Fireforming dasher brass with CFE 223?

[AndrewS]

So with fireforming 6mm Dasher from Lapua 6BR, can I use CFE 223? Has anyone done it? I will be jamming to FF. Would I use the start load data for my bullet weight and powder using 6BR Rem info on Hodgdon website?. Would that be ok? I want to use this powder because I have a lot of it! And unfortunately a really small amount of Varget that I want to use when I get that baby really cooking! Thank you in advance.

 

[walker2713]

You may want to work your way up some from Hodgdon's starting point....I've used CFE223 with the 6BR...accuracy was good, but velocity was definitely on the low side.

It should work OK for fire forming just fine....what do you have to lose by trying?

 

[dkhunt14]

I don't know where that powder falls in burn rate. I like powders like Varget or faster. I believe when it is faster it forms the case better. More pressure in the case. Matt

 

[Sheldon N]

Might look at fireforming with H4895. It's pretty easy to find, is a step faster than Varget, and has a good reputation for accuracy/temp sensitivity. That's what I'll be doing to conserve my Varget. Only need 1lb of H4895 to fireform over 200 cases.

 

[shoot4fun]

I've done it using lighter weight bullets (70-87). It works fine and I used max charges from Hodgdon website. IIRC, CFE223 is in the Varget burn rate zone but just a tad slower maybe.

 

[dkhunt14]

I also like the heavier bullets to Fireform. I put them in the lands. The longer bullet gives you more bearing and grip in the case. It raises pressure and forms them better. I like the cases fully formed so I can shoot them in a match. I use 30 grains of Varget with a stepped shoulder and in the lands hard. That way I have to bump the shoulder when I size. Matt

 

[Clavius-Walker]

Some people will disagree but I prefer the initial fireforming to be done with shotgun powder and cream of wheat, I've never seen a reason to waste 50-100 rounds of barrel life to blow out shoulders.

Some may argue that it still causes throat erosion but I have shotguns with over 100k shells through them and have yet to see a firecracked throat.

 

[AndrewS]

Wow, thank you all for chiming in to help! I think I will go with the 107 SMK jammed hard. CFE 223 working up to max charge for 6BR.

 

[Shaggy357]

There is data on the Hodgdon web site. Pick your bullet, use a standard 6BR load, and ensure you have a bullet jambing the lands or a false shoulder to keep the brass from moving. I always make the false shoulder to CONFIRM that brass doesn't move and blows out properly.

 

[upSLIDEdown]

To piggyback in here before starting to similar thread, anybody used BLC2 for fireforming? It's really close to varget on the chart, and I have a pound just sitting that I've never used. Figured it would save me from using up my varget for fireforming.

Also, anybody use a regular FL die when making false shoulders? As opposed to a bushing die. I'm planning on using a Forster FL die for my dasher. Never been a huge fan of bushing dies. Thoughts?

 

[dkhunt14]

A full length non bushing die will size the whole neck. It will not work with the false shoulder. You have to adjust the amount of sizing so bolt shuts with slight resistance. Matt

 

[LRPV]

A full length non bushing die will size the whole neck. It will not work with the false shoulder. You have to adjust the amount of sizing so bolt shuts with slight resistance. Matt

You just have to raise the die up to where it needs to size the neck.

 

[dkhunt14]

You just have to raise the die up to where it needs to size the neck.

That makes sense. I guess I don't see why anybody would buy a die without a bushing. I like to control tension and length of size on neck. It can be a definate tuning advantage. Matt

 

[LRPV]

That makes sense. I guess I don't see why anybody would buy a die without a bushing. I like to control tension and length of size on neck. It can be a definate tuning advantage. Matt

When I first started, I shot a Savage in 6BR and had a Forster FL die honed to what I needed for it. I ended up getting a Harrell's for it and sold it with the rifle and kept the Forster. I've used it to false shoulder Dashers is the only reason I said anything.

 

[AndrewS]

Well I found this out while testing... I started my testing at 28g of CFE 223. Extremely flat. So I took it down by .5 until I found out 25g was not too bad. I had mildly flat primers at 25g of CFE 223 with 105g Nosler custom comp, Lapua brass and winchester small rifle primer. But that would still leave the neck/shoulder junction line from the 6BR on the shoulder of my fire formed case. I do not think this is going to work well as a fire form powder for my gun.

 

[okbow87]

Are you using a false shoulder or just jamming bullets? Also did you have sticky bolt lift or measure the bases for excessive growth?

I've fire formed several different rounds and never had a load 2 grains less than max for the parent cartridge cause pressure issues while forming. I always use a false shoulder or a case that has a crush fit. I'm betting your flat primers are from the case being pushed forward by the firing pin and and then the case pushing back into the bolt face.

 

[IdahoSharpshooter]

I see the Dasher as a long term project, for me at least; in terms of rebarreling when the time comes. To that end, I purchased a worn-out ( for BR usage) barrel in 6PPC. I am going to have my own reamer made as well. My gunsmith will just rechamber the old PPC, and that will provide me with a fire-forming barrel to avoid wear on the new Bartlein, and others when the time comes.

 

[Longtrain]

Some people will disagree but I prefer the initial fireforming to be done with shotgun powder and cream of wheat, I've never seen a reason to waste 50-100 rounds of barrel life to blow out shoulders.

With my Dasher, I used the false shoulder method with good results. I used the loads for 300 yd. Mid-Range prone matches with 6BR loads. That being said, I did use the COW method for my 223AI, fire formed 200 cases in about an hour's time, running a patch every 10 rounds. I used Bullseye and grits with a TP wad over the powder and grits. I would use the COW for the next batch of Dasher cases, time being the biggest factor for me. Had to shoot 3 matches to get enough cases on the same level. COW, done in an hour.

 

[tonysnoo]

Has anyone tested CFE for actual use in a Dasher, BRX? We use it in our 6 Fat rats(grinch, etc) for best brass life and speed. I was hoping that it would show promise with the improved BR.