Entris scale help

[KT]

I purchased a new Entris 64 scale to weigh powder a bit more precise. I used a tree 423b before that so it was a good magnetic two decimal place scale. No problems ever.

The Entris so far is terrible! It rarely will go back to zero and when it does it takes forever.

I've moved it to two different places in the house. It's on an anti static mat and its grounded. The darn scale just won't settle out. It really acts like a strain force scale.i have left it turned on for hours.

I have it set on very unstable environment

Any help would be appreciated.
Keith

 

[Kyle Schultz]

Will it calibrate?

I'd call the seller and see what they say.

 

[JamesnTN]

Calibrate the scale and go into the menus and setup the sensitivity of the scale. Also with a scale of this accuracy you need clean power source to operate the scale. Purchase a good battery backup system with a line conditioner built in and run the scale thru that.

 

[ireload2]

When Dillon put its new 1200 grain D Terminator on the market a friend bought one and it behaved exactly the same way.
Dillon admitted that it was about all that those scales could do with the cheap electronics. They volunteered to take it back but I put it in the closet. I did not want to tie up the cost of postage to send it back and get another piece of junk. Eventually they announced a new generation 900 grain version 8 years later. I sent the original scale back hoping to get it replaced by an updated 1200 grain version. Instead I got the cheaper 900 grain scale. Fortunately the 900 grain scale is light years better and has always worked perfectly.
I guess my point is your scale could just be a piece of junk that nothing will fix short of replacement.
Because of this little episode with digital scales I refuse to use a digital for weighing powder. After my friend died his family gave me his RCBS 750 made by Pact. It works fine too but I do not use it for powder either. I only use the digitals for culling cases and weighing bullets. Serious powder weighing is only done with a beam scale.

 

[KT]

Will it calibrate?

I'd call the seller and see what they say.

It calibrates fine.

 

[KT]

I made sure there were no cell phones around either.

 

[Lbart]

KT,
I sent you a PM.

 

[JamesnTN]

I made sure there were no cell phones around either.

Cell phones don't have any effect to my scales. I believe you're gonna need a line conditioner to help keep it settled down. It's also insurance in the bank as it'll also serve as a surge protector.

 

[Joe R]

KT said:
It calibrates fine.

I assume you're using a class 1 50 gram check weight.

Here's a couple of suggestions: If you have anything magnetic near it, including you car key/opener that will cause drift. A good way to find out is to get a compass and test it in several different areas near the scale. Watch for the needle to drift. Some people say that neon lights cause issues. I have LED bulbs in my armory/closet where I do all my reloading.

I generally turn mine on for at least 30 minutes before calibrating. I do have mine set on a Cyberpower UPS. If you have it near a wall there could be a leaky electric wire in the wall that could be interfering.

Kindest regards,

Joe

 

[jlow]

Could be a lot of things but what I find is the biggest culprit for a drifting balance is always static especially a good quality balance you have that has a enclosure, this is especially true in winter when the humidity is so low. Try getting a piece of new dryer anti-static sheet and wipe down your clothing, especially your sleeves and your butt (since it slides around on the chair), the chair surface, you balance, the balance pan, and finally the surface your balance sits on. I know you have it sitting on an anti-static matt but....

 

[Joe R]

Here's something that I just discovered. Power supply problems/issues will make your scale drift.

First some background. Yesterday I went to turn on my Entris 64 scale and it was dead as a door nail. Fortunately it is still under warranty, so after learning how to use a voltage meter I concluded that the power supply was definitely dead. So Sartorious is shipping me a new one.

I'm in a bit of a jam because I'm on a team and we're preparing for an upcoming match. Since without the scale I'm pretty much out of it, one of the guys offered to loan me his A&D 120i scale and brought it over to my house this morning. As we were getting it out of the box I noticed that his power connector to his scale was identical to mine, so I decided to test it to see if my scale is still functional. Sure enough the scale came on, big sigh of relief, it is definitely the power supply.

After pouring a few charges I noticed that my scale is unusually stable and quick, the usual meandering (back and forth) to the correct weight is gone and the scale gets right to it. So after pouring fifty charges I feel like I have a whole new upgraded scale. The meandering, that for the past 17 months, I thought was normal, isn't. I learned a big lesson today. When I get my new power supply if it doesn't put out the same voltage as the A&D one Sartorius will be hearing from me.

Kindest regards,

Joe

 

[Twoboxer]

Here's something that I just discovered. Power supply problems/issues will make your scale drift.
. . . When I get my new power supply if it doesn't put out the same voltage as the A&D one Sartorius will be hearing from me.

Boy, solving that problem and having your scale finally perform as its quality should allow has gotta be a great feeling

Of course a new power supply should resolve the issue. By all means do the voltage test, but be aware the "power supply problem" may not be detectable (eg, excessive ripple) by your VOM.

 

[KT]

So I purchased the same power supply that Joe has and it helped a little bit but it still does not want to return to zero. I'm frustrated with the scale. I will call Astoria tomorrow and see what they have to say.

 

[Joe Salt]

KT you are not trying to zero the scale every time you weigh something when it doesn't go back to zero are you. That's what my buddy was doing with his. If you have your powder trickler threw the door on one side and have any air movement it will never zero completely. Close everything up and wait to see if it zero's. Everyone wants that last digit to zero! under perfect conditions yes. Hope you don't have it plugged into the same outlet as maybe another scale cause that will raise hell with them also. they should be in an outlet by themselves.

Joe Salt

 

[JamesnTN]

add this and you'll see night and day difference.

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B007ZT2KKM/?tag=accuratescom-20

Or this for unreal and for sure clean power

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B0050NZTQ2/?tag=accuratescom-20

Those cheap 40.00-100.00 units or surge protectors don't cut the mustard for lab grade equipment such as your scales.

 

[Twoboxer]

. . . If you have your powder trickler threw the door on one side and have any air movement it will never zero completely. . . .

Something that works for me . . . I put my FX120i inside a cheap, white, 15" storage cube: http://www.amazon.com/dp/B000O1FROO/?tag=accuratescom-20 and don't use the scale's cover at all.

Only the front side of the box is open to drafts, and in my environment that works fine. The cube easily holds the scale, an Omega trickler, various powder pans, instructions, and cleaning brushes. It's also plenty strong enough to use the top as temporary storage space. Eventually I installed some LED strip lighting inside the cube, but different area lighting (or younger eyes than mine) might eliminate that potential issue.

 

[jlow]

So I purchased the same power supply that Joe has and it helped a little bit but it still does not want to return to zero. I'm frustrated with the scale. I will call Astoria tomorrow and see what they have to say.

The problem here is there is a misunderstanding of what happened and also about the cure. Joe's problem was NOT because he had a house current problem that affected his scale. His problem was due to a faulty power supply i.e. the gadget that sits between his house current and the scale. Your problem is likely not the power supply problem but a problem with something elese like static or your house current.... That is why changing out a perfectly good power supply for another power supply did not change anything for you.

 

[Joe Salt]

When you get a scale like this it is very sensitive to vibration, static, other electrical problems. If it will zero after being closed up for a short time 10 seconds. You should be looking for other things. I don't worry about that last digit if it is below 4. you a fooling yourself if you think it matters even at 1000 yards.

Joe Salt

 

[Joe R]

Okay Guys,
Here's what broke down on my scale

JamesnTN said:
add this and you'll see night and day difference.

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B007ZT2KKM/?tag=accuratescom-20

Or this for unreal and for sure clean power

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B0050NZTQ2/?tag=accuratescom-20

Those cheap 40.00-100.00 units or surge protectors don't cut the mustard for lab grade equipment such as your scales.

James,
the UPS that you suggested are overkill for scales, they are intended for workstations or server. If you look at the picture that I posted previously you will notice that four of the plugs are labeled "Surge+Battery" they are in essence a scaled down version of those big UPS you posted links and it only costs $50. They not only filter the power, they also provide battery backup so you can have an orderly shut down. The scale only draws 12 volts.

 

[Twoboxer]

I don't know what is plaguing your scale, but putting a small, low-cost UPS in between your wall outlet and the scale's little transformer is not going to solve it.

An expensive UPS with pure sign wave output doesn't do much to clean up the AC input. A less expensive one with modified sine wave output will make it worse.

Both will provide surge protection, backup power, and keep output voltage near 120VAC. But neither can possibly solve any other problem.

[A bit down on this page: http://superuser.com/questions/912679/when-do-i-need-a-pure-sine-wave-ups
there are oscillograms (pictures) of one user's current from the wall followed by pure and modified sign wave UPS outputs that clearly show this - no reading of techno-babble required, just compare the right-hand pictures. But if you have the patience, it's a good read.]

The good news is most modern devices don't care about dirty AC power. Strain gauge scales certainly are affected by transmitted noise. They may also be exceptions, ie, caring about "clean AC power". But even using a lab grade power supply (eliminating the supplied wall-wart transformer and providing clean DC power directly from the wall to the scale) didn't solve my Chargemaster and Gempro 250 problems.

Mag force scales are different, and more expensive. These scales are designed for use powered directly by wall power. IOW, they should contain all the power conditioning their operation requires.

You have a good scale. It was possible your problem was the scale's transformer, but you've already replaced it. So that pretty much eliminates that solution. If the problem you are having is related to the scale (not wind, not static electricity), it's most probably inside the scale.