Forming 30 Newton

[cowboybart]

What am I doing wrong??







I am trying to form 30 Newton from 375 Ruger. The cases are once fired and annealed. I do have some 375 Ruger basic brass, but wanted to get the kinks worked out first.

 

[spclark]

Try not annealing cases being formed. If you soften the shoulders they'll tend to fold like your pics show.

Also, slow that ram down a LOT on your press! Brass'll move but go too fast & it'll fold.

What are you using for lube? If Imperial you need Very Little Whatsoever to do the job. I prefer the RCBS liquid stuff, comes in a bottle. Again, use as little as you possibly can.

 

[SheepDog]

Those "folds" and "dimples" show that you are using too much lube. The lube from the neck and shoulder gets captured between the case/shoulder junction and has no place to go so it dents the shoulder. Try running one case in using no lube when you get dents. See if they size without excessive force or if they still dent.
A little lube goes a long way.

 

[swd]

Too much lube. How many sizing steps are you doing? I would think you need 3 steps from 375 to 30.

 

[mac86951]

In my experience 7.62x39 to 6.5 grendel, I have found that the imperial I'm adding to the body quickly gets into the shoulder when firming cases. Very little on the body; and I've moved to dry graphite for necks. No lube directly applied to the shoulders.

I then form first with excessive headspace, clean relube and bump shoulders on a second pass.

I know it's more work; but I've gone from 20% loss during forming, to near zero loss. My old method for reference was to have the die set up for FL sizing and shoulder bump as if once fired Grendel brass; then simply run 7.62 into it. Shoulder folds like yours and general case body crush were my main losses.

Hope this helps,
-Mac

 

[snert]

Clean your die with some bore solvent like Hoppes, brush it out with a bronze brush, dry it out with a clean rag. Use just enough Imperial on your thumb and forefinger to make them slide when rubbing together, spin the case between your finger and thumb from about 1/2 way down to the base. use a qtip with just a little Imperial INSIDE the neck, get NONE on the outside of neck and shoulder. SLOWLY start the brass in. STOP as soon as it starts to tighten up. Pull it out, using same finger and thumb and no more lube, add another twist of lube on the case, repeat slowly putting case up in die with ram. Repeat slowly until you have a sized case. Repeat same with each form die. This will begin to season the die (getting it properly lubed after you have cleaned it out). continue doing same to each brass, go slow. IF you get that denting, start over with a clean die. Those dents are caused by lube on the shoulder area in the die, or on the outside of the neck moving down to the shoulder. with no where to go, it causes the brass to dent.

Agree with SWD on number of steps.

 

[cowboybart]

OK. I was lubing the wrong area. I was lubing the neck and body with RCBS, Lee or Prosness Warren lube.
I'll start with a clean die and lube only half way up the case.
I am doing most of it in 1 pass/step. I have no form dies and the first pass goes thru the seater die. Second pass is the FL die. Other than possibly a 325 WSM die what other dies could I use as an intermediate step (348 Win???).

snert - thanks for the step by step. That spells it out pretty good.

 

[mtnman31]

I have done the same conversion (.375 basic to .30 Newton) using only my standard .30 Newton resizing die. What worked for me: I started with new brass, annealed, then formed using a small amount of sizing wax on the entire case. Important - remove the decapping rod until the last pass. I used about 5-6 passes, (you could probably get it done with 2-3 on the already formed .375 cases). Until the shoulder is formed, each pass should only form about 1/8 - 1/4" of the case. After each pass, I rotated the case in the shell holder 1/4 to 1/2 turn. I also pulled it out after the 3rd or 4th pass and redistributed the case lube with my fingers. This keeps the lube from building up on the shoulder as it forms. It is a slow process, but the .375 brass isn't cheap and not easy to come by. Your cases are starting to form folds which comes from trying to force the brass in the single pass. You could try and fire form them to remove the folds. They aren't completely folded (2nd and 3rd photos) and the dents may iron out. Once the fold is more fully formed (like in first photo), you aren't getting rid of it.

Anneal, use a small amount of lube, and use multiple passes.

What are you shooting it in? I've got two .30 Newtons, neither are original. One is still under construction, I got it as a barreled action (commercial Mauser with tapered octagonal barrel) at a gunshow for 75$. I've got most of what I need. I have a stock but need to finish inletting it. I also need to finish ream the chamber. It will be great if I ever get it finished.

 

[cowboybart]

Mine is an Encore barrel

 

[mtnman31]

An Encore, where did you get it? I assume it was custom made. If so, who made it? I've looked off and on for one in .30 Newton and also .256 Newton.

 

[cowboybart]

I bought a 30-06 barrel and had it reamed to the Newton by Diablo Rifles in Laramie, WY.
If you want to go that route, let me know. I have a new 28" ProHunter barrel in 308 Marlin that I originally bought for this project. After toiling over it I went with a 26" heavy rather than the 28" fluted ProHunter. I want to sell the 308 Marlin barrel or else I will be forced to do a 30-06 AI on it