Done with Nylon brushes...

[Ledd Slinger]

I was just doing another tedious barrel break-in on my new 300 NMI and have almost decided to throw away all my nylon brushes. Tired of all the extra scrubbing required.

I've never damaged a bore using bronze brushes, or at least not to the point that made any difference on the target. They clean a bore so much faster and efficiently than nylon. With the same amount of strokes using the same solvents, hands down the bronze brush wins the race, especially with hardened carbon and stubborn copper.

Bronze brushes worked great back many years ago when I started this firearm obsession and I dont see why they won't work just as good now... So I think it's gonna be back to bronze brushes for me.

Anyone else feel the same about nylon brushes?

 

[DngBat7]

I agree. Found that out myself recently. Would clean with Montana xtreeme nylon brushes, and there was always carbon left in the groves. With bronze, it’s gone. Ps. I’ll take your nylons if your tossing them

 

[Dusty Stevens]

Throw them away. Save somebody else the heartache. You can do more damage faster with nylon than bronze- most cant grasp that.

 

[Forum Boss]

Throw them away. Save somebody else the heartache. You can do more damage faster with nylon than bronze- most cant grasp that.

I disagree whole-heartedly. I see lots of people mess up their crowns dragging dirty bronze brushes back across their crowns. There is definitely a place for bronze brushes, but many very, very good shooters (World and National champions) are doing a LOT less brushing.

As for "tedious barrel break-in", with fine barrels this may not be necessary at all.

For custom, hand-lapped barrels, I advocate wet patches followed by two applications of WipeOut. This seems to be enough for a 6mm that shoots no more than 80 rounds in a session.

Of course YMMV. I am aware that many hall of famers clean aggressively with Bronze. But I firmly disagree with the view that nylon brushes are useless.

--- Honestly, I think most shooters probably brush incorrectly, too often, and too aggressively.

Regarding a little black streak in the groove -- it may not do any harm at all. I had one 6BR barrel that had never been brushed (honest). At 700 rounds it was showing some carbon in the grooves. I was ready to get the bronze brushes and strong solvent out, but then my shooting buddy asked to shot it "as is". It shot a 0.104" 4-shot group with Scenar 105s. Let your BARREL tell you when it needs aggressive cleaning.

Honestly, I've been working on this site for 15 years now. If I had a "Ten Commandments" to readers, one would be "Start conservatively with cleaning. A large percentage of people clean too aggressively and too often."

 

[kvd]

I advocate wet patches followed by two applications of WipeOut.

What are the first patches saturated with that are subsequently followed with the WipeOut?

 

[garandman]

As with most everything in the firearms world… it depends upon who you talk to.

A lot of people speak very loudly about what they're absolutely sure must be universally true. And most of them will pull out their resume for how awesome a shooter they are. Or they will reference some world class shooter who agrees with them.

Problem is you can usually get 3 or more conflicting opinions on most every topic in the firearms world.

The more time goes by the more I'm convinced there are very few universals in the shooting world and for the most part every individual shooter needs to figure out what their individual gun and hand loads and cleaning method etc needs to be.

For example… Vudoo gun works in their V22 rim fire rifle which is a very high end gun... recommends only nylon brushes. I would think the manufacture of the gun who has literally hundreds of thousands of rounds through their guns and has cleaned them probably a 1000 times would know the right way to clean their gun . Does anyone care to tell them they are wrong?

 

[garandman]

I will take your nylon brushes. IM sent.

 

[6_5_284]

"If you think it works, it works" & it is darn near impossible for someone to convince you otherwise. I think that is pretty much universal, not just unique to the "shooting world". Just my $.02 worth.

 

[dolek]

As with most everything in the firearms world… it depends upon who you talk to.

A lot of people speak very loudly about what they're absolutely sure must be universally true. And most of them will pull out their resume for how awesome a shooter they are. Or they will reference some world class shooter who agrees with them.

Problem is you can usually get 3 or more conflicting opinions on most every topic in the firearms world.

The more time goes by the more I'm convinced there are very few universals in the shooting world and for the most part every individual shooter needs to figure out what their individual gun and hand loads and cleaning method etc needs to be.

For example… Vudoo gun works in their V22 rim fire rifle which is a very high end gun... recommends only nylon brushes. I would think the manufacture of the gun who has literally hundreds of thousands of rounds through their guns and has cleaned them probably a 1000 times would know the right way to clean their gun . Does anyone care to tell them they are wrong?

22 rimfire is different...lubed lead bullet . Much different cleaning process.

 

[garandman]

22 rimfire is different...lubed lead bullet . Much different cleaning process.

Ive had ppl here telling me Vudoo is wrong. About their cleaning method.

 

[garandman]

"If you think it works, it works" & it is darn near impossible for someone to convince you otherwise. I think that is pretty much universal, not just unique to the "shooting world". Just my $.02 worth.

The one universal... there are no universals.

 

[284winner]

I was just doing another tedious barrel break-in on my new 300 NMI and pretty much decided to throw away all my nylon brushes. Or maybe give them away to someone who prefers them. Tired of all the extra scrubbing required.

I've never damaged a bore using bronze brushes, or at least not to the point that made any difference on the target. They clean a bore so much faster and efficiently than nylon. With the same amount of strokes using the same solvents, hands down the bronze brush wins the race, especially with hardened carbon and stubborn copper.

Bronze brushes worked great back many years ago when I started this firearm obsession and I dont see why they won't work just as good now... So I think it's gonna be back to bronze brushes for me.

Anyone else feel the same about nylon brushes?

I think I read somewhere that using bronze brushes with Isso or certain other cleaners will break down the bronze bristles and they'll fall apart. Seems like I read that years ago when the Isso came out. Maybe they changed there ingredients and it does not break the bronze down today. Not sure. It is something I read some years back.

 

[LA50SHOOTER]

I’ll use a nylon brush with strong de-coppering solvents that have a high ammonia content like Sweets and Montana Extreme copper killer cream and solvent for the simple reason I believe the solvent will have a better de-coppering effect if it doesn’t also have to be subjected to the additional brush surface area of a bronze brush. Also when shooting bronze solids in bigger bores (.375, .416, and .510)

I believe that the nylon brush has a very minimal effect if at all, when it comes to actual carbon removal, but these nylon brushes still have a place in my cleaning regimes.

The nylon brush has limits as to what it will accomplish and understanding that fact is important.

- Ron -

 

[dkhunt14]

Nothing beats soaking for long periods between shoots. Matt

 

[garandman]

Nothing beats soaking for long periods between shoots. Matt

I would agree. Giving solvents a good half hour minimum to work before patching them out seems to make a real difference

 

[LA50SHOOTER]

I would agree. Giving solvents a good half hour minimum to work before patching them out seems to make a real difference

Agree, on this with exception of Ammonia based solvents which I leave 5-7 minutes. - And I know that there will be those who advocate that ammonia based copper solvents are obsolete with advent of some of the newer copper cleaners.
- IME, especially on larger bores and shooting bronze and pure copper monolithic projectiles the ammonia based cleaners are the most effective.

- Ron -

 

[garandman]

Agree, on this with exception of Ammonia based solvents which I leave 5-7 minutes. -

- Ron -

Yeah... I came too close to asserting a universal.

There are just too many variables in the firearms world. Even a bartlein barrels with sequentially numbered barrels coming off their assembly line are going to have distinct differences that the individual shooter must personally account for

 

[hogpatrol]

YMMV, yada yada.
Kreiger:
We recommend the use of good quality, name brand chemical cleaners on a proper fitting patch/jag combination for your particular bore size and good quality properly sized nylon or bronze brushes.

Shilen:
How do I clean my new Shilen barrel?
As with break-in and using coated bullets, you will find many diverse opinions on this subject.
EQUIPMENT: Cleaning Rods: Use a good quality coated cleaning rod with a rotating handle. The rotating handle allows the brush or patch to follow the lands and grooves. A non rotating handle forces the brush bristles to jump over the lands and grooves instead of following them.
BRUSHES: Use a good brass or bronze brush with a looped end. Do not use a brush with a sharp, pointed end.
SOLVENTS:
Every shooting product manufacturer has their own miracle solvent, and most do the job as advertised.

Lilja:
Suggested equipment and solvents
It is important to use an action rod guide when cleaning. The guide aligns the rod with the bore and helps prevent uneven wear in the throat area. Be careful not to raise the handle end of the rod while stroking. This will put a “belly” in the rod that will wear the barrel. We suggest that plastic coated rods, like the Dewey and Parker-Hale, be used.

Our preferred cleaning solvent is Butch’s Bore Shine. This solvent is excellent at attacking both powder and copper fouling. We recommend it for both break-in and regular cleaning.

For occasional use only, abrasives like J-B paste, Flitz, or RemClean can be used.

Do not use a stainless steel brush in your barrel under any circumstances.

Do use a bronze brush with Butch’s Bore Shine or similar solvents. A nylon brush can be used in place of patches but should never be substituted for a bronze brush. Some shooters mistakenly believe that a bronze brush will harm a barrel; it will not.

Do not apply a strong copper remover, like Sweets, on a bronze brush. It will ruin the brush and give the false indication that the barrel has copper in it. This is a good time to use a nylon brush.

 

[Ledd Slinger]

You guys are absolutely correct on the soaking. Definitely works way better. However in the instance I was breaking in a new barrel. Shoot clean, shoot clean, shoot clean...you know the drill.

I like to rip the carbon and copper out quickly so I can get the next round down the bore during break in. I dont use ammonia based solvents anymore.

 

[urbanrifleman]

If you do not own a bore scope then I would take EVERYTHING you read on the Internet with a grain of salt. I tested most of the cleaning methods listed here, including maintenance requirements for the carbon ring, and most of these methods do not work.

There is NO PRODUCT that will clean away the hard carbon at the throat. You will have to scrub it with something. Something abrasive. That is all I will say on the subject, because it is so controversial to even bring it up. But there is no CHEMICAL that will clean your barrel.