just how hard are russian small rifle magnums?

[lpreddick]

working up loads in my 14 tw 6 BR using LT 32 and berger benchrest bullets...62 euwing, 65 web and 64 column. cci 450s down to about 1500, so i used sone russian smr primers. i have read that they are quite hard and to be sure to seat them so the cup is ever so slightly below pocket edge. i uniform primer pockets and did the above. my action is a stiller predator and firing pin?spring are same. 6 cases were fired and there was a very short hangfire...barely a millisec between a discernable "click"?BANG. the 3 shot groups were very small and es likewise very small. i was very impressed. the cci 450s did as always. these russians were in their box next to the cci450on the shelf. are they so hard that the stiller firing pin/spring may not be quite strong enough to light them instantly. i don't like hangfires. i have 2000 more russians, so i'll consider trying them at random if you think the ones used are "bad". i suspect the firing pin/spring is the problem or is this really a problem. as always, thanks.

 

[drumcorpschamp]

I had the very same issue earlier this summer. Had a shooting buddy take the balance of the 1000 pc. box and asked him to run them to prove if it was me or the primers. It was me.

He seats primers using his press and was able to bottom them out in the pockets. Evidently, I was not able to get them all in far enough with my K&M hand tool despite squeezing on it like a gorilla.

Those click-bangs were a little unnerving to say the least. Get'em in all the way!

BTW, I experienced this in my 6BR Haverkamp and 6 Dasher BAT.

Good shooting,
Jerry

 

[lpreddick]

thanks. i don't trust those hand held primer seaters...had a friend using one on his 6x47 lapua and hangfires galore with cci450s...tight primer pocket and primer not fully seated. i use a bench mounted seater with the handle and i purposely pushed them in to the max. they even seemed a bit deeper? could this be the problem? i could lightly seat some in dummy cases at the same level as the cci 450s to see if the click-bang goes away.

 

[Big Mc]

My 6mmbr is a StillrPredator V, factory spring. I do not have a problem with Wolf primers. You MUST push them in deep. I hope this sheds some light on Jerry Stillers Predator actions. Tommy Mc..

 

[lpreddick]

just so i don't get into trouble...i LOVE my THREE stiller action. the last was a lprb coned bolt single shot and this will be my next purchase.

 

[22BRGUY]

Had the same issues as you guys.....bought a 12 pound firing pin spring for a Rem 700 and it worked well in my Rampro action and eliminated 2/3 of the problem with the Wolf SRMs and gave me a quicker lock time. The rest of the issue as you guys have stated is in seating them hard.

 

[Steve Blair]

Russian SRM are as hard as a tax collector's heart. Seat them to the pocket bottom and there will be no problem. I use the RCBS bench unit and it takes a little force to fully seat them, especially in new brass.

 

[Hoier]

I never had a problem with hang fires but I didn't like them because of the force it takes to put them in. I always thought I was gonna set one off seating them.

 

[Beau]

The Russian primers with the magnum cups seem to be very similar to Rem 7 1/2 in hardness.

 

[bigedp51]

"Wolf/Tula primers are used by noted match shooter David Tubbs who says: "Be sure they are seated into the case - if not they can be hard to ignite". Russian primers use a different sinoxide compound (closer to the European type), which, in my testing, consistently delivers better extreme spreads over Federal..." Hard enough for use in semi-automatics."

Wolf/Tula Small Rifle SR #KVB-223 - soft, sensitive copper cup, not recommended for AR15/military rifle use or high pressure rounds.

Wolf/Tula Small Rifle 223 SR223 - #KVB-223M "This is the newest primer available in the Wolf line. It is ever so slightly hotter than the small rifle magnum primer and it comes with a brass colored thick cup. This primer can be used in place of the SRM primer or used when a different powder is used that is hard to ignite."

The above information is from the link below

CHOOSING THE RIGHT PRIMER - A PRIMER ON PRIMERS
http://www.sksboards.com/smf/index.php?topic=56422.0

Below a primer and anvil seated with pre-compression.



Primers: Seating Pressure and Pre-Compression
http://riflemansjournal.blogspot.com/2009/11/primers-seating-pressure-and-pre.html

 

[SmokinJoe]

Nice illustration, biged. I used the Wolf SRM for the last 3 years of BR shooting & they were very reliable for me in the 30BR. You do have to learn to seat them properly, though. I am using a 21st Century hand tool for them currently, and it is a brute, but a brute with extremely good feel. When you seat one of these primers, you will feel it seat to the bottom of the pocket, then give it a little more force & you will feel it move to a second stop. It'll get really firm when it hits that second stop. You just have to work with them a little bit to get the feel right. Then, if you're like me, you'll have a problem crushing the pellets in Rem & Winchester primers because you've gotten used to seating the Wolf/Tula's

 

[lmorrison17]

Back in the great primer drought of ought 8 I bought 2000 and 4 actions would not set them off reliably.
After some research I tried again mashing them hard into the pocket, no joy.

Then I recently inherited an XP-100 and didnt expect much out of it but it's the only thing I had that I had not tried them in.
Loaded up 40 and they all went off fine so who the heck knows.

I am in the process of building my first AR so I will try them in that too.