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How many fire new brass in a match ?

rmist

How many fire new brass in a match ? I read a couple different thoughts on new brass...1) don't load to full power of match load as detrimental to brass life. 2) just load em up and shoot.
What are you thoughts on this? And please explain your answer. I'm trying to get enough brass together (prepped, formed, and some not formed) for the Nationals. I'm not going to shoot enough brass just to shoot...but trying to get as many fired prior in other matches. Even though one will be a state championship match.

Thanks again
 
The idea of backing off initial loading is sound in my opinion.. Although if I'm not pushing max I will fire form in a shoot off and sometimes I use HG to test or fire form.. Give the brass a chance to form before you blow the pocket out..JMHO


Ray
 
I fireform brass at matches, but not at matches I care to be my most competitive in. Not that you cannot do well fireforming brass, but I see my best vertical (by far) with (at least) once fired brass. For instance, I shot a 150-8x at 800 yds fireforming 223 brass two weeks ago, but that target/distance gives a little more room for error. Neck tension, headspace, case volume, etc vary too much case-to-case prior to the first firing for my 20+shot strings to keep 1/2 MOA vertical beyond 300 yds pushing bullets near their ballistic limit for stability. For example, in one of my rifles I can fireform my 223 brass with a very accurate (about 1/4 MOA at 300 yds and 1/2 MOA 600 yd) load with a 80vld, but if I try a 90vld at or near full power, I will get a vertical "flyer" or two per 10 shots, and primer pockets might only last 1 or 2 more firings rather than 4 or 5. I regularly shoot 223 and 308, so much of my experience is with these calibers. In the 223 I have enough evidence that a full power load to fireform shortens brass life (primer pocket), but the 308 Palma Brass seems to not matter (but only have a max of 6 firings on that brass so far). Hope this helps, Drew
 
My experience has been the same as Drew's. I open virgin brass necks with Sinclair's oversized expander mandrel first, then size them back down with the appropriate FL bushing die. This doesn't touch the shoulders, but does seem to improve neck tension, which can be all over the place straight out of the box. I have fired loads using virgin brass in local competition and they shot very well. However, I would generally not shoot them in important matches. I have also found that running a fairly hot load with the 90 VLDs in virgin .223 brass doesn't do great things for the primer pockets. I have recently started directly comparing velocities for otherwise identical loads in prepped virgin and 1X-fired brass. In my hands, the same charge weight in 1X-fired brass is giving me 8-10 fps greater velocity. Presumably, a small amount of the combustion energy in the virgin brass loads is going to expanding the case, thereby decreasing velocity just a tad. It doesn't appear to make a huge difference, but it something to be aware of if you're doing any load workup in virgin brass, which I often do. Usually a small adjustment of 0.1-0.2 gr charge weight is sufficient to bring the velocity in 1X-fired brass back to that of prepped virgin brass.
 
To me new brass is consistent. I have fired some of my best groups Fireforming. I am talking straight 300 WSM and 340 Weatherby to 308 Baer. The Baer really liked firefoming. I even won the Heavy gun side at the 1000 yard Nationals Fireforming the Baer. Matt
 
I have won a few short range matches fireforming brass. A fellow shooter and friend of mine from VT shot the most X's that he's ever shot at 100 yards fireforming brass with a 250-24X's. Just missed the last X by about a 32nd of an inch.
 
I just load and shoot. I've never noticed a difference worth worrying about in 600 yard F class at least.
 
with my last 3 barrels in 6.5/06 (necking up 25/06 WW brass) I've found fireformed cases shoot tighter groups at 600 + yds. Ive used non-fireformed brass at 3-500 yd matches and the done fine.
 
I fireformed 6br into Dashers during mid-range matches. It has once in a while cost me a point to vertical, but all in all, it shoots cleans at both 300 and 500.

I have to say, I've taken third in a 300 yard match while fire forming. I only shot a 600-40x and the vast majority of the 10's were my fault as we're all of the x's. I've also won at 500 and 600 with a few dropped points.
 
Here's what I did this spring... Went to the Bucksnort regional with 3 of the 4 boxes of ammo Fire formed for a 8 relay match. Shot the 3 fire formed then finish with the not formed. I started a little rusty but got it going by the end of the first day, next day I'm on fire and going for a comeback win! Start with a 199-11x and then a 200-12x , I'm rubbing my hands until I get to the last box that wasn't Fireformed yet. The rifle wasn't on call like it was earlier and dropped 7 points that I could do nothing about.
 
I'm a sling shooter, using the .243 Ackley Improved. Have fireformed many cases while shooting mid-range matches, and not noticed much difference compared to those already fireformed. Used the same load as used in the fireformed case. Zeros remained pretty much the same, even at 600 yards. Have never fire formed at 1000 yards, but for mid-range, no concerns at all.
 
I was planning on just using the new brass in MR matches. Thanks for the replies. Getting them all ready now with neck turning and the rest of the prep !
 
To this day the best single day score i've shot in FTR at a 1000 yard match was 592-26X and that was shot with brand new Lapua Palma brass never fired. The brass was neck turned then resized but not fired. Not saying fire formed isn't better but i've won several matches with new brass and i'm not scared to use it.
 
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