Expander mandrel help

[Jeff Von Rosenberg]

When running my brass over an expander mandrel , it never feels smooth. I have tried graphite in the neck, imperial, different lubes but it always seems more difficult that it should. I run my brass over a mandrel as last step before seating to try to get consistent neck pressure.

 

[DennisH]

What caliper?

I use a Sinclair and it's slick as glass with every bullet I use.

 

[Jeff Von Rosenberg]

Every caliber I have 30,6,6.5,338.224i have K&m and 21st century

 

[jonbearman]

How many times fired is your brass?

 

[Jeff Von Rosenberg]

New up to 5 times.

 

[Clod-NC]

Hi Jvon,hi all
Jvon,I'm no expert,but according to what you say and what I experiment myself after 3 reloads,I would say we are ripe for annealing my friend....I'm a bit embarassed with this because I don't know how to address this situation very precisely and satisfactorily,but I know I can ask for a little help from my friends here.I have a few ideas I'll give a go to and check...Get ready for the same move.Good luck,and give feed back.

 

[DennisH]

Follow Up: I neck up brass pretty regular and for a few friends. I use Imperial or Hornady die wax. I use a Q-Tip to put a little inside the necks and of course a fine coat on the outside.

Maintaining the necks after firing usually requires no lube inside the necks, but if it's tight, I will lube the insides and clean after the process.

JMO, Dennis

 

[LIUNA]

This procedure you describe is how I determine when I determine its time to anneal, or when I may need to re-anneal a cartridge that for what ever reason did not take.

 

[Bowhunter4]

I agree with Jvon definitely get your self a 21 century expanter mandril. A lot of us anneal every shot to maintain proper neck tension. sounds like you use the same wax as everyone else.

 

[Shynloco]

JVON,
Not sure if this is the cure, but I always champfer the insides of the casing mouth and use a VLD deep angle tool cleaning for smooth entry of the casing into the Sinclair Expander die. It may be that the insides of the mouths aren't smoothed out enough and just need a little TLC and deburring. The tool you may use for expanding is irrelevant to me.

Alex

 

[mikecr]

running my brass over an expander mandrel , it never feels smooth

What specific mandrel?

Proper & consistent neck tension is not really achieved with frequent annealing. In fact, it's just the opposite. And annealing will only make matters worse here by causing more difficult expansion.
Nor should you ever have to, or want to, lube inside necks that hold normal carbon film(a good reason to avoid over-cleaning inside necks). But carbon is tough on a soft mandrel.

You're either over sizing necks, over-cleaning necks, or running a relatively soft expander.

 

[lpreddick]

you may be doing this. if not, clean powder residue from inside the neck. polish the expander with flitz and 4-0 steel wool. lube neck inside and and mandrel should slide like hot knife thru butter...after a few there might be slightly increased resistance.

 

[jlow]

You could be experiencing the dreaded donut.

 

[CatShooter]

Well JVON...

Let's see. We have:

1 - You must anneal.
2 - Don't anneal, cuz that will make it worse.
3 - Remove the carbon and polish.
4 - Don't remove the carbon.
5 - Keep the inside of the neck dry.
6 - Keep the inside of the neck lubed.
7 - Your (steel) mandrel is too soft (What??) At least no one said that the mandrel was too hard!
8 - And lets not forget - the dreaded Donut. We can always blame everything on the dreaded donut. (we all knew that it was Dunkin's fault anyway).

JVON, I do not envy your choices - it's like standing at the reception room at the Mustang Ranch and trying to choose

This is a bad joke!!

 

[Eddie Harren]

+1 on the bad joke.

 

[bigedp51]

+1 on the bad joke.

- 1, your funny bone needs re-calibrated, it was funny.

 

[jlow]

It’s funny but less so for the OP!

OP, you are getting conflicting advice but it is the nature of the beast. The reason is there is not enough information to get one correct answer, so people are guessing. Guessing is not bad because IMHO, it gives you ideas in terms of what to look for and looking for it yourself is how you really get answers. To continue on that, have you actually looked into your necks to see what is in there that gives you that less than smooth feeling?

 

[Eddie Harren]

I will issue a strong warning against questioning anything that Catshooter posts. He is truly one of the Certified experts on this board.

 

[Webster]

I was using a very light viscosity synthetic oil on my K&M expander mandril. I needed a huge amount of force to get the mandril into the case. I switched to a 10W-30 motor oil and the problem was solved. The higher the viscosity the thicker the oil film (less metal to metal contact). The only problem is removing the oil from the case neck.

 

[jlow]

I will issue a strong warning against questioning anything that Catshooter posts. He is truly one of the Certified experts on this board.

Expert or not, the fact is donuts do exist and I have encountered it in exactly that situation. It is not always the culpit, but it should not be dismissed as a cause unless you know for sure it is not there.