Looking for F Class Action
- Thread starter bootlaceb
- Start date
butchlambert
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Looks like we are all in the same boat! You find an extra give away, let me know.
Butch
Butch
Bootlaceb,
Instead of a grand for a custom action, look at purchasing an entire rifle. Yea, that is more money yet, but you can't build a new gun for the kind of money you can purchase a good used unit.
The only difference is that you will probably spend more for the new gun, but put out the money a little at a time.
I do understand the difference but when you are finished, the used gun may be the much better purchase.
You can use the bbl you get with the gun to get familiar/comfortable with it. Then when that is accomplished in a year or so, you can install a new tube and be ready to extract the full potential from your rifle.
Learning to play the game on a new bbl is an expensive way to go.
A used rifle will usually come with a lot of items that you would have to purchase new at extra expense.
Lood for a used rifle with a Barnard, RPA, or custom action of some kind. The resale value is much higher than a reworked Remington.
Course that is just my opinions and not worth very much.
Bob
Instead of a grand for a custom action, look at purchasing an entire rifle. Yea, that is more money yet, but you can't build a new gun for the kind of money you can purchase a good used unit.
The only difference is that you will probably spend more for the new gun, but put out the money a little at a time.
I do understand the difference but when you are finished, the used gun may be the much better purchase.
You can use the bbl you get with the gun to get familiar/comfortable with it. Then when that is accomplished in a year or so, you can install a new tube and be ready to extract the full potential from your rifle.
Learning to play the game on a new bbl is an expensive way to go.
A used rifle will usually come with a lot of items that you would have to purchase new at extra expense.
Lood for a used rifle with a Barnard, RPA, or custom action of some kind. The resale value is much higher than a reworked Remington.
Course that is just my opinions and not worth very much.
Bob
Bob,
Thanx for the idea. It does make sense in a way yes.
But...with that in mind, what is the general consensus of the Savage Target Action 308 RB,RP. At $450 from Bruno's it seems a very good deal.
Then in the same breath..if I am using it for F-Class out to 600yrds, is an action like a Bat or Nesika etc going to give me more accuracy?
Now the next question, would it work for building a 6BR, or what model would work?
Thanx for the idea. It does make sense in a way yes.
But...with that in mind, what is the general consensus of the Savage Target Action 308 RB,RP. At $450 from Bruno's it seems a very good deal.
Then in the same breath..if I am using it for F-Class out to 600yrds, is an action like a Bat or Nesika etc going to give me more accuracy?
Now the next question, would it work for building a 6BR, or what model would work?
I think you can build a whole rifle for a grand that will be somewhat competitive. Will it use the best of components? No. Will you be able to see the target after the sun goes down? No. Will it win the National Championship? Probably not. But, you can get in the game and have fun and learn a lot.
I got a used Stevens 200 in 30-06 and rebarrelled it 300WM for long range shooting. The Shaw barrel was horrible until I used a NECO firelapping kit, but it settled down so that I can regularly hit a 6 inch target at 600 yards,the longest range I have access to) more often than not.
I shopped for a while for parts and bought some on sale. When I bought the rifle, I parted out everything but the bolt and action. The price that you see on the action is what I did not recover. It was a very fun and rewarding project, and taught me a lot about Savage rifles.
You don't have to use my recipe; I am sure there are a myriad of aftermarket parts that would be suitable, as Savages are gaining in popularity. My goal was to stay under $1000 total, and I almost made it.
This list includes parts, sights and tools:
Part/Tool . . . . . . . . . . Price . . . Comments
Receiver & Bolt. . . . . . . . . 130.00. . . Stevens 200, used
Stock. . . . . . . . . . . . . . 95.00. . . Bell & Carlson Duramaxx Tactical
Bolt Handle. . . . . . . . . . . 25.00. . . Sharpshooter Supply Factory BT
Barrel . . . . . . . . . . . . . 150.00. . . ER Shaw 3.5 contour 26" 300WM
Recoil lug . . . . . . . . . . . 23.00. . . Tubb
Bolt Head Parts,Belted Magnum). 39.00. . . Extractor, ejector, detent, springs and Bolt head
Target trigger . . . . . . . . . 71.00. . . Timney
Steel trigger guard. . . . . . . 20.00. . . Savage factory
Sight Base . . . . . . . . . . . 42.00. . . Millett Picatinney
Rings. . . . . . . . . . . . . . 42.00. . . Millett Tactical 30mm
Scope. . . . . . . . . . . . . . 230.00. . . Millett TRS-1 non-illuminated
Bipod. . . . . . . . . . . . . . 43.00 Outers Shooters Ridge 9-13
Parts Total . . . . . . . . .$910.00
Barrel nut wrench. . . . . . . . 25.00. . . Sharpshooters Supply, used
Receiver wrench. . . . . . . . . 25.00. . . Midway Franklin Arsenal, used
Headspace Gauges . . . . . . . . 32.00. . . Go and No-go
Paint. . . . . . . . . . . . . . 10.00
Epoxy. . . . . . . . . . . . . . 10.00. . . Acra Gel
Tools Total . . . . . . . . .$102.00
TOTAL . . . . . . . . . . .$1,012.00
There is no reason you cannot do this on a short action with a barrel chambered in 6BR. If I were building an F-Class in 6BR using this platform, I would get a heavier contour barrel,mine is the Savage Varmint contour), and I would save up for better glass. The Millett is adequate for prime shooting hours, but just barely.
I got a used Stevens 200 in 30-06 and rebarrelled it 300WM for long range shooting. The Shaw barrel was horrible until I used a NECO firelapping kit, but it settled down so that I can regularly hit a 6 inch target at 600 yards,the longest range I have access to) more often than not.
I shopped for a while for parts and bought some on sale. When I bought the rifle, I parted out everything but the bolt and action. The price that you see on the action is what I did not recover. It was a very fun and rewarding project, and taught me a lot about Savage rifles.
You don't have to use my recipe; I am sure there are a myriad of aftermarket parts that would be suitable, as Savages are gaining in popularity. My goal was to stay under $1000 total, and I almost made it.
This list includes parts, sights and tools:
Part/Tool . . . . . . . . . . Price . . . Comments
Receiver & Bolt. . . . . . . . . 130.00. . . Stevens 200, used
Stock. . . . . . . . . . . . . . 95.00. . . Bell & Carlson Duramaxx Tactical
Bolt Handle. . . . . . . . . . . 25.00. . . Sharpshooter Supply Factory BT
Barrel . . . . . . . . . . . . . 150.00. . . ER Shaw 3.5 contour 26" 300WM
Recoil lug . . . . . . . . . . . 23.00. . . Tubb
Bolt Head Parts,Belted Magnum). 39.00. . . Extractor, ejector, detent, springs and Bolt head
Target trigger . . . . . . . . . 71.00. . . Timney
Steel trigger guard. . . . . . . 20.00. . . Savage factory
Sight Base . . . . . . . . . . . 42.00. . . Millett Picatinney
Rings. . . . . . . . . . . . . . 42.00. . . Millett Tactical 30mm
Scope. . . . . . . . . . . . . . 230.00. . . Millett TRS-1 non-illuminated
Bipod. . . . . . . . . . . . . . 43.00 Outers Shooters Ridge 9-13
Parts Total . . . . . . . . .$910.00
Barrel nut wrench. . . . . . . . 25.00. . . Sharpshooters Supply, used
Receiver wrench. . . . . . . . . 25.00. . . Midway Franklin Arsenal, used
Headspace Gauges . . . . . . . . 32.00. . . Go and No-go
Paint. . . . . . . . . . . . . . 10.00
Epoxy. . . . . . . . . . . . . . 10.00. . . Acra Gel
Tools Total . . . . . . . . .$102.00
TOTAL . . . . . . . . . . .$1,012.00
There is no reason you cannot do this on a short action with a barrel chambered in 6BR. If I were building an F-Class in 6BR using this platform, I would get a heavier contour barrel,mine is the Savage Varmint contour), and I would save up for better glass. The Millett is adequate for prime shooting hours, but just barely.
Bootlaceb,
I looked at FALphils list and it is very comprehensive. That said, I doubt that any of the rifles in the top 20 at the F-class National shot a Shaw bbl. $10 for paint will cover an aerosol can job. He is obviously a very handy fellow and worked on a very tight budget. If you are at his level of ability, give it a shot.
A few years back I started to fit my own bbls and have done my own paint. A winning custom bbl will run a little over $300 and that is just the blank in your hand, not chambered and fitted. Buy the way,you want that 6 BR bbl to be stainless and to be 30-32 inches long. Check out the local auto paint store and see what the cheapest base coat, clear coat, paint runs. Don't forget the catalyst and reducer.
I am not trying to diminish FALphils accomplishments at all. He did a lot with very little. What I see is a rifle that doesn't have a lot of room for growth as his skills grow. He is going to spend a whole lot of cash to upgrade his rifle. It becomes a money pit that rarely reaches the shooters potential.
I am not up on the level of accuracy out of the box for a Savage, but would do some investigating. See if you can find an equipment list and gunsmith list from the recent F-class nationals at Lodi. That would be a good starting point to see what was competitive.
One of the issues that FALphil brought up is the quality of a factory bbl. Some will respond to that firelapping and others will not. A custom rifle will have a custom bbl. They are typically going to out perform a factory bbl most of the time.,there are those exceptions but I wouldn't plan on getting one).
You would also be getting some other parts like a dedicated stock,probably a max forend width)maybe fiberglass or at least laminated, good trigger, 20 MOA scope rail, and perhaps a shot at a decent scope and reloading equipment.
Once you start totaling up the expense of each of the gunsmiths tasks to build a rifle, it adds up real quick. I would rather pay 1500-1800 for a used custom rifle than build a rifle with a factory action. Been there, done that.
Did the factory action rifle shoot, yes it did. Was the rifle cheaper cause I pieced it a little at a time. No it wasn't and I still had a Remington 40X action rifle that cost much more than its resale value.
The above is just my honest opinion and therefore worth exactly what you paid for it
Everyone will work within their budget, sometimes you have to be a bit creative,sell something) to reach a little higher.
Bob
I looked at FALphils list and it is very comprehensive. That said, I doubt that any of the rifles in the top 20 at the F-class National shot a Shaw bbl. $10 for paint will cover an aerosol can job. He is obviously a very handy fellow and worked on a very tight budget. If you are at his level of ability, give it a shot.
A few years back I started to fit my own bbls and have done my own paint. A winning custom bbl will run a little over $300 and that is just the blank in your hand, not chambered and fitted. Buy the way,you want that 6 BR bbl to be stainless and to be 30-32 inches long. Check out the local auto paint store and see what the cheapest base coat, clear coat, paint runs. Don't forget the catalyst and reducer.
I am not trying to diminish FALphils accomplishments at all. He did a lot with very little. What I see is a rifle that doesn't have a lot of room for growth as his skills grow. He is going to spend a whole lot of cash to upgrade his rifle. It becomes a money pit that rarely reaches the shooters potential.
I am not up on the level of accuracy out of the box for a Savage, but would do some investigating. See if you can find an equipment list and gunsmith list from the recent F-class nationals at Lodi. That would be a good starting point to see what was competitive.
One of the issues that FALphil brought up is the quality of a factory bbl. Some will respond to that firelapping and others will not. A custom rifle will have a custom bbl. They are typically going to out perform a factory bbl most of the time.,there are those exceptions but I wouldn't plan on getting one).
You would also be getting some other parts like a dedicated stock,probably a max forend width)maybe fiberglass or at least laminated, good trigger, 20 MOA scope rail, and perhaps a shot at a decent scope and reloading equipment.
Once you start totaling up the expense of each of the gunsmiths tasks to build a rifle, it adds up real quick. I would rather pay 1500-1800 for a used custom rifle than build a rifle with a factory action. Been there, done that.
Did the factory action rifle shoot, yes it did. Was the rifle cheaper cause I pieced it a little at a time. No it wasn't and I still had a Remington 40X action rifle that cost much more than its resale value.
The above is just my honest opinion and therefore worth exactly what you paid for it
Everyone will work within their budget, sometimes you have to be a bit creative,sell something) to reach a little higher.Bob
OMG check this out a LA HOWA/VANGUARD action that was chambered in 300 weatherby. What you see is what you get. Not anything special but it has an M16 style extractor,built in recoil lug, one peice bolt and they stiffer than the Rem 700. The best part is its 250.00$ or BO.
So your not interested???????????
Bob3700 said:
Bob, you nailed it. The goal was to build an entry level rifle for under $1000 inclusive that could be accurate at long distances. Were I building one for my own use long term, I would save up longer and buy better components. Still, I satisfied myself that it could be done on a budget, and if you sold the tools after the build, it could be done for under $1000, easily. One of these days, I will finish the step-by-step article and publish it on my web page.
I got interested in this project because a young fire fighter in my community, with wife and two kids wanted to start shooting at distance, but didn't have the cash to buy a really nice rifle. Heck, Remington LTRs are $900 in these parts.
After I finished this project, I found out that Savage sells a 110 FP in 300WM which can be found for under $600. It has an Accutrigger, but the factory tupperware is pretty lame. Still, a used 110 FP might be a better starting point, because there are less parts to buy.
This was a project that could be done by anyone who has the skills to change the oil in his car. A lot of people with no experience at rifle building can do something similar and have a real sense of accomplishment and pride in building their own "custom" rifle. It is also a pretty decent platform for a switch-barrel rifle as well.
Thanks for the critique. I think you were dead on.
Bob,
You make a very strong point here, and I have to agree with you. It would make more sense to go out and buy a complete custom gun
I was going to skimp on price..but it seems to be a equipment game, the better the kit, the better the results!
So, thanx ICANHITHIMMAN for the action offered, but I will be looking at a used custom gun rather. Just makes more sense.
Thanks Guys
You make a very strong point here, and I have to agree with you. It would make more sense to go out and buy a complete custom gun
I was going to skimp on price..but it seems to be a equipment game, the better the kit, the better the results!
So, thanx ICANHITHIMMAN for the action offered, but I will be looking at a used custom gun rather. Just makes more sense.
Thanks Guys
-Guys,
One of the options a new shooter on a budget might look into, is finding out who the F-class shooters are in their area. If that shooter has been at the game for awhile, they may have a rifle back in their safe that they are not using.
I have seen a "Veteran Shooter" loan a newbie a rifle to get started. All they had to do was supply the ammo. Now it doesn't get any better than that. The new shooter in a year or so actually had the opportunity to purchase that rifle for a very reasonable price. The "Veteran Shooter" took a liking to him and wanted to get a new shooter started.
So go look and see who is out there and talk to them. Often if they don't have a rifle to loan, they may know someone who does. Or is selling a good rifle that they can/do no longer shoot.
Just an additional thought.
To FALPhil and all. Thanks for taking my opinion constructively as it was intended. Unfortunately, I have been that guy with the young family and no money with an interest in shooting. We have all probably been there at one time or another. When you start out with lesser equipment, it is really hard to tell if the bad shots are you or your equipment. You often spend a lot of time and cash trying to find out. At that point, you don't know what you don't know and can get very frustrated trying to find the answers. You rise to the level of your ability at that point and have no one to coach/mentor you to a higher level of performance. Frustration city can be found here.
If you rachet up the quality of your rifle and loading ability, the results are amazing. It really helps your confidence and motivation to attend matches and such. I look at helping someone out as giving back to the sport. Hopefully, you will all have or be a mentor to a newer shooter and provide that same level of support/education for someone, just like somebody did for you. That is what makes these sports so interesting, it's the people we meet.
I believe that is what FALPhil did for that young man and he is to be commended. Stick with him and hopefully, his interest and budget will grow. That is all you can do.
Bob
One of the options a new shooter on a budget might look into, is finding out who the F-class shooters are in their area. If that shooter has been at the game for awhile, they may have a rifle back in their safe that they are not using.
I have seen a "Veteran Shooter" loan a newbie a rifle to get started. All they had to do was supply the ammo. Now it doesn't get any better than that. The new shooter in a year or so actually had the opportunity to purchase that rifle for a very reasonable price. The "Veteran Shooter" took a liking to him and wanted to get a new shooter started.
So go look and see who is out there and talk to them. Often if they don't have a rifle to loan, they may know someone who does. Or is selling a good rifle that they can/do no longer shoot.
Just an additional thought.
To FALPhil and all. Thanks for taking my opinion constructively as it was intended. Unfortunately, I have been that guy with the young family and no money with an interest in shooting. We have all probably been there at one time or another. When you start out with lesser equipment, it is really hard to tell if the bad shots are you or your equipment. You often spend a lot of time and cash trying to find out. At that point, you don't know what you don't know and can get very frustrated trying to find the answers. You rise to the level of your ability at that point and have no one to coach/mentor you to a higher level of performance. Frustration city can be found here.
If you rachet up the quality of your rifle and loading ability, the results are amazing. It really helps your confidence and motivation to attend matches and such. I look at helping someone out as giving back to the sport. Hopefully, you will all have or be a mentor to a newer shooter and provide that same level of support/education for someone, just like somebody did for you. That is what makes these sports so interesting, it's the people we meet.
I believe that is what FALPhil did for that young man and he is to be commended. Stick with him and hopefully, his interest and budget will grow. That is all you can do.
Bob
Here is exactly what I have been talking about. It is listed over on LR dot com.
I’ve been acquiring parts to put together an F/TR rifle in .223 Rem for long range shooting. This would make a great varmint rifle also. I don’t have the time to complete the project and would like to sell the package as a whole. The only thing needed to complete the project is finishing the stock, glass bedding the action if desired, and adding a scope and bi-pod. All parts are brand new. They have only been lightly assembled to check fit and for the pics. Here is whats included.
Savage Target Action – This is the 3 screw single shot action with .378 bolt head for .223 caliber. It is in RBRP configuration with the target Accu-Trigger,6oz to 2.5 lbs). Comes with stainless trigger guard, recoil lug and barrel nut.
McGowen Precision Barrel – This is one of McGowen’s Premium Grade SS hand lapped bull barrels in .223. It is a large shank barrel to fit the target action. It is 26†in length and is a 1:8 twist.
The stock is from Sharp Shooter Supply. It is the LVT style laminate stock with the F-Class butt. It has the optional adjustable comb and accessory rail. Color is blue/blue/lt. blue. It comes from SSS fully sanded and ready to finish. Also from SSS are the stainless hex head action screws.
Warne 20 MOA 1-piece steel scope rail Part #M666-20MOA
Bolt Head – Extra .473 Savage bolt head. This is so the action can be used with a .308 etc. barrel if later you decide to change to another caliber.
Burris Signature Zee high scope rings. 1 inch diameter .420 height. Part#420532
Harris Bi-pod adapter to fit the accessory rail. Part #6
I have over $1260 in parts not including shipping. Action from Northland Shooters Supply $430, Stock with options and action screws from SSS $395, Barrel from Northland $270, Bolt Head $20, Warne Scope Mount from Midway $103, Burris rings from Midway $37 and Bi-pod adapter from Midway $9.
I’d like to sell as a package for $1075.00 plus shipping. That’s over $185.00 in savings not to mention the shipping from the various vendors or the 6-8 wk wait for the stock. Shipping will be the actual amount to your zip code. I would estimate shipping to be around $35.00 to $40.00 total. I will ship in 2 packages. One with the stock, barrel and accessories directly to you and the other with the action to your FFL. If your FFL won’t accept a shipment from a individual there will be an additional $20 fee to ship through my 01 FFL. I'm located near Raleigh, NC for anybody interested in doing the sale FTF.
The rifle is listed on several forums. The first “I’ll take it†via email will get it. PM’s or email is fine for questions etc. If you have any questions or need additional pics/info please let me know. mikro1@embarqmail.com If you’d like to talk to me about it, please contact me for my phone number.
Thanks for looking,
Mike
I’ve been acquiring parts to put together an F/TR rifle in .223 Rem for long range shooting. This would make a great varmint rifle also. I don’t have the time to complete the project and would like to sell the package as a whole. The only thing needed to complete the project is finishing the stock, glass bedding the action if desired, and adding a scope and bi-pod. All parts are brand new. They have only been lightly assembled to check fit and for the pics. Here is whats included.
Savage Target Action – This is the 3 screw single shot action with .378 bolt head for .223 caliber. It is in RBRP configuration with the target Accu-Trigger,6oz to 2.5 lbs). Comes with stainless trigger guard, recoil lug and barrel nut.
McGowen Precision Barrel – This is one of McGowen’s Premium Grade SS hand lapped bull barrels in .223. It is a large shank barrel to fit the target action. It is 26†in length and is a 1:8 twist.
The stock is from Sharp Shooter Supply. It is the LVT style laminate stock with the F-Class butt. It has the optional adjustable comb and accessory rail. Color is blue/blue/lt. blue. It comes from SSS fully sanded and ready to finish. Also from SSS are the stainless hex head action screws.
Warne 20 MOA 1-piece steel scope rail Part #M666-20MOA
Bolt Head – Extra .473 Savage bolt head. This is so the action can be used with a .308 etc. barrel if later you decide to change to another caliber.
Burris Signature Zee high scope rings. 1 inch diameter .420 height. Part#420532
Harris Bi-pod adapter to fit the accessory rail. Part #6
I have over $1260 in parts not including shipping. Action from Northland Shooters Supply $430, Stock with options and action screws from SSS $395, Barrel from Northland $270, Bolt Head $20, Warne Scope Mount from Midway $103, Burris rings from Midway $37 and Bi-pod adapter from Midway $9.
I’d like to sell as a package for $1075.00 plus shipping. That’s over $185.00 in savings not to mention the shipping from the various vendors or the 6-8 wk wait for the stock. Shipping will be the actual amount to your zip code. I would estimate shipping to be around $35.00 to $40.00 total. I will ship in 2 packages. One with the stock, barrel and accessories directly to you and the other with the action to your FFL. If your FFL won’t accept a shipment from a individual there will be an additional $20 fee to ship through my 01 FFL. I'm located near Raleigh, NC for anybody interested in doing the sale FTF.
The rifle is listed on several forums. The first “I’ll take it†via email will get it. PM’s or email is fine for questions etc. If you have any questions or need additional pics/info please let me know. mikro1@embarqmail.com If you’d like to talk to me about it, please contact me for my phone number.
Thanks for looking,
Mike
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