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Ever wondered if Wind Flags help?

P1ZombieKiller

Silver $$ Contributor
Guys,
I have been revamping my web site, and decided to start writing some observations. These are my own words and are my experiences. I understand that others have different opinions, and you are more than welcomed to post them here if you like. The write up below is found on my webpage located at the link below.
http://p1zk.com/Wind_Flags.php

I hope you enjoy reading it as much as I enjoyed writing it.

To be great at Benchrest shooting, you most certainly need an exceptional rifle, a good rest setup, and of course a great bullet/powder combination. Even if you have the perfect combination of all of that, there is still one more item you will need to even begin to compete seriously. You need a good set of wind flags. This is usually the difference maker. Missing a wind condition usually takes you completely out of contention of any match no matter what format you are shooting. If you are shooting score, it can cause you to hit the 9 ring instead of the 10 ring. If you are shooting group, it can cause that one shot to fly out, and take that .150 group to a .750 group. You need to be able to read the wind in many different combinations because in Benchrest, you usually have a restricted amount of time to shoot your shots.

Since you cannot actually see the wind, Benchrest shooters use wind flags to aid them in reading the direction and speed of the wind. There are many different styles and types of wind flags. One of the simplest forms of a wind flag is a wooden stake hammered in the ground with surveyors tape stapled to the top. The most conventional style wind flags are those that are placed on a rotating pivot that has colored vanes on each side so you can easily distinguish which way the wind is blowing. This pivoting system must be very sensitive to air movement. Just the slightest movement of air and the flag must pivot in that direction. In order to do this, the flag must be perfectly balanced. There also must be a “vane” on one side of the pivot that acts as the wind catcher. These vanes can be made out of almost any material. Some use sheet metal, cardboard or even polycarbonate board.

Whatever material you use, it must be counter balanced with a weight on the other side of the pivot. Weighting systems can vary as much as the style of windflags themselves. Weighting systems can be as simple as lead weight, poly coated lead weight, or even a daisy wheel. The daisy wheel can also serve as a type of speedometer for the wind. If you paint one of the pedals of the daisy a different color, you can easily see it turn round and round thus gauging the speed of the wind at that moment.

Of the conventional style windflags, there are single vane and double vane flags. I prefer the double vane flags that not only have different colors on the outside of each vane, but have black and white stripes on the inside. Seeing the number of stripes on the inside of the vane allows me to see the angle the windflag is pointing much better than a single vane flag. When you are shooting over 4-5 flags, you have to be able to process what each flag is doing and combine that information into when you should pull the trigger. This can be simplified by saying you have to be able to wait till your flags line up where you want them, and then be able to pull the trigger at that exact moment.

It’s not always easy to “wait till they line up” when you are shooting. Most of the time the wind does not blow in a single direction, it swirls. Your wind flags are designed to tell you exactly that. If you look at the picture posted below, you will see that my closest flag (let’s call this flag #1) shows a slight breeze blowing in from 12:00. Looking at flag #2, it indicates that the wind is coming in at about the same speed from the 10:00 direction. If these were the only two flags you had out, you would assume that the shot will move very slightly up and to the right. However, look at flag #3. It is facing the totally opposite direction. While the speed may not be as strong as the others (look at the tails) it is still coming in from the 4:00 position. We top this off with looking at the last flag. The last flag is again coming in from the 12:00 position but with much more velocity as the others. With the flags in this setting, this is an example of when you SHOULD NOT shoot unless you know this condition and the results it can take on your bullet.

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This next target is an example of what just a little change of the wind can do to a bullet. This is a 200 yard target I was shooting. I purposely shot 4 shots with a left to right wind (orange flag). I then waited till I had the flags lined up right to left (green flag). As you can see by the pics above, the wind was not blowing hard (I estimate it to be a 3-5 mph gust), but it was just enough to push my bullet a full bullet hole the wrong direction. One thing to remember is that an orange wind was blowing it a full bullet left, and a green flag will be pushing it a full bullet right. This is actually a 2 bullet difference on the paper. This is why it is so important to know and understand what the wind can do to a bullet, and to pay attention to which wind condition is the most prevalent and to shoot with that condition as it will be the most of what you see.

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Below is a picture from the vantage point of the shooter during a match (courtesy of Conley Bullets). As you look down range, you can see that each shooter has his flags set up between him and the target at which he is shooting. The shooter places his windflags in a straight line between his bench (where his rifles sits) and the exact location that his target is. There are certain rules about the placement of windflags, and each association has different rules, but the basic gist is that the flags need to be in a straight line from your bench to the target frame, and cannot be above the height of the bench top. Just as the pic above shows you the difference between my flags 1-4, this picture can show you the difference in wind from bench 1-4. Each bench will have a little different result from wind than the next. Not only does wind vary between you and the target, it varies between the bench you are on, and one 7 places over.

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As you can see from the pic above, most shooters prefer the single vane flags. There are all sorts of colors, designs, and styles of wind flags. One of the advantages the single vane flags have over the double vane flags is the time is takes to assemble the flag itself before each match. The David Halblom double vane flags have a cross bracing design that creates a strong skeleton that is perfectly balanced. Each flag has stainless steel bolts that attach the vanes to the skeleton as well as a pivoting point built into the skeleton. This pivoting point is crucial to the balance of the flag. If this point is not is the correct place, the flag will always lean to one side, and thus not react to the wind correctly.

Since the double vane flag has such a complicated design, I prefer to leave them assembled and transport them this way. Because the size of the flags while assembled takes up so much room, I had to build a box that would hold all 6 of my flags. This box not only needed to hold the assembled flags, but I wanted all of the other items associated with my flags to be in this box also. I designed it so that the stands and stakes would have a walled off section, and the counter weights could be stored securely in their own section. The skeleton braces would need to be placed on a mount so that the weight of the flag would rest on the brace, and not on the vanes itself. I took 1x2 pieces of redwood, and made a small slot for the brace to ride in. I placed those mounts in a row that would allow the vanes to stagger each other so that they could be contained in a smaller space. The box is built out of 3/4" plywood. It is approx 22" in height, 29" in length, and 18" in width. I designed the top to have 2" foam glued into the top so that when the lid closed, the vanes would actually indent approximately 1/2" into the foam in the lid. The foam secures the flags in place and keeps them from rubbing against each other and scratching them.

To see more pics of the box, click this link. http://p1zk.com/Wind_Flags.php


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What do wind flags really do?

Very good article on wind flags, i have a question what if you are new to bench rest shooting and can't afford a set of wind flags at this time would it be a no no to use another shooters flags to see the wind as there are right next to your shooting lane???
 
nfhjr62 said:
Very good article on wind flags, i have a question what if you are new to bench rest shooting and can't afford a set of wind flags at this time would it be a no no to use another shooters flags to see the wind as there are right next to your shooting lane???

GREAT Question. I can only answer from a short range Benchrest point of view. I would say you most certainly can however there are some things to consider. I place my flags in a way that I can always see the last 2 flags in my scope (this is why I use a 36x scope and not a 45x scope so I have a bigger field of view). This requires me to have my flags in a straight line in front of my target. In order to shoot looking at your neighbor’s flags, you will either have to watch the flags and then move to your gun and look through the scope, and then pull the trigger, or you will need to shoot heads up. Shooting heads up is sort of explained like this. You set your scope right where you want it for a certain condition, then when the flags line up in that condition, you pull the trigger. This is an example of a shooter shooting heads up. You can see the shooter with his "HEAD UP" waiting for the wind to line up exactly where he wants it to be, and then he will pull the trigger.

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If you shoot with both eyes open (I shoot right handed ) I can see the flags to the left of me with my left eye or my closer flags since i started useing flags give it a try.
Mark
 
Wes, I'll again be keeping my eyes on the shooter flags next to me at this Sunday's WTSA 200yd VFS match as my Rick Graham flags still haven't arrived. In fairness to Rick I was informed that he was backlogged when I placed and pre-paid the order in March. Hoping that I'll have them before our next 100yd shoot. After dropping two points on the same target in the 200yd portion of our last shoot I fully understand what shooting during the start of a wind shift will cost you and the importance of not just watching the vanes but also the tails. As you and Curtis pointing out that when the tail drops a shift is coming. I appreciate that you informed me that I sent both shots down range at the worst possible time. I know it's a leaning experience but by nature I'm getting impatient to shoot clean in my next 100yd shoot which will be my 4th attempt. I must omit that dropping that one point on the 5th target of the 100yd portion of our last shoot was a bummer. I do appreciate your help.

RJ
 
I believe they are as important as any other part of the equation you mentioned.Learning how to read them is another and learning how to hold when they are not aligned is trigger time. My biggest confusion exists when shooting 1000yds and there are no flags within 8ft of the bullets flight and guys shoot 4"to 6" groups and just hours later those same rifles cannot produce groups of the same. I realize that every range has its own personality and once learned it is an asset.Experience is huge in shooting circles and trigger time is the most important teacher.Without wind flags at any distance to me is a waste of components and time and one cannot believe in the potential of his or her equipment without them.Just me thinking.
 
Even if you have your own flags you need to make it a habit to regularly look at all the flags out there. This lets you see patterns and condition changes before they get to your lane.
 
Great Post Zombie Guy... (busy today taking out zombies since the world is ending?)

Seriously good write up, good pics to illustrate the point and love them "FLYING FISH" Wind Flags! Dave H is a great guy on top of that..

Thanks for taking the time to do it..

Rod in Fargo..
 
Nodak7mm said:
Great Post Zombie Guy... (busy today taking out zombies since the world is ending?)

Seriously good write up, good pics to illustrate the point and love them "FLYING FISH" Wind Flags! Dave H is a great guy on top of that..

Thanks for taking the time to do it..

Rod in Fargo..

Only a couple hours left. Have... to... shoot.... Zombies....
 
Good article that makes a solid case. Not to seem overly picky, but I suggest replacing "jest" in your seventh paragraph with "gist".
 
Well, those Conley Bullets and those Flying Fish wind flags really did the trick for me this past weekend. I shot a few really nice groups, but I shot one really REALLY nice group. The smallest so far I have ever shot.

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Nice shooting, Wes. I shoot High Power competitively and can only use the range flags during matches. But, when doing load development or practicing, I always shoot over my Rick Graham flags. I need all the help I can get. ;)
 
Wes,
I don't know how I missed it when it came out, but great read I really enjoyed it. I shoot 1k and reading the wind is difficult enough at short distances but at 1k there even more difficult. We have wind flags out but usually through the scope your lucky to be able to see one or maybe two flags and with your left eye usually the one right in front of you, I think this match coming up in August I will find out what bench I am on and the night before the match set them out and see if I can do a better job getting them lined up. Thanks again for the p.m and a great read ;)
Wayne.
 
I would like to, but I'm not sure I can. It's only a 5 hour drive, but not sure I can get all my stuff around here done in time to get a hall pass. :P
 

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