ES is 35-55 fps, 6.5x47 Lapua....UPDATE Pg 2
- Thread starter FN in MT
- Start date
searcher
Gold $$ Contributor
Re: ES is 35-55 fps, 6.5x47 Lapua....HELP!
You mentioned you were "around" .005" to .010" into the lands. If you were off a bit on your measurement - and not measuring your loaded cartridges from base to ogive - it could be the source of part or all of the problem.
I have run into this when jambing "shallow" as in .003". Random bullet differences (if not previously sorted) will allow some to be .005" deep and some perhaps barely touching. This variance allows pressures to be different enough to cause exactly what you describe with your E.S.'s.
To eliminate this as a possibility:
1) Re-measure your loaded cartridge "jamb length' to ensure you had the proper measurement for jamb.
2) Either back off at least .005" from jamb or jamb OVER .005" (.008" is my minimum when not measuring base to ogive - and depending upon bullet)
This just ensures you are either off the jamb on all shots or jambed fairly solid on all shots. If this was the problem, you will know it. If you thought all your shots were jambed .005" and one was barely touching, this would cause it for sure. I've been there more than once. If you found that you had better E.S. numbers on your .010" jamb over the .005" jamb - this may reinforce the possiblity that this could be something to look at. Never hurts. As for your neck size bushing - you should be O.K. with what you are using. Less is typically best - but not enough to cause the spreads you describe - at least from what I have encountered. I get far lower E.S.'es in semi-autos with crimped bullets. My next move would be a powder or primer change along the lines of "Shootsdots" POST.
You mentioned you were "around" .005" to .010" into the lands. If you were off a bit on your measurement - and not measuring your loaded cartridges from base to ogive - it could be the source of part or all of the problem.
I have run into this when jambing "shallow" as in .003". Random bullet differences (if not previously sorted) will allow some to be .005" deep and some perhaps barely touching. This variance allows pressures to be different enough to cause exactly what you describe with your E.S.'s.
To eliminate this as a possibility:
1) Re-measure your loaded cartridge "jamb length' to ensure you had the proper measurement for jamb.
2) Either back off at least .005" from jamb or jamb OVER .005" (.008" is my minimum when not measuring base to ogive - and depending upon bullet)
This just ensures you are either off the jamb on all shots or jambed fairly solid on all shots. If this was the problem, you will know it. If you thought all your shots were jambed .005" and one was barely touching, this would cause it for sure. I've been there more than once. If you found that you had better E.S. numbers on your .010" jamb over the .005" jamb - this may reinforce the possiblity that this could be something to look at. Never hurts. As for your neck size bushing - you should be O.K. with what you are using. Less is typically best - but not enough to cause the spreads you describe - at least from what I have encountered. I get far lower E.S.'es in semi-autos with crimped bullets. My next move would be a powder or primer change along the lines of "Shootsdots" POST.
Re: ES is 35-55 fps, 6.5x47 Lapua....HELP!
UPDATE.....
The weather finally cooperated a bit today and allowed a short but fruitful couple of hours at the bench. My previous few Range session while fighting the wind and the low temps suffered from an array of errors that I remedied today.
#1....My Sinclair 6.5mm pilot/spud/adapter or whatever it's called arrived. Allowing me to FAR more accurately measure my seating depth.
Set my depth at .010" into the lands and feel confident it's an accurate measurement.
#2.......I also had a slight issue with my Oehler that was 100% my fault as I simply don't use it very often. Read the manual and found out that those asterisks to the right of the readings were denoting an ERROR. When the wind blew the screens over last week (twice) the rear screen got moved about 1/2" or more. With that fixed my readings were FAR more accurate and ES's down to 5 fps. THAT issue is so embarrassing I wasn't even going to post it.
#3....... I had been using my ATLAS bipod as that is what I will use in the field. I've used it before on my .308 and with some preload it gives me about the same groups as I can shoot from a standard front rest. I'd refinished my bench top this past fall and the paint is slipperier than the previous finish. My "load" on the bipod was erratic. Probably why I was getting the flyers. So today I used my Sinclair front rest.
Today I shot a few of the Varget loads and they yielded nice round groups but nothing stellar; .704" , .684" and .561".
Then I switched over to the H-4350 loads and as I worked up from 39.0 grains with the 130 VLD's my groups got smaller and rounder.
My final group was 41.0 of H-4350, CCI450 , at .010" jammed and I got a nice round group at .252" and 2882 fps with an ES of 6 fps.
Any thoughts on where I should go from here? Is nearly 2900 fps decent with a 28" tube and the 130's ?
Where should I go with my Jam? In or OUT and in what increment?
Appreciate the help Gentleman.
FN in MT
UPDATE.....
The weather finally cooperated a bit today and allowed a short but fruitful couple of hours at the bench. My previous few Range session while fighting the wind and the low temps suffered from an array of errors that I remedied today.
#1....My Sinclair 6.5mm pilot/spud/adapter or whatever it's called arrived. Allowing me to FAR more accurately measure my seating depth.
Set my depth at .010" into the lands and feel confident it's an accurate measurement.
#2.......I also had a slight issue with my Oehler that was 100% my fault as I simply don't use it very often. Read the manual and found out that those asterisks to the right of the readings were denoting an ERROR. When the wind blew the screens over last week (twice) the rear screen got moved about 1/2" or more. With that fixed my readings were FAR more accurate and ES's down to 5 fps. THAT issue is so embarrassing I wasn't even going to post it.
#3....... I had been using my ATLAS bipod as that is what I will use in the field. I've used it before on my .308 and with some preload it gives me about the same groups as I can shoot from a standard front rest. I'd refinished my bench top this past fall and the paint is slipperier than the previous finish. My "load" on the bipod was erratic. Probably why I was getting the flyers. So today I used my Sinclair front rest.
Today I shot a few of the Varget loads and they yielded nice round groups but nothing stellar; .704" , .684" and .561".
Then I switched over to the H-4350 loads and as I worked up from 39.0 grains with the 130 VLD's my groups got smaller and rounder.
My final group was 41.0 of H-4350, CCI450 , at .010" jammed and I got a nice round group at .252" and 2882 fps with an ES of 6 fps.
Any thoughts on where I should go from here? Is nearly 2900 fps decent with a 28" tube and the 130's ?
Where should I go with my Jam? In or OUT and in what increment?
Appreciate the help Gentleman.
FN in MT
If you want more velocity, I'd try RL-15 and RL-17. I get well over 3Kfps in my 30 inch KREIGER barrel with 130g JLK's. I'd say you're getting all you can get with a single base powder, if you want more velocity try a double base like the Reloader powders. They have set several records here, and if I remember correctly there have been some records posted here as well.
I have tested more powders than I should have with this caliber. You are right in the good place with your H4350 and Berger 130 VLD. No one asked what barrel twist you have. I have found that the 1 in 8 works better than the one in 8.5.
Although many don't like them, the Remington 7 1/2 bench rest work great with the 6.5x47 Lapua. They seem to burn just a little hotter.
I have pushed the loads to get 3260 FPS. Let me tell you, velocity is not everything. The groups opened up to about 12 inches at 200 yards going this fast.
The other powder I found that worked very, very well was IMR 4007SC. I had better luck with it than Varget. It is faster than H4350 so don't use as much.
Although many don't like them, the Remington 7 1/2 bench rest work great with the 6.5x47 Lapua. They seem to burn just a little hotter.
I have pushed the loads to get 3260 FPS. Let me tell you, velocity is not everything. The groups opened up to about 12 inches at 200 yards going this fast.
The other powder I found that worked very, very well was IMR 4007SC. I had better luck with it than Varget. It is faster than H4350 so don't use as much.
My HART is a 1 in 8 twist. As I thought I'd be using 140's initially. I've got Rem 7 1/2's and will give them a try.
I'm HAPPY with where I'm at with the 130 VLD's and H-4350. Looking forward to a decent range day to stretch it out at the 500 and 1000 yd range.
I've also got a thousand of the new 136 grain Lapua, Scenar-L so those will be next for testing. So many good bullets for the 6.5's!
Need to finish this up and send it out for cerrakote. May do that this week. So testing will be on hold for a month or so. I'll send it out....THEN the temps will moderate and the winds will die down! LOL.
FN in MT
I'm HAPPY with where I'm at with the 130 VLD's and H-4350. Looking forward to a decent range day to stretch it out at the 500 and 1000 yd range.
I've also got a thousand of the new 136 grain Lapua, Scenar-L so those will be next for testing. So many good bullets for the 6.5's!
Need to finish this up and send it out for cerrakote. May do that this week. So testing will be on hold for a month or so. I'll send it out....THEN the temps will moderate and the winds will die down! LOL.
FN in MT
Upgrades & Donations
This Forum's expenses are primarily paid by member contributions. You can upgrade your Forum membership in seconds. Gold and Silver members get unlimited FREE classifieds for one year. Gold members can upload custom avatars.
Click Upgrade Membership Button ABOVE to get Gold or Silver Status.
You can also donate any amount, large or small, with the button below. Include your Forum Name in the PayPal Notes field.
To DONATE by CHECK, or make a recurring donation, CLICK HERE to learn how.
Click Upgrade Membership Button ABOVE to get Gold or Silver Status.
You can also donate any amount, large or small, with the button below. Include your Forum Name in the PayPal Notes field.
To DONATE by CHECK, or make a recurring donation, CLICK HERE to learn how.