make'n a Dummy - 30Br

[25AI260]

get'n ready to see the smitty to have a barrel cut an chambered for a .30br
i have 125 & 110 berger bullets on hand to make up a dummy of each for a 30 Br build...
what OAL should i be using or ogive measurment for these bergers ?
does it matter ?
case trims to 1.500 .. .330 neck

 

[skeetlee]

sounds like some pretty solid info from gunamonth!! Enjoy the 30, i know i sure do!! Lee

 

[25AI260]

beleive me i'm taking it all in.... sometimes have that ability to mess things up on my own, so this time i'll ask questions first.. hope they aren't to dumb !

gunamonth a E- may be on the way i thank you for the offer

 

[skeetlee]

Never a dumb question. We all start from the beginning. There is a lot of solid info here, but there can also be just as much BS. stick around read a bunch and you will soon know whats what. Lee

 

[SmokinJoe]

Actually, the Bergers are just as good as any of the other custom makers bullets. I have shot them with good results, and if I'm not mistaken, Ron Collins shot them the year he was runner-up for IBS VFS Score Shooter of the Year. Their newer bullet in the 115/118 range (can't remember) should perform right along with anybody elses. Remember that Bergers are custom bullets made with J-4 jackets, too, just automated. I have always competed with BIB 118/10's, but we are fortunate to have quite a few great choices for the light 30 cal bullets as listed by gunamonth, plus some others.

 

[skeetlee]

I am with Joe. My bullet od choice is BIb 118 10 ogive or the 112 but i have shot and won a couple matches with the berger 115. To be real honest i couldnt tell much difference between them. I have shots groups with the bib bullet and they are quite impressive, and i think Randy is one heck of a nice man so i just shoot his bullets now. Actually i shoot randys bullets for just about every rifle i have. But yes the berger 115 is a dam fine bullet! Lee

 

[25AI260]

i wondering after a little experimenting this past weekend whether If its worth turning necks 'Does It Really Matter'..? it looks scary.. the neck is so thin looking thinking [.010-11] they'll split down the road at some point i made up all turned, ten live rounds rounds five ready cases an two dummies 110gr & 125 to the oal of 2.320/2.375 if they're to long its not much of a problem they went so easy i guess with little force the bullet can be move in the chamber .. i couldn't by hand

i did expend the 6br case with a tapper button in the Reading FL die in one pass it went really easy with a lot of lube an didn't get much of a bump back at the shoulder i've read about.. overall not bad But i'm now re-thinking the size of the chamber. 1 - the case on an average come out 1.528-29 +/-, But after doing a computer test [powely comp program] i found the shorter case [1.500] gets a small amount more velocity at the same cartridge oal length - less bullet in the neck which isn't much to start with
2- i'm not sure what i want to do about turning necks cause the necks also have come out at .328-29..

wasn't able to get a hold of my smitty this week so i have to wait till fri to call... watts u're input... i'm i over thinking ?

Edit:...
also i left out a thought on turning necks... after re-forming the 6br case in the die the necks probably aren't perfectly true so the wall thickness wouldn't [i 'm think] be even around the circumference .. will that matter down the road ?

 

[redrock]

i wondering after a little experimenting this past weekend whether If its worth turning necks 'Does It Really Matter'..? it looks scary.. the neck is so thin looking thinking [.010-11] they'll split down the road at some point i made up all turned, ten live rounds rounds five ready cases an two dummies 110gr & 125 to the oal of 2.320/2.375 if they're to long its not much of a problem they went so easy i guess with little force the bullet can be move in the chamber .. i couldn't by hand

i did expend the 6br case with a tapper button in the Reading FL die in one pass it went really easy with a lot of lube an didn't get much of a bump back at the shoulder i've read about.. overall not bad But i'm now re-thinking the size of the chamber. 1 - the case on an average come out 1.528-29 +/-, But after doing a computer test [powely comp program] i found the shorter case [1.500] gets a small amount more velocity at the same cartridge oal length - less bullet in the neck which isn't much to start with
2- i'm not sure what i want to do about turning necks cause the necks also have come out at .328-29..

wasn't able to get a hold of my smitty this week so i have to wait till fri to call... watts u're input... i'm i over thinking ?

Edit:...
also i left out a thought on turning necks... after re-forming the 6br case in the die the necks probably aren't perfectly true so the wall thickness wouldn't [i 'm think] be even around the circumference .. will that matter down the road ?

To start with your first question: Should I even turn necks?

Above you mentioned that you will be running a standard 1.500 .330 neck chamber, You have no choice you must turn necks.

The reason being is the thinnest i've ever seen the Lapua brass necks is .0125" x 2= .025 so add that to bullet Dia at the Pressure ring and you get (for the two bullets you mentioned .3085 at the PR and .3080 at the Shank) .3335 with the Bergers and .3337 with RG's Bib's (.3087 PR and .3084 Shank), So I (who have never won a match of any kind so take it for what its worth) would turn the Necks to NO MORE than .328 and .327 over bullet might be better .
Thats turning to .0095(X 2) = .327 over bullet with Bergers and .3277 over bullet with BiB's giving you a neck to chamber clearance of .0023 / 2 = .00115. (More on bullets later)

Next question: Won't the Necks Split?

No, simple answer, I've got about 90rds per case on my current lot of 30br's zero failures.

You mentioned two bullets 110's and 125's now something to keep in mind is a 110 is made on a .975 jacket which gives you a bearing surface length of about .320" and the 125 is made on the 1" Jacket which gives you a bearing surface length of about .370" (.050" difference).

I shoot a 118-7 Bib which is built on a 1" Jacket (This is where the similarities end between Berger and BIB) and gives me a bearing surface length of about .415" , I like that extra length cause it allows for more versatile placement in the case, and they sure seem like there easier (for me anyway) to tune. The difference in Shank dia may help that as well with BIB's being a .3084 along the bearing surface.

To Summarize , Pick one Jacket length bullet, (preferably pic a bullet weight) and have your chamber cut to that, also having that decision out of the way helps you figure out what you want to do for neck thickness, now I know where talking tenths of thousands here but my statements are geared to the PRECISION shooter that expects to extract the most performance out of his/her rig.

For what its worth.

 

[SmokinJoe]

I think most of us that are using the .330" neck chamber turn to .0100" neck thickness. IMO, if you are settled on using the 7 ogive bullets, you should have the barrel chambered with .040-.050 freebore, but the zero freebore will work, too. With zero freebore & 7 ogive bullets, you will be seating fairly deep & using valuable powder space in this small case.

 

[skeetlee]

we shoot some 300 yard targets in our monthly shoot, and the bib 118 10 ogive is the go to bullet for me. To shoot that bullet you need the zero freebore. Lee

 

[25AI260]

gunamonth.. Thanks, i owe ya one ... pack came i will inspect the differences tomorrow i have all week to play now...
so far what i see thou... the 118 10 doesn't look v.much different then the berger 125..

redrock .. what i was thinking or re thinking about turning .. your rite there is no choice If i went with .330 neck chamber, thanks for the other info its becoming clearer but there were some other points i was making i'm still wondering about

you'all i guess are only using H-4198 powder... i have IMR 4198 on hand i guess i can test with that till i pic-up the H- stuff ??
any other powders work as well

Oh these little numbers [7] [10] are these the dia of the tip ? they sure can't be ogive numbers

 

[25AI260]

i've expanded on the question an after a majority consciences i couldn't help but to finally decided on an go with the K&M complete tool...
i've had some pretty good info plus better ideas like buy custom brass pre made which i almost considered .. but being a hands on guy an stubborn to boot i''m go'n the hard way

now i need one of those dial indicator gismo's [something simple] looking at a sinclair model..

Happy Fathers Day..... 2ya'all
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