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Neck dia cut vs reamer print

BuffaloBill

Silver $$ Contributor
How could I improve for next time:

I chambered a barrel this past weekend in 6BRA, using a Wheeler #1 spec’d reamer. This was a new reamer. The neck dia per print is 0.268. Attempting to mic across flutes shows maybe 4 tenths over, but was tricky so am not certain. As best I can measure the neck ID in the fresh chamber, using those expanding ball gauges & micrometer, it’s 0.2694. So maybe it cut a thou over(?).

I had initially dialed in the blank at the throat and about 1/4” in from the breech, using Grizzly rod with weight and snug bushing. After drilling out the bulk of material I rechecked runout at the throat reaching in with the 10ths reading Mitutoyo indicator (the one with short stylus and small dia body). This time measuring at the grooves, I made a correction of about 1/10th in one axis and trued the hole, boring it to match the reamer taper. Then proceeded to ream the chamber. I use a PTG floating holder and flush system.

When finished reaming, the reamer seemed to be on-size at the breech. There was no wiggle. Did I likely cause the over size neck because I used the snug bushing on the reamer? I had initially checked runout after dialing in the two locations mentioned above, about 1/2” past the throat, and didn’t see any difference between there and the throat. But admittedly I didn’t measure runout as far ahead of the throat, as the bushing location.

When I view the throat with a Teslong, it looks very well centered. I was very happy with the finish and was patting myself on the back……then found the neck measure a little big.

Do you suspect curvature of the bore ahead of where I checked runout, because of the bushing use, caused this?

I fire formed one new case twice this evening so I could take measurements off it. 1st firing was 29grains Varget, CCI450, 105 Berger Hybrid. 2nd firing was 30grains Varget. Measuring the fired case at the shoulder shows 0.462 (and I assume there would be some spring-back). Reamer print specs 0.461. I assume this is further evidence that the nose of the reamer was being steered by the bushing?

I’d read a number of times from a few of you, that the bushing is to be left out when dialing like I did. I’m wishing now I had done so!

How much sizing at the shoulder is too much? As mentioned above the fired case measures 0.462 at the shoulder. After sizing this case it measures 0.460. This was new Lapua brass.

Here’s pic of twice-fired case. Is it blown out as much as it’s likely to go? I have not trimmed length, and I see what looks like ugly neck turning.
IMG_3067.jpeg
 
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Hi Bill it is very tricky to measure a reamer without the proper measuring tools. If you used a caliper, I would not take any of those numbers to be useful.

Is this a 5R barrel? Things can get wonky on a 5R barrel it can push over because of the odd number.

If you haven't used those inside hole gauges for a while they take time to master also.

I would use some pin gauges to check the diameter.
 
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I've found, never asked a reamer maker about this, that there will be two opposing flutes that line up and you can get an accurate measurement. The other two sets of flutes will measure undersize. I measure in three places, using the largest number, obviously. Also reamer dimensions for the neck and throat are most of the time -0.0000" +0.0005".
I can't comment on your use of a snug fitting bushing for this job but I use undersize bushings on everything. I depend on barrel setup and prep for alignment.
What was the neck diameter of your fired piece of brass?
 
Hey Bill,
Your method of chambering sounds very good to me. Measuring a reamer is very awkward without an optical comparator in my experience. 5R barrels can be a pain to deal with. Your sizing does not seem excessive as it is only .001 per side. Depending on how accurate your measurements were on the reamer you may not be off as much as you think on the neck diameter. The target will tell you what you want to know. I'm betting it drives tacs!! Good job and keep us posted.
Paul
 
Tight pilot will not make the reamer cut over size. The things your measuring can be measured accurately if you have the right feel. But if you dont do this everyday its not the easiest thing to measure. I run a mic everyday and can get within .0002" on a reamer diameter but on a split ball Im only confident to .0005". Also, the reamer being a few tenths over print is normal and a GOOD thing. I take that into account when I design a reamer. If they hit the number exactly I would have to change all my specs again. Like I did when I started using JGS vs the old company I used.
 
For sure a reamer will never cut undersize and it will only cut a perfect diameter in a perfect setup. Is your reamer ground to cut a .268 hole or does it actually measure .268. A .268 actual measure will always cut a little over as it needs some clearance to rotate.
 
The bushing can make the reamer cut oversize only if the bushing is eccentric to the cutting circle. This is fairly unlikely and can be checked by mounting the reamer on centers and checking it with a dial gauge. Do not turn the spindle of the lathe, just turn the reamer on the dead center. concentricity is the only question. I think it is unlikely but possible. WH
 
The one ting I do different than your set up is I indicate the barrel as far as ai can, then rough everything out. Then I reach in with my indicator and indicate exactly where the throat will be established. I then bore the chamber, on the correct taper with the compound, and ream with a pilot.

I agree with Walt, do a test piece with just the neck and shoulder established, the measure the neck. I just use small hole gages.
When you say it is cutting .001 over, that is quite a lot. I would almost think the reamer is ground too large considering the steps you have taken in your setup, especially since the body portion of the chamber seems to be dead on.
 
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Hey, I really appreciate everyone’s replies.

It’s a 4 groove Krieger, .237, 7.5T HV.

I agree that it’s tough to be spot-on with an expanding ball gauge. I can say that un-turned brass with bullet seated measured (with micrometer) 0.2688 and would chamber w/o any perceivable friction. So the neck is at least that big.

I hadn’t measured across all pairs of reamer flutes but will try that.

The fired brass’s neck measured 0.2672. Is this amount of spring back typical? With bullet seated the neck mic’s 0.2650.

Cutting a neck in a test piece is a great idea, and effectively I’ve already done that. I reamed a Wilson in-line die blank. I also dialed in the blank at two points like I did the barrel. But used the long-reach Interapid .5 thou indicator this time as I didn’t have large enough bushings. Then drilled out the bulk, taper bored to match reamer taper, and reamed it. The ball gauge tells me the neck is IMG_20250629_175549_2.jpegIMG_3066.jpegslightly larger than the barrel’s. And this reaming was done with no bushing.

Will keep you posted on how it shoots.
 
Once upon a time in short range BR a few us shot fitted necks. Meaning we didn't have to size the necks. I chambered a short stub to use as a gauge, then turned my necks to fit. After chambering the barrel the necks were too tight and I had to turn the brass again. Ferris Pindell suggested trying that so the next time I saw him I told him about my problem. His response " the reamer cuts smaller in the barrel vs the stub" A light came on. It's fully supported in the barrel.
 
Well, it shoots mighty fine.

Shot this morning at the farm. 30gn Varget, BR-4, 105gn Hybrid, fireforming new brass, 0.010” into lands. Two shots to obtain this zero. Pic is shots #3,4,5 at 100yds. 1” target dot. It kind of gave me the chills.

IMG_3071.jpeg

I shot the plate rack after that sight-in group. 3.0mils elevation for 527yds with 100yd zero. Velocity came up about 30-40fps over the 50 shots fired, ending around 2835fps.
 
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