End Result of our Bore Cleaning Debates

[47WillysGuy]

And I suspect Speedy is mostly interested in generating views to make $$$. I don't personally know the man so maybe that's incorrect.

Then there's the Boyer method. Swap barrels every 200 rounds or so. Can't help but wonder if that wasn't primarily to get in his competitor's heads but who knows?

Speedy, I believe, is mostly interested in keeping the sport of shooting alive with a secondary interest of making money to support himself and his family. Speedy has given me many tips to help improve my shooting skills. And I know he gives shooting tips to other club members,too. He has my trust.

 

[BoydAllen]

What’s funny is that guys swear up and down they have to clean clean clean then find out the rifle shoots better dirty. Then clean again. Lol

The important things to determine are the maximum number of shots for which you will have the very best accuracy, and the most reliable way to clean back to the best starting condition. For many barrels this is not perfectly clean. Affordable bore scopes have made all of this a lot easier. There are some barrels that take very few fouling shots after cleaning to start to repeat. Other barrels have seemed to improve as they got dirtier, up to a point. The trick is to know what that point is and to clean just enough, before you get there. In short range group benchrest some shooters clean after every match, which may consist of as few as six or seven shots. (of course what with the number of shots and it being done right after shooting, the cleaning does not take much time) Others use longer cleaning intervals, but none of these typically 6PPC shooters extend their strings to what is common in F class or PRS matches.

 

[lotech]

I'll always remember what Ed Shilen said when taking a tour of his shop almost forty years...you don't need to remove every bit of copper. As long as the barrel is shooting, don't worry about copper. I think he knew what he was talking about.

 

[JFrank]

The important things to determine are the maximum number of shots for which you will have the very best accuracy, and the most reliable way to clean back to the best starting condition. For many barrels this is not perfectly clean. Affordable bore scopes have made all of this a lot easier. There are some barrels that take very few fouling shots after cleaning to start to repeat. Other barrels have seemed to improve as they got dirtier, up to a point. The trick is to know what that point is and to clean just enough, before you get there. In short range group benchrest some shooters clean after every match, which may consist of as few as six or seven shots. (of course what with the number of shots and it being t done right after shooting, the cleaning does not take much time) Others use longer cleaning intervals, but none of these typically 6PPC shooters extend their strings to what is common in F class or PRS matches.

Im paying a bit of attention to cleaning cycles, it’s not just about how many fouling shots but when the barrel comes into tune how long it stays in tune and how the tune reacts as the day goes on.

 

[Dave M.]

This morning I was shooting air rifle at our local indoor range. We shooting upstairs. I came down the steps and the manager was talking to an individual. I saw a brand name bore cleaning agent on the counter, a broken down 1911, and some dirty patches. The manager , Jerry, introduced me to the sales rep and said to him as he introduced us," Sell him and I will buy some". Rep, a very pleasant man in his 50s who I found out was a retired Marine asked if I cleaned my guns and how. This lead into a discussion on carbon and copper. He proceed to tell me he could prove to me my guns are not clean. Ohhhhh, my game face is on.I said, " Wait here I live 5 minutes away." Back I come with my 6ppc and cleaning box. He hands me a patch saturated with his product and said give it 30 strokes. Ok. Bore guide in and 30 strokes later I handed him a totally clean patch. He shook his head and said, " Twelve and a half years of doing this, first clean gun ever." This is the short version. He was a nice man but ran into the wrong guy. He had never heard of Iosso. I have lots of experience in bore cleaning debates, lol. Chalk this one up for the Accurate Shooter guys.

The fact that he never heard of Iosso tells him that he can’t be very knowledgeable about barrel cleaning products. I know guys that go through a tube of that faster than a tube of toothpaste.
Dave

 

[Kevin1990]

The man was a real gentleman, I will not throw him under the bus. He just ran into the wrong guy. I used one of his patches for 20 strokes on my 6BRX which had 35 rounds shot out of it at a 300 yard UBR match yesterday . I put Outers Foaming Bore Cleaner in it when I came home yesterday and left it sit all night. Ran a couple dry patches thru it this morning then put Hoppes/Kroil in it. His patch came out clean.It did smell ok, like BenGay. I usually figure 3 or 4 days for CLEAN.

forgive my stupidity. "I usually figure 3 or 4 days for CLEAN." Do you mean you let the barrel soak in solvent for 3 or 4 days? Thanks

 

[JEFFPPC]

forgive my stupidity. "I usually figure 3 or 4 days for CLEAN." Do you mean you let the barrel soak in solvent for 3 or 4 days? Thanks

Yes I leave them soak. No it's not a stupid question.

 

[JEFFPPC]

The fact that he never heard of Iosso tells him that he can’t be very knowledgeable about barrel cleaning products. I know guys that go through a tube of that faster than a tube of toothpaste.
Dave

I agree Dave. When he said that I felt my eyebrows go up. I think competitive shooter especially those who have been it for years don't appreciate the gap of knowledge to the average hunter or casual shooter.

 

[divingin]

Jeff will chime in here soon to give you his procedure if it's different than mine.
I use Iosso on VFG cleaning pellets. Make sure you use the VFG jag which has a tapered threaded mount for the pellet. As you are cleaning you can twist the cleaning rod clockwise which threads the pellet up the taper which expands it to cause a tighter fit in the bore.

You can also use 2 pellets, and jam them together which will cause them to swell a bit at the junction. Not sure it actually does any good, but gives the impression you're maximizing contact.

 

[Bugs]

curious if anyone still uses the old Bon-Ami cleanser (feldspar) suspended in Kroil, Hoppe's or whatever ? ?

 

[Shooter13]

Some barrels need to be dirty to shoot. It's kind of funny that you
scub em' down. but a particular barrel needs X amount of foulers
to bring it back. My last barrel would give me the "WTF's" on my
sighter target until I would have at least five foulers into the berm !!

This!! So crazy, I've had barrels that took 3 shots and others that wanted 10 to start grouping! Then back to the bench and clean the heck out of it, sometimes with the ones that wanted 10 I'd clean every other match.

 

[Shooter13]

What’s funny is that guys swear up and down they have to clean clean clean then find out the rifle shoots better dirty. Then clean again. Lol

There is a point of diminishing return!

 

[Dolomite]

I believe Speedy stated "for bench rest cleanliness is next to godliness". But everyone has their definition of what they consider clean, find what works best for you by testing a cleaned barrel vs uncleaned barrel. Most people will have different results. Speedy only tells you what he does, its not his job to convince you to do it his way.

My factory barrel likes to be shot dirty but when its cleaned to the bone it needs 2 shots to get back up to speed. My guestimate is that it fills in all the imperfections with copper and carbon it helps even out the bore. But honestly I like to clean my barrels its almost like an addiction for me anyway.

My Bartliens on the other hand get cleaned after every range session about 30-40 rounds. Does it make that much of a difference for me on target, well I'm not that good of a shooter to tell the difference.

 

[BoydAllen]

For the guys whose barrels shoot better a little dirty, a bore scope should help them clean so that instead of spotless they achieve a repeatable state of slightly dirty. Back in the day we had no way to get this information. No one that I knew had a bore scope, and when they did become more common, they were too expensive for most to justify the expense. We thought that a white patch indicated a clean barrel, and if the barrel stopped shooting we just knew that it was worn out.

 

[Lucky Shooter]

I prefer to call it "fouling management".

A. Weldy