230. Brass for each gun has been kept separate. Guns are used exclusively for varmint shooting and single shot only.

I want to work the brass as little as possible so I would like to neck size only (type S Redding die). I have a body die to use if necessary. Plan is to use a .228 bushing and stuff a bullet in. I have a .227 bushing if needed but want to keep neck tension at a minimum. Do I need to shoulder bump or am I safe to keep the brass separate for each gun and just neck size. Loaded a lot, but this is the first time at the neck sizing game.

What an I missing?

Without occasional annealing managing neck tension will be a challenge I have found.
YMMV.

However with these small cases and in front of a 700 action you should find FL sizing almost unnecessary unless stoking them hard. Just be sure to keep a little lube on the bolt lugs to minimize wear resulting from the camming action required from not setting the case shoulders back.

This is how I've run with a 223 for many years and always been able to chamber cases.
However with the larger calibers and pushing them along you are unlikely to get a trouble free run.
YMMV

 

[C.E.Smith043]

F.L. Resize is your best bet.

 

[CharlieNC]

Without occasional annealing managing neck tension will be a challenge I have found.
YMMV.

However with these small cases and in front of a 700 action you should find FL sizing almost unnecessary unless stoking them hard. Just be sure to keep a little lube on the bolt lugs to minimize wear resulting from the camming action required from not setting the case shoulders back.

This is how I've run with a 223 for many years and always been able to chamber cases.
However with the larger calibers and pushing them along you are unlikely to get a trouble free run.
YMMV

This echos my 223 experience. After measuring hundreds of cases I found neck sizing provided much more consistent head space vs FL and had absolutely no issues in my ftr rifle running the brass numerous cycles, and have a match buddy with similar results. For neck tension consistency I do anneal every time. This is not acceptable in cases with higher capacity, but might suffice for your small case and is easily evaluated.

 

[nettle]

Decades ago it was said that if cases were FL resized it would overwork the brass and the case would separate. Trend was to back the FL sizing die up a turn or so and "partially" FL resize. It's an old myth that is still hanging on. I FL resize and Small Base resize for my M1A which works the brass even more. It's always the neck that splits first.

 

[Richard Jones]

This echos my 223 experience. After measuring hundreds of cases I found neck sizing provided much more consistent head space vs FL and had absolutely no issues in my ftr rifle running the brass numerous cycles, and have a match buddy with similar results. For neck tension consistency I do anneal every time. This is not acceptable in cases with higher capacity, but might suffice for your small case and is easily evaluated.

Sorry, I don't understand this. How does neck sizing affect headspace? You never had to FL size?

 

[Homerange]

Decades ago it was said that if cases were FL resized it would overwork the brass and the case would separate. Trend was to back the FL sizing die up a turn or so and "partially" FL resize. It's an old myth that is still hanging on. I FL resize and Small Base resize for my M1A which works the brass even more. It's always the neck that splits first.

Hardly.
Decades ago annealing was not within the reach of the average reloader and the dies of those times double worked the neck which as they got harder and harder and eventually split.
Even back then LCD were available to halve the neck brass working and much later bushing dies came along to achieve the same thing but added FL sizing to the equation to provide reliable chambering.

 

[nettle]

You are mixing what happened back then and what is available now together.

 

[K22]

I can't believe this is even being debated but I guess this is the way of things.

With the availability of quality case gauges (i.e., bump gauges these days there is no reason not to F/L size. Having both neck size and full size for many years, I can positively attest that there is no accuracy advantage to neck sizing and no difference in case life, at least with standard dies. The huge advantage I found to F/L sizing is predictable and reliability of chambering.

 

[JayHHI6818]