I used to think I knew what I was doing at the reloading bench

[Webster]

I have started shooting our local club CMP matches once a month with an M1 Garand. My scores have been averaging 400, which is pretty low. I have been shooting a Hornady 150gr FMJBT over IMR 4064 to get that average.

Today I ran a test, using 3 different handloads and 3 different surplus ammos. The handloads were my usual 150gr Hornady FMJ over IMR4064, 150gr Hornady FMJ over AA2520 and 165gr Fusion bullet over AA2520. The surplus was some LC69, HXP69 and AMA 68 (Danish). The handloads averaged around 5-6MOA and the milsurp all 3 MOA or less. The AMA was 1.5 MOA. I had worked up the charge weights for the handloads some years back but apparently I need to rerun some charge weights. I full length resize every time, but do not anneal. Is there a possibility that annealing would help my handloads be more consistent?

junk rifle

 

[Bill K]

I always used 4895 as the powder to go to in my shooting days with a Garand and high power shoots. Try some if you have it see if that does not work better in yours for grouping. Start around 47 grains and work up a load with the 150 bullets you are using.

I don't believe it to be a rifle issue. Here is one target with the 150gr reload, and a second target with Danish surplus (AMA 68). The flier on the second target was about round 6, if I remember correctly. Probably me on that one. These were shot yesterday. The group on the left was the second of the day, the group on the right was the sixth of the day.

View attachment 1564859View attachment 1564860

My vision isn't the greatest anymore but it's OK enough.

I appreciate all the feedback so far.

 

[TexasC]

Well almost everyone missed the point - The Danish shot very respectably out of YOUR rifle. My suggestion is to gently pull about 10 of the bullets in the Danish ammo and seat them in your brass loaded as you would. My experience is that a rifle either likes that Hornady bullet of it DOESN'T! IMR 4064 is the quintessential M1 Garand powder. Pick up some Sierra, Nosler or Hornady 155gr and give them a try. I use only Hornady 110gr V Max for the J C Garand matches as they are shot at 200yds and I can hold my own. Think barrel gagging on that bullet.
TexasC

 

[bozo699]

I don't believe it to be a rifle issue. Here is one target with the 150gr reload, and a second target with Danish surplus (AMA 68). The flier on the second target was about round 6, if I remember correctly. Probably me on that one. These were shot yesterday. The group on the left was the second of the day, the group on the right was the sixth of the day.

View attachment 1564859View attachment 1564860

My vision isn't the greatest anymore but it's OK enough.

I appreciate all the feedback so far.

Tom,
Are you holding 6 o’clock on the black bull?
Wayne

 

[Bottom Fodder]

If you’re saying it shoots good with factory ammo that tell me it’s not the shooter or gun. The only thing left is the reloaded ammo. Am I correct

 

[tominboise]

If you’re saying it shoots good with factory ammo that tell me it’s not the shooter or gun. The only thing left is the reloaded ammo. Am I correct

That is what I am saying and you are correct

 

[tominboise]

Tom,
Are you holding 6 o’clock on the black bull?
Wayne

Yes, 6 O'Clock on black bull

 

[tominboise]

Well almost everyone missed the point - The Danish shot very respectably out of YOUR rifle. My suggestion is to gently pull about 10 of the bullets in the Danish ammo and seat them in your brass loaded as you would. My experience is that a rifle either likes that Hornady bullet of it DOESN'T! IMR 4064 is the quintessential M1 Garand powder. Pick up some Sierra, Nosler or Hornady 155gr and give them a try. I use only Hornady 110gr V Max for the J C Garand matches as they are shot at 200yds and I can hold my own. Think barrel gagging on that bullet.
TexasC

That is what I am wondering - I may have a bad lot of the Hornady bullets. I have some 168gr Match master BTHP bullets from Midsouth. I will load some up and give them a try. Overkill for 200yard paper target but worth seeing if they shoot.

 

[Longtrain]

Most of my questions about your rifle have been answered in your replies.
Any of the “Palma” 155’s would be a great bullet to test. If I recall, I used 46 grains of IMR-4895, a little lighter than the standard M1 load, but it shot very well in my Garand.

A good front rest, behind where the main stock ends, solid rear bag, post at the bottom of the ball at 6 o’clock. Focus on the front sight, not the ball. It’s so easy to bounce back and forth between the front sight and the ball. If you are inadvertently shifting focus to the ball, (boy it looks good doesn’t it?) your groups will be a gathering not a group. Smooth squeeze, break the shot.
You don’t mention your age, but as we age, our eyes have trouble focusing on something as close as the front sight, easy to flip to the ball. I used a special diopter lens, that forced my focus to the front sight. I couldn’t focus on the ball if I wanted to…
Maybe you’ve got this all figured out, but thought I mention it anyway.

 

[searcher]

The M1 has a lot of recoil and reciprocating mass. I have found that in semi-automatics, I can get some erratic accuracy because the bullets will move around in the case mouth. This could be your issue if you aren't applying a crimp.

I don't crimp, yet I wholeheartedly agree with bullet slippage being a potential problem.

 

[searcher]

That is what I am wondering - I may have a bad lot of the Hornady bullets. I have some 168gr Match master BTHP bullets from Midsouth. I will load some up and give them a try. Overkill for 200yard paper target but worth seeing if they shoot.

I have an M1-A that is what one would consider a full-match-grade rig. While it will shoot 1/2" MOA with the bullet I use, it WILL shoot 3-4 MOA with bullets it hates. I tried a lot of bullets in it, and it hated more than liked. I'd definitely try some bullets of a different weight and also try different powders. You have a bad vibe going on there. That 4064 powder is good stuff - but each rifle has its likes. And do be sure there is no bullet slippage in the case. Maybe make up a few dummy rounds and re-check OAL after cycling them through the action. Best done a day after loading to allow the necks to overly relax if they are inclined to do so-assuming no crimping is being done. If crimping - be SURE all cases are exact same length with many dies. regarding annealing helping - I anneal my brass, but with the groups you are getting, that would not be my immediate focus. Good luck.

 

[spclark]

Yes, 6 MOA at 100 yards, off the bench.

Yikes. Spray and pray!

 

[Jeremy2171]

168 SMK
48.0 varget.


If that doesn't shoot well it's the rifle....or you.

 

[Webster]

Yes, 6 MOA at 100 yards, off the bench.

Are you shooting prone iron sights? What size groups are the other guys you compete against shooting. I would try to have some good conversations with guys at the range that shoot an M1 or something else. What size groups would make you competitive at your range?

 

[Lucky6547]

168 SMK
48.0 varget.


If that doesn't shoot well it's the rifle....or you.

I had a little bit of a scare when I forgot we were talking about ‘06 case…308 on the mind…

 

[Jeremy2171]

I had a little bit of a scare when I forgot we were talking about ‘06 case…308 on the mind…

Lol

 

[mace2364]

if it shoots well with that Danish ammo, I would measure it, and take it apart to figure out the details of the load. If that load shoots well, then it’s probably not the rifle or you. So that leaves the other ammo.

I would also chamber, and then “un-chamber” one of yours. Measure it before and after to see if the bullets is getting moved back in being run through the rifle. If it is, then you need to figure out if it’s happening in cycling, or if your bullet is sticking out too far and being pushed in by the rifling when it’s chambered(probably not, but I’m not there looking at it either). If it’s being pushed back in cycling, then you should probably consider crimping your loads.

Either way, I would still set up my dies to load the same length using that Danish ammo as a guide-since that works. I can’t imagine the bullet in those is anything too special-likely just a 150gr FMJ flat base. The 4064 you’re using should work just fine. So it shouldn’t be particularly difficult to come up with a similar load

Or alternatively, 168gr SMKs are a pretty safe bet for a bullet in an M1, as mentioned before.