Mid-Range Rule Sighter Question

[Erud]

If you look at the NRA's rule changes effective 2017, they do state that unlimited sighters are now permissible for 600 yd prone slow fire. And I do know of a record string that was shot at 600 yds with unlimited sighters that the NRA accepted and the shooter was awarded national record recognition.

Well then, there you go. If the NRA changed the rule and just hasn’t put it into the rule book yet, then I guess I have to retract all of my previous comments.

It does make me wonder how we managed to make it all the way to 2017 only being able to shoot 2 sighters for mid range though.

 

[Liven The Dream]

Here’s another way to look at it. Read the match Program! When a match is developed it’s sent to the NRA for approval. If needed the NRA will suggest any changes needed. If the program is approved by the NRA (such as the # of sighters or relays) the NRA has waived that rule. Also match directors have great leeway in running a match. An example is in XTC matches. Nowhere in the rules does it say you must shoot 200 then 300 then 600 yds in that order. The rules say you must fire 20 rounds for record at each stage. So, you could wind up shooting 600 yds first then 200 and 300 last.

In FLA and Texas unlimited sighters on the first relay is common. Read the Match Program.

In most programs there is a clauses " Match Directors Discretion " In Palma Matches 800 yards have unlimited if not a Team Match Team only 2 sighting shots.
If there is a 1000 yard Match the 1 stage has unlimited sighting shots. all other stages have 2.

 

[DR1586]

let’s get some smallbore guys in here. You want to kick the hornets nest ask them about sighters.

SkiBar is correct. There was a change made and has been widely adopted. Personally, I’m for whatever. I generally do my take more than 2 sighters at MR unless I want to foul the barrel more or just want to shoot up and odd round from a previous lot of bullets or something.

 

[Dgd6mm]

When I first started shooting Camp Blanding out of Starke, Florida a few years back we shot 2 sighters 1st, 2nd, and 3rd relay. Now we shoot unlimited for 1st, 2 sighters for the 2nd and 3rd.

 

[skibar_tx]

A year or so ago, when I was researching this topic, I found that the current rulebook hasn't been updated since whenever. I also found an old rulebook that suggested to me that all the 17.5 subcategories depicting the different distances/COF had been changed. What may have been labeled (x) (y) and (z) in an earlier edition, was now (v) (w) and (x). It is my belief that the paragraph that describes the sighting shots allowed in national record strings was not edited to reflect the current subcategory lettering system. It was noticed and ruled on in the 2017 HP changes. It might be that unlimited sighters were always allowed in 600 prone slow fire matches. I know in mid range course, 600 was always shot last, so they never had but 2 sighters period.

 

[Mittry]

At the 2018 Arazona Midrange Championships course of fire was: unlimited sighters and 20 for record at 300, 500 and 600. Mid stated that that was the latest and “blow offs” were not NRA approved. That’s the way I heard it over the the PA down on the little end with the rest of the sling pukes anyway.

Marc Mittry

 

[Monte F]

As I read the rules and the 2017 changes, F-Class is only 2 sighters on all strings at 3X600. High power is unlimited on the first string. Hope that clears it up (the rule book is clear as mud on this). A blow off/fowling period with targets down before the actual match time of 22 minutes is up to the match director as I understand it (I may be wrong though). I think you should show up with a good zero for 600 and be on paper on the first sighter at an approved or registered match.

 

[McStocks]

At the 2018 Arazona Midrange Championships course of fire was: unlimited sighters and 20 for record at 300, 500 and 600. Mid stated that that was the latest and “blow offs” were not NRA approved. That’s the way I heard it over the the PA down on the little end with the rest of the sling pukes anyway.

Marc Mittry

SLING PUKES???

 

[Jennb]

First pic is from rule book F Class rules
Second pic is what the latest update is to these rules. They may have loaded opposite but they say pretty much the same thing.

 

[Jennb]

The revision says unlimited sighter shots may be fired and shall be recorded in courses of described in Rule 17.5 (w) and (x).

W and X in the revision is 600 yard slow fire prone

 

[RDA72927]

The revision says unlimited sighter shots may be fired and shall be recorded in courses of described in Rule 17.5 (w) and (x).

W and X in the revision is 600 yard slow fire prone

Jenn,

Thanks for the infro. It talking about the subject to others, one person "asked, Have you looked at the course of fire for the NRA Nationals?" So, I went and looked. ( http://www.baldeaglesrc.org/resources/Documents/2017 SOA Results/2018 NRA FClass nationals.pdf )

Well, The first match at 300,500, and 600 all are listed as unlimited blow off on target, then 2 sighters-- 20 shots for score.

So, with Jenn's thoughts and the course of fire at the NRA Nationals I believe I have the answer.

Thanks for everyone's input,

Robert

 

[Lbart]

Robert, I think you better re-check the Bald Eagles web site - The program has been changed. http://www.baldeaglesrc.org/resources/Documents/2017 SOA Results/2018FCMid-range(PDF).pdf

 

[Jennb]

I looked and a blow off period of 1 minute is listed but its not listed in the course of fire.

 

[Ned Ludd]

I looked and a blow off period of 1 minute is listed but its not listed in the course of fire.

I saw the same thing. Perhaps they don't consider the "blowoff period to be part of the course of fire? I have participated in matches where shots during the "blowoff" period were placed into the berm with the targets down, others where they were actually fired on the targets and scored as if they were sighters, but not recorded.

IMO, the difference between the two is that you will likely get better shot placement information when they're fired on the target, but you will also get fewer shots off during the time period as you have to wait for the target to be cycled. "Blowoff" shots into the berm can give useful information about shot placement if you can pick out a rock, lump of dirt, twig, etc., and spot the location of your impacts in relation to the POA, but it's not always as useful as a shot marker on the target face. Either way, it shouldn't be an advantage or disadvantage within any given match as long as all shooters are operating under the same procedure. However, it might well be an advantage/disadvantage between matches at different venues using one or the other procedure, which is probably the reason they specify national records can only be set using a specific course of fire.