More 30 Nosler testing and a ladder lesson

[Alex Wheeler]

My personal hunting rifle I built to try the 30 Nosler out for elk this year,
25" 10 twist rock creek #5
Kelbly Atlas single shot
Mcmillan game warden
Bix tac sport trigger
lil beast brake

Load for the ladder, cci 250, H1000, Berger 215 .010" off, new Nosler cases. All components right out of the box. 12 rounds on the rifle before today.

Ladder shot at 600 yards, prone from a bipod, there was about 1.5 moa worth of wind today. After shot 1 I knew I was too high so I pulled 1.5 moa out of the scope and replotted shot 1 on the target. Ladder was shot with 8.5 moa on the scope from a 100yd zero.

83.5- 2992
83.9- 3001
84.3- 3018
84.7- 3058
85.1- 3091
85.5- 3102
85.9- 3107
86.3- 3125

There is 2 obvious nodes, about 3000 fps and 3100 fps. The 3100 fps is warm, I got extractor marks here but this tg ejector is large and exaggerates this a bit. I am comfortable running this node. This is a great ladder to learn how to tune from ladders for positive compensation. It also shows why the "only look at vertical" mentality is wrong. You can draw a line from 2-8. At each node the group shows horizontal. This is telling you something. The nodes are obvious but seating depth is wrong. The next step will be to load 85.5 and work on the seating depth to form round groups.

 

[long40shot]

Good stuff Alex. Thank you for sharing this process.

 

[Ledd Slinger]

Should be a beast on elk. Good looking rifle too

May I ask why you chose to do a single shot action on an elk hunting rifle?

 

[Alex Wheeler]

I am a single shot guy. I just do not like repeaters. I have killed running elk with singles shots and never felt disadvantaged, you can throw a round in out of an elastic cartridge holder almost as fast as cycling a repeater. Everytime I have built a hunting rifle on a repeater I always end up running it like a single shot so I decided no more repeaters for me. No jams, no closed tips on bergers, no scraped bullets, no bullets seated deeper in the case from recoiling in the magazine, exc. In open country where I hunt, long range shots give plenty of time and I should not need a follow up, and if I do I can have another in there very fast. I would bet, if most guys tried it they would switch also.

 

[Ledd Slinger]

Makes sense. I do hate having to seat my bullets so deep on magnum cartridges for magazine restrictions and bullets/brass can get beat up a little bit from recoil and feeding.

Don't know if I could do a single shot in the northwest high country tho. Just had too many instances where animals bust out from a bench I'm cresting going down a ridge and whatnot.

I don't hike with a round in the chamber anymore either. Don't fully trust any safety mechanism. I can see animals from a long distance in a lot of the country I hunt, but I've just had too many close encounters where literally 1 or 2 extra seconds of delay would have cost me the shot on the animal. I wish the elk hung out in open meadows up here like they do down southwest. Hunting them would be a little easier...Well, at least finding them would be easier. I have a buddy who owns about 200 acres down in the bitterroot valley and it has a resident elk heard. He shot his last bull elk from his dining room table in the house!!! Just popped the screen out of the dining room window. Lol. Lucky duck

As you stated, shots 5, 6, and 7 in that 3100 fps range look like an excellent node for vertical.

I really like that stock. Very sharp looking What's the weight on it?

 

[Alex Wheeler]

I dont plan to try the 230. One trick I do with a single shot is to chamber a round and hold the trigger while closing the bolt to de-cock the action. So you have a round in the chamber with the firing pin de-cocked. If you need to shoot just lift the bolt handle and close it to cock the action. I do not use or trust safeties. @tom has a 30-28 nosler I built him. He is running the 230, I think he hit max at 3020 fps with H1000, over 3100 with rl33. This rifle is a little beefy. The adj cheek ads a pound so its a 3.5 lb stock. Shes up above 12lb with the NXS. But I have a 8.5lb 28 nosler that shoots unreal if I need a lighter rig.

 

[long40shot]

Would you expect to see any improvement when you start using the fire formed cases?

 

[Alex Wheeler]

Yes, formed cases will handle a little more pressure and neck tension will be more consistent, these cases did not have the roundest necks out of the box

 

[dixiecricket]

Alex, when you "decock " the firing pin on a live round, the fp tip is actually resting on the primer under spring pressure.

 

[Alex Wheeler]

Alex, when you "decock " the firing pin on a live round, the fp tip is actually resting on the primer under spring pressure.

Thats correct.

 

[Ledd Slinger]

Alex, when you "decock " the firing pin on a live round, the fp tip is actually resting on the primer under spring pressure.

Very good point.

 

[Alex Wheeler]

A loaded gun is dangerous. Period. You have 2 options if you want a loaded rifle with a remington style action. One is the firing pin resting on the primer under spring pressure. For it to fire would require a good hit to the cocking piece at the back of the bolt. The other option is a firing pin held back by the trigger. Take apart a Jewell trigger and look at how it works. In no way do I feel comfortable using that system. If we are talking a firing pin block like a win 70, thats a different story. No matter how you choose to do it, dont trust any of them. Keep it pointed in a safe direction.

 

[Ledd Slinger]

Really no way to truly be safe with a round in the chamber I suppose.

Single shot or repeater is just personal preference for hunting. If a single shot allows for better consistent accuracy in a particular rifle but sacrifices load times for follow up shots, that would be up to the individual to decide which way they want to go with a build.

I have never had any issues with my repeaters firing all rounds into nice tight groups. I have always been able to make Berger VLD bullets shoot extremely well whether they are jumping a long ways to the lands due to magazine restrictions, seated just off the lands, or touching the lands. My hunting rifles all shoot under 1/2 MOA so any further accuracy gain would not really be needed to hit the kill zone of an elk at long range. I personally would not change to a single shot for hunting purposes. For my hunting situations, speed is very important and the accuracy I get with repeaters is more than adequate.

 

[Alex Wheeler]

Got to test that load at 1k. 3 shots 1 inch of vertical. Colored blue

 

[TZaun]

That's a really good shooting elk rifle. Earlier you said you knew something wasn't right with the seating depth at .010" off. Where did you end up?

 

[Alex Wheeler]

That's still .010 off, the other holes were in the lands, it was not happy there. It is still shooting wide. I will fine tune seating at some point. Its probably only a couple thousandths off.

 

[jim_k]

Alex, I'm uncertain about your comment in the OP regarding the "only look at vertical" mentality being wrong. I look at this ladder, and there are the two nodes, both of which can be determined either by velocity or by vertical. I agree with checking seating depth for "special magic," but it seems that the two main components being assessed (velocity and vertical) both pointed to exactly the same nodes. What message am I missing with regard to your comment? BTW, I love that Berger 215 hybrid, but why did you go with that instead of a hunting bullet? I'm assuming you have on-pelt experience with them?

 

[FURMAN]

The 215s performance on game is very well documented. I would not choose any other 30 cal bullet for hunting big game especially when intending to stretch the distance.

 

[jim_k]

Thanks for that. I had not seen info on the 215, which I guess was available on another site, or I missed it on here. I have shot both the 185 hunting VLD and the 215 hybrid at 1,000 yds., and found them both to be excellent; but in F-class, the 215 can't be beat. Even from a .308 or '06, the 215 drifts about 2" less for each mph of crosswind than the 185. I can only imagine the oomph on an elk out past 1,000 yds. from a 30 Nosler.

 

[Alex Wheeler]

Correct, the 215 is excellent for hunting. Look at the width. The node showed horizontal. You could look at that ladder and think you were done because the vertical was great. Wrong. That width is barrel harmonics not conditions. You can see it in the 1k group too. It needs further tuning with seating depth to make the group round.