Heat treating a die?

[F Class John]

Curious if anybody has any experience heat treating a sizing die made from 416 stainless steel? Looking it up in the book but wanted to see if there was any real world numbers out there that could help?
Thank you.

 

[rotts4u]

I don’t have direct experience with heat treating a die, but I manage an aerospace/ defense machining division of the company I work for.
It is my experience that if you want to maintain very specific tolerances you do rough machining first to get the part close to final dimensions but always leave some material. Then heat treat it. Then come back and perform final machining. Otherwise parts move around during heat treating. It may only be .001 but it can also be A few thou. A part like a die is not long and slender but it does have a large relief in the center so it’s gonna move, it’s just a matter of how much and how good the heat treater does his job.

 

[Keith Glasscock]

I would look for a surface hardening process for 416. I know that low temperature plasma nitriding works on some martensitic steel, just don’t know if that applies to 416.

My instinct is that lower temperatures would reduce the dimension change effect somewhat.

 

[Alex Wheeler]

nitride

 

[F Class John]

Ok I'll look at the coatings. I have a friends who's company does heat treating but I'll probably send it off to AZ for treatment to be safe. Thank you everyone.

 

[Will Henry]

I would try Kasenit. I have not tried it on 416 but it's worth a shot. I would just bore a cylinder and try and harden it then measure for dimensional change. WH

 

[luckyshot52]

Gas nitride works great

 

[hdskip]

Google "heat treating 416 Stainless steel" and a lot of information will be available from the steel industry.

 

[Fuj]

416 can be heat treated and tempered. I would tend
to have it surface treated though.

 

[butchlambert]

I have had them Melonited. Works great.

 

[Steve morgan]

You don't want a coating,you want it heat treated. Melonite is a ht process

 

[butchlambert]

Yes Sir. The same process that I use on my barrels.

 

[TheOtherZilla]

Not dies, but I make knives I heat treat. 416 needs around 1800°f to harden. Quenched in oil. Then tempered to desired hardness.

 

[Shooter13]

Not dies, but I make knives I heat treat. 416 needs around 1800°f to harden. Quenched in oil. Then tempered to desired hardness.

Have we seen you on "Forged in Fire"?

 

[Spike A]

Have we seen you on "Forged in Fire"?

Naa can’t be him… them guys only use magnets … must be like horse shoes and hand grenades… close enough counts

 

[jackieschmidt]

416 is not an ideal material to machine a die from. While it is a martensitic stainless, it does not contain the amount of carbon needed to obtain much more than a RC Hardness of 40.

Most dies are machined from some type of free machining steel and then case hardened. If you have ever chucked a factory die up, you know that they possess a certain amount of distortion Due to the case hardening performed after machining.

the case hardening is typically about .010 deep.

As was suggested, some type of coating might be your best bet If you insist on using 416. You could also have it carbonized, which is another form of case hardening.

 

[TheOtherZilla]

Have we seen you on "Forged in Fire"?

No

 

[Will Henry]

416 is not an ideal material to machine a die from. While it is a martensitic stainless, it does not contain the amount of carbon needed to obtain much more than a RC Hardness of 40.

Most dies are machined from some type of free machining steel and then case hardened. If you have ever chucked a factory die up, you know that they possess a certain amount of distortion Due to the case hardening performed after machining.

the case hardening is typically about .010 deep.

As was suggested, some type of coating might be your best bet If you insist on using 416. You could also have it carbonized, which is another form of case hardening.

Do you think Kasenit would work then? I feel like it should but have not tried it. I know I could carburize then case harden it but it would require some experimentation. I have made dies of free machining screw stock and hardened with Kasenit which worked out OK. An attempt at using C1045 was a failure. While it would harden OK, dimensional change made it unworkable. Fine for seating dies. Bushings for neck sizers made from screw stock and treated with Kasenit are fine. I'll make a couple of bushings with 416 and try the Kasenit on them and see what results. WH