Faulty press & SD/ES
- Thread starter Chiquita
- Start date
I’ll bite… es/sd is an indication of variations in muzzle velocity. What can have an effect on velocity if all other things are equal- case volume (inconsistent sizing) and seating depth (that also influences the case volume). Let’s add neck tension as well. In my opinion, these things would be more influenced by your case prep and dies than a press
Last edited:
Dusty Stevens
Shiner
A press only lets your dies do their work
Liven The Dream
Gold $$ Contributor
2 bite You set the Die up Wrong , screwed up the brass = Bad Ammo Possible Some with high pressure ??
Your only as good as the tools we miss use.
Your only as good as the tools we miss use.
topclass2017
Gold $$ Contributor
when I was shooting 2700's years back and loading +/- 300 rounds of .45acp per week, I switched from a single stage to a progressive press in the name of volume. I found that my scoring eroded which I attributed to too many processes happening at once, and my lessened ability to consistently control quality. I reverted back to my single stage, doing one function at a time and noticed my scores improved.
So while this experience was with pistol caliber handloading, it does speak to the post #4 - "Consistency in components and bras prep" as a key to low numbers.
So while this experience was with pistol caliber handloading, it does speak to the post #4 - "Consistency in components and bras prep" as a key to low numbers.
dellet
Gold $$ Contributor
About the only thing you could watch for in your press would be an inconsistent clearance between the bottom of the die and the shell holder. If you had a force indicator or pressure pad, you would have a way of checking if the press itself was not consistent.
In consistent sizing, is often more of a die of brass issue. Variable brass hardness, might show up as inconsistent length measurements, base to shoulder.
I shoot a lot of low pressure loads and straight taper cartridges. Often there is not enough pressure to truly fireform the case to the chamber without multiple shots. Without a custom die, I get a variation in case capacity because each case comes out of the chamber a bit different, they are sized a bit different. The die only sizes where it touches.
So the problem is not so much the press doing anything wrong, it’s a combination of other variables. The brass needs to completely (or nearly) fill the die cavity when sizing, and respond to the pressure applied the same.
All the press does is squeeze the case, it can’t adjust to the pressure difference needed to form soft vs hard brass or a silly comparison a steel case. It will apply the same pressure. If you want the same results every time, put in the same case every time.
Use a die that has the same shape or taper angles as your chamber. This is probably the most common place for error and why custom dies make a difference.
In consistent sizing, is often more of a die of brass issue. Variable brass hardness, might show up as inconsistent length measurements, base to shoulder.
I shoot a lot of low pressure loads and straight taper cartridges. Often there is not enough pressure to truly fireform the case to the chamber without multiple shots. Without a custom die, I get a variation in case capacity because each case comes out of the chamber a bit different, they are sized a bit different. The die only sizes where it touches.
So the problem is not so much the press doing anything wrong, it’s a combination of other variables. The brass needs to completely (or nearly) fill the die cavity when sizing, and respond to the pressure applied the same.
All the press does is squeeze the case, it can’t adjust to the pressure difference needed to form soft vs hard brass or a silly comparison a steel case. It will apply the same pressure. If you want the same results every time, put in the same case every time.
Use a die that has the same shape or taper angles as your chamber. This is probably the most common place for error and why custom dies make a difference.
"How would a bad press have an effect on the quality of reloads that in turn will affect the SD/ES?"
Please define "bad press". Was it dropped, beat on with a hammer? I've been reloading over 50 years and I don't think I've ever had a "bad press."
Please define "bad press". Was it dropped, beat on with a hammer? I've been reloading over 50 years and I don't think I've ever had a "bad press."
Just a thought, but bad dies are more common than bad presses. Some presses might flex more than others.......
I assume the SD/ES you're referring to is with regards to velocity. Therefore, I'd say the press have little to nothing to do with it as that's more about the accuracy of your powder loads and brass prep. Single stage presses tend to give you much more control over this, so I'd say progressive presses that are filling cases with powder will tend to give you poorer results than charging the cases individually by hand. In just comparing single stage presses, I don't think you'll find any significant difference. Though, there can be a difference in what's seen on paper (SD's and ES's for size of groups) due to runout differences associated with how well a press applies a case to the die.
If you haven't seen the video or read the article from Ultimate Reloader, you might find this of interest:
Fourteen Reloading Presses Compared: Single-Stage Shootout – Ultimate Reloader
ultimatereloader.com
Thank you all for your replies.
If the press has no or very little effect on the quality of hand load and or any effect on the ES/SD, then would it be fair to say higher dollar press is not worth the investment?
I was thinking of getting a Redding T-7 to replace the Hornady single stage LNL press. But sounds like "may" be OK with what I have. The Hornady LNL is the only pressed I have owned ever since I started about 3 years ago.
If the press has no or very little effect on the quality of hand load and or any effect on the ES/SD, then would it be fair to say higher dollar press is not worth the investment?
I was thinking of getting a Redding T-7 to replace the Hornady single stage LNL press. But sounds like "may" be OK with what I have. The Hornady LNL is the only pressed I have owned ever since I started about 3 years ago.
I think of it in terms like a hammer. A cheap one drives a nail just as well as an expensive one. The value you place on them doesn't have a lot to do with how well they can drive a nail.
Well said.I think of it in terms like a hammer. A cheap one drives a nail just as well as an expensive one. The value you place on them doesn't have a lot to do with how well they can drive a nail.
Dusty Stevens
Shiner
Youll appreciate getting away from the lnl bushings is my main thing
An it never hurts to give your press a teardown and clean and lube as you re-assemble it. Grit from primer residue will do harm to a press.
Frank
Frank
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