I'm Stuck.

[4xforfun]

My brother has my dads OLD rem 700 ADL SA. It was part of a 4 gun set my dad bought the minute the 7mm Rem mag came out in the early 60's. The set included a 222, 22-250, 270,and a 7mm Rem Mag......all rem 700 adl's. We lost the 222 and 270 in a fire in 1966. I have the 7mm as my light weight carry gun. it is on it's third stock......a Boyds light weight sporter. The original stock broke in the late 70's and the replacement has been split behind the recoil lug since forever....thus the boyds. He refuses to buy another stock for the gun in question.

Anyway, the Factory 22-250 tube was shot out years ago, was replaced by a 22-250 AI that NEVER EVER shot worth a crap. That tube was replaced last year by a Krieger 243 1-8 twist. My brother couldn't find a load (H1000, 105 Hybrids, Lapua cases, Fed 210) that worked, so he handed it to me.

I ran some groups from 47 -50 (H1000, 105 etc....) in 1/2 grain increments. It was painfully obvious that things worn't working. BEST group at 300 was s touch over MOA and the worst was 3 moa!!! These are three shot groups. Since things weren't going well I experimented with different gun handling techniques.....hard hold, light hold, everything I could think of. JUNK!!! The factory stock just seems flimsy. The trigger is pretty good.

As hard as it was to hold the factory stock steady as I like, I can't imagin that the problem is my gun handeling. I am thinking about switching to one of my LR BR stocks to test, just in case. But I am sure I need to change up components.

What would you change first....the powder or the bullet? I have lots of different powders laying around along with some Berger 108 BT, 105 BT, 105 Hunting VLD, 107 Sierra 107 MK's, along with some lighter bullets.

I don't know, maybe the scope???


Anyway....STUCK!!!!!


Tod

 

[ShootDots]

This begs one question: "Did the original 22-250 barrel shoot good"? If it did, then this may be "undiagnosable" from a computer screen. BUT if it never shot very well, then it is either bedding issues or the action needs a real 'smith to work it over to square and true it up properly>>>and probably both!

 

[4xforfun]

This begs one question: "Did the original 22-250 barrel shoot good"? If it did, then this may be "undiagnosable" from a computer screen. BUT if it never shot very well, then it is either bedding issues or the action needs a real 'smith to work it over to square and true it up properly>>>and probably both!

Well, that is a whole nuther can of worms. Since I didn't shoot it back in the good old days, I can't attest to how it shot. I do know that the rifling was WIPED CLEAN for about 2 inches. When testing for seating depth I slid the bullet about 2 inches down the boar before it contacted..something. This was in the early 90's. The gunsmith that did the 22-250 AI was a complete hack!!!! I think he "bedded it" and "trued it", but as stated before...not my gun, and I have not yet looked at it. I really don't want to spend a bunch of time on it. I think I will strip it down and "look" at it, but, when it comes to gunsmithing, I am next to usless!!! That is why I always "CALL THE GUY" when I need work done!! I think I will switch stocks and load up some 108 BT's and h1000 and maybe try a few with another powder.

Update......can not use my other stock........First off the holes don't line up with the action screws, and also the action has THREE action screws.....the one on the front of the trigger guard actually screws into the action. Probably could have left that one out had the other holes lined up. Old stock has been bedded and the bbl is free floated.

 

[Ledd Slinger]

Classic case of try one powder, one bullet, and one primer then decide the gun wont shoot :

Run 5 different powders then work with the most promising 2 powders by changing charge weights. When you get sub MOA triangle shaped groups, try primer changes and seating depth changes til it shoots the lights out.

Dont mess with powders that give you those 2 together and one flier type groups. No good.

 

[Jason Boersma]

Try H4350 and R22 and your 105 hunting vld. Tod you know what your doing working up loads for rifles, you'll find something that works or what's wrong.

 

[4xforfun]

Try H4350 and R22 and your 105 hunting vld. Tod you know what your doing working up loads for rifles, you'll find something that works or what's wrong.

Yep....I just have never seen anything this bad and I am not familiar with the 243 Win. My good friend has the exact same set up and also smithed by Greg with the same reamer. His shoots fantastic. I should have had Greg tear into the action when he had it just to see. I am going to try his powder...IMR 4831.

 

[Jason Boersma]

I forgot to mention, check the barrel crown one little bad spot and it won't shoot good.

 

[josebd]

have you cleaned the bore?
got all the copper out?

 

[4xforfun]

Classic case of try one powder, one bullet, and one primer then decide the gun wont shoot :

Run 5 different powders then work with the most promising 2 powders by changing charge weights. When you get sub MOA triangle shaped groups, try primer changes and seating depth changes til it shoots the lights out.

Dont mess with powders that give you those 2 together and one flier type groups. No good.

First off, there are guys on this form who I would trust my (shooting and reloading) life with. I took some of their advice as far as which components to try since I had never messed with the 243 win before. Just like I did with the Dasher, the 6-47L, the 300 WSM, 338 EDGE...and they were SPOT ON....and I have the proof!!! Some things just work in some cases. This didn't. If I wanted to spend countless hours and use a bunch of components testing I certianly could have. I have done it 100 times before. Just trying to utilize my expert friends on this form who have experience with the 243. Nothing about this is remotely "classic case".

 

[4xforfun]

have you cleaned the bore?
got all the copper out?

Yep.

 

[jonbearman]

If you cant get it to shoot, I would seriously think about sending it to one of smiths such as Preacher on this forum. Something just doesn't sound right. When you said the smith you used was kind of a hack, could you elaborate on that? Then if you cant get it to do what you want contact a good smith and get it fixed right. In the end it would make shooting a joy instead of a chore. Good luck.

 

[Ledd Slinger]

Classic case of try one powder, one bullet, and one primer then decide the gun wont shoot :

Run 5 different powders then work with the most promising 2 powders by changing charge weights. When you get sub MOA triangle shaped groups, try primer changes and seating depth changes til it shoots the lights out.

Dont mess with powders that give you those 2 together and one flier type groups. No good.

First off, there are guys on this form who I would trust my (shooting and reloading) life with. I took some of their advice as far as which components to try since I had never messed with the 243 win before. Just like I did with the Dasher, the 6-47L, the 300 WSM, 338 EDGE...and they were SPOT ON....and I have the proof!!! Some things just work in some cases. This didn't. If I wanted to spend countless hours and use a bunch of components testing I certianly could have. I have done it 100 times before. Just trying to utilize my expert friends on this form who have experience with the 243. Nothing about this is remotely "classic case".

Referring to your brother, not you. Sounds like you're wasting a bunch of components anyhow so might as well run different powders. But I was just messing around with my earlier comment.

H1000 is too slow in my opinion. The 4350 suggestion is a better starting point.

 

[rogn]

Overall it sounds like most of the reasonable attempts have been made to develop a load that shoots well. Since all you are going to do at this point is burn up more barrel and components, I think you really need , as has been suggested, have the gun gone over thoroughly by a competent rifle smith. I certainly sounds as though there is a fundamental problem with the hardware at this point. Have it checked out and avoid more frustration.

 

[4xforfun]

I better clear up this gunsmith thing. The original smith 20 years ago was a HACK. He did the bedding and he trued up the action....chambered it up with the 22-250 AI that NEVER EVER shot. My brother probably sent 400+ rounds down that tube and just gave up. In fact, anyone want a couple hundred fire formed ,once fired 22-250 AI brass and a used Heart BBL? Screaming deal!! ;D ;D

The smith who chambered up the 243 BBL last year is an ACE He built the LG that I won the nationals with a couple of years ago and does ALL of my work now. Like I said earlier, I should have had him go through it when he had it in his shop.

I loaded up some more test loads of IMR 4831 and 108 BT's. If it looks like it is still bad I will start from scratch....test the scope first. I didn't think I had any other 1 inch scopes to try, but I forgot about the old customized Leupold 36x ....I know that that is a good scope. I will take a look at the crown after I clean it.

Just had a thought about the scope thing......all of the testing my brother did as a 22-250 AI was done with a 3.5-10 VXIII ..all of my current testing is with my 6.5 -20 VXIII. Two scopes....no joy!! Maybe #3 will be the lucky #.

As far as the "made every attempt to find a load" thing....not really. 1 powder and 1 bullet is not really wringing it out. But every custom tube I have ever loaded for would shoot 1 MOA with anything I tried.. Mostly 1/2 MOA, and my load work from there centers on getting every last bit of accuracy out of it. Me getting 1 MOA at best and usually 2-3 MOA...I knew SOMETHING had to change....just wasn't sure if I should try a different bullet or powder........I am doing BOTH.

Thanks for the help,
Tod

 

[nmkid]

As stated before I would get the gun checked out. Then I would start changing one thing at a time. Don't use a different powder, bullet and primer all at once.

 

[M14AMU]

H4350!

 

[rvn1968]

I would guess that you have already done this but just in case; retorque bases and rings ????