Hang Fire Problem

[greenmountainboy]

Howdy all,

I had some hang fires,or delayed firing, the round fires shortly after the firing pin strikes) today while working up a load, I couldn't find any topics that covered this in my search, so here is my setup, followed by my question.

Savage 116 Weather Warrior, 26" stainless factory barrel
300 Remington Ultra Mag
Federal nickel plated brass, once fired in this rifle
CCI Large Rifle Magnum primers hand seated with Lee tool
Berger 210gr VLD match, non-moly, seated to .040" jump to rifling using Lee collet die, no crimp
Hodgdon Retumbo powder
Weather: 31 degrees F dropping to 26F by the end, ammo and rifle at ambient temp, ~86% humidity

My only variable today is powder weight. Starting at 85.5 grains, I did 3 shot groups increasing by 1.5 grains per group up to a max today of 91.5 grains. With the 85.5gr group I had two hang fires, with the 87.0gr group I had one hang fire, and with the 88.5 group I had one hang fire. The two heavier groups,90.0, 91.5) had no noticeable hang fires. While my chronometer was working right,it stopped half way through), velocity seemed to be what it should have been. Accuracy, of course, suffered dramatically with the hang fires. My question is; why the hang fires? My only hypothesis is that the loads were simply too small for the conditions, the powder was allowed to settle to the side of the case as it lay horizontally and be lower than the flash of the primer as it came through the flash hole. I'm a rookie, so any constructive input is welcome.

 

[jamesh]

I believe you are on the right track.
For 7mm STW and larger I use only Federal 215 primers and use CCI 250 for the smaller magnums,7mm Rem mag 338 Win mag)and some standard cartridges when shooting sperical powders in cold weather with them.
You may want to try the 215s as they were developed for the larger cases like the 378 Wby. and its offspring.
James

 

[greenmountainboy]

Thanks for the input James. I have a box of Federal 215 so I will switch to those for now. Reading the CCI website would have one believe that their primers should have worked, so I dropped them an email to see what advice they could offer.

 

[Chuckhunter]

GMB, Generally hangfires come from only a few places. A primer to cool for the powder your using, the wrong firing pin protrusion or a burr on the firing pin assembly, causing the pin to hang up ocassionally. I would try the 215's, as they are a very hot primer and check out the other two options, I'm sure this problem can be eliminated. Good Luck and let us know what you find out.

 

[Spotcheck_Billy]

Another thing to check for is too much grease on the firing pin spring, etc. inside the bolt. If your problems are occuring at below freezing temps. that would be one of the first places to look.

 

[Klong]

How cold was it?? The only hang fire I have had came from improperly seated primers. They were a little short of being fully seated.

 

[greenmountainboy]

Just to be sure I will likely take apart my bolt and see how things look in there. It could be at least part of the problem. If I seated the primers wrong, I seated them too hard. Comparing CCI primers to Federal primers, the next day I did some test firing using my chrono. Even using a large charge,95.0gr) I had a complete failure to fire by one of the CCI primers. The Federal worked great, even averaging 62fps more muzzle velocity than the CCI rounds that fired. Thanks again for the input.

 

[Scrmblerkari]

Dear Greenmountainboy,
For what it's worth, I had plenty of hangfires and misfires with CCI small benchrest primers in my several .22 Hornets, and the same experience with CCI large rifle BR primers in my several Swiss 7.5x55 service rifles of varying years and models. The bolts are clean, factory military ammo works fine as do loads with other primers. i have never found a satisfactory explanation and have surmised that the primer cups are too hard. But that is only a supposition. I traded back a lot of CCI primers to my gunshop,very nice of them) and got Federal large primers and CCI pistol primers, which work great in the Hornets.
Another Green Mountain Boy now migrated to California,,motorcycle business)
Kari,kari@calmoto.com)

 

[dnirode]

GMB

In the past I experienced similar issues with several cartridges especially the large case capacity magnums while conducting load development. The large cap cases usually perform best with large quantities of slow burning powders and are designed to use full or very nearly full case capacity. The slow powders are position sensitive and need to fill the case so as to position the base of the powder column close to the heat/flame of the primer and ignite efficiently. Stay very near the top of you recommended powder charges or dangerous hang fires will likely continue.

If you are tumbling your cases after resizing also make sure the flash hole is clear of any pieces of tumbling media as I have in the past on one occasion missed several pieces in the flash hole which also caused the hang fire and also complete failures to ignite. Dave N.