General question about group size.

[Oldeadeye]

Hi everyone.
I'm new to the forum and bench rest shooting. I've been reading accurate shooter website and this forum to expand my knowledge base. I have a question about something I see quite often here. When someone says "this gun will shoot in the 1's and 2's" what do they mean?

 

[sfldiver]

I'm not a competition bench shooter (I'm an F-Class Guy), but I do shoot on the bench when practicing at the range. I'm pretty sure they're referring to .1 and .2 MOA (minute of angel) group sizing. Essentially, if shooting at 100 yards, if you measure the distance of the bullet holes furthest apart (center to center), the separation will be no more than .1" to .2" apart, at their furthest separation. That tight of group sizing is pretty close to all in the same whole.

 

[Jet]

In the 1s and 2s is referring to a rifle that will hold a .1"-.199" or .2"-.299" group (usually a 5 shot group)

 

[snert]

Anyone got a wallet group to illustrate?

Picture + 1000 words...

 

[rayjay]

Here you go

 

[Knotwild]

And, it will do it "all day long".

 

[Toby Bradshaw]

Anyone got a wallet group to illustrate?

Picture + 1000 words...

Seely Masker-smithed 6PPC cruiser. 5 shots @ 100yd. My smallest group ever -- 0.029. A .308 bullet won't fit through the hole made by 5 6mm bullets. I've also shot a couple of zeros (0.053, 0.074) in registered BR with a Jim Borden-smithed 6PPC.



Here's another from the Masker cruiser, this time 10 shots @ 300yd in competition. Guess which one is the 10th shot.



The Borden 6PPC produced this 300yd 5-shot group in practice. Now you know which was the 5th shot, although I'll take this group @ 300 (even with the 5th shot) anytime in competition.



My Stan Ware-smithed 30BR shot these 3-shot groups @ 100yd in a charge/seating depth test. Easiest rifle to tune that I've ever owned. Thanks to Al Nyhus for selling it to me!

 

[Sekora]

Wow. Tough to pick a load when they all look like that.

 

[Toby Bradshaw]

Wow. Tough to pick a load when they all look like that.

Not really, at least if you're used to tuning short-range BR rifles. You can count the bullet holes with all of the jammed loads (Wilson stem 1.737 and 1.742), so those aren't competitive. I ended up at 34.7gr H4198 and 1.750 on the Wilson stem, which is 0.002 into the lands.

 

[theMadAlaskan]

And, it will do it "all day long".

As long as he does his part.

 

[Knotwild]

As long as he does his part.

Looks like Toby has his part totally under control.

 

[mikecr]

It's tenth inches per hundred yards (IPHY)

 

[joshb]

Oh, the first step. The problem, "mentally", is when this

Becomes "not quite good enough."
5 years ago, I thought this was great

Then I started reading this forum. Learned some things about reloading. Bought a new scope and shot this at 50 yards after sight in.

I was hooked.

 

[hoz53]

Hi everyone.
I'm new to the forum and bench rest shooting. I've been reading accurate shooter website and this forum to expand my knowledge base. I have a question about something I see quite often here. When someone says "this gun will shoot in the 1's and 2's" what do they mean?

and if its not obvious that is a center ro center measurement so an example with a 6mm bullet- a group that is .343 outside to outside would be a .1 group. ( .243 +.100)

 

[dmoran]

Here's one in the 4's from 10-shots + one in the 2's from 5-shots, both at 1000yd:

​

 

[Toby Bradshaw]

Here's one in the 4's from 10-shots + one in the 2's from 5-shots, both at 1000yd:

You know you can shoot when a 1000-yard group will actually fit in a wallet without folding the target.

 

[BoydAllen]

Typically for short range centerfire benchrest groups are measured in inches and not converted to MOA. To convert to 100 yard angular equivalent 200 yard averages are halved. If your 200 yard groups actual measurements (typically five groups) averaged a half inch, the aggregate would be recorded as .2500. Groups are measured with a special tool that uses a plexiglass template mounted to a caliper. They are measured to .001 and aggs are rounded to the nearest .0001.

 

[butchlambert]

A decent 200 yard shot group shot in competition.

This is the World Record 200yd. 5shot group

A great hunting rifle group

 

[mikecr]

and if its not obvious that is a center ro center measurement so an example with a 6mm bullet- a group that is .343 outside to outside would be a .1 group. ( .243 +.100)

Well, another thing obvious is that 24cal bullet holes rarely measure .243".
How groups are measured/recorded at matches could be different than obvious though

 

[hoz53]

Well, another thing obvious is that 24cal bullet holes rarely measure .243".
How groups are measured/recorded at matches could be different than obvious though

Well if a shooter is on bad terms with somebody in the stat shack mabie it is obvious how their groups are scored