Die selection?

[Aitch]

I just got a 6.5 .284 and am in the process of trying to sort out what dies to buy.
I've punched paper at 100 yds and reloaded several calibers including wildcats for years but am new to the site and "precision" reloading.
The rifle is a SG&Y build on a 700 action with a 28" Krieger bbl. Neck dia is .297.

Frankly, the Redding site has me confused, but too many options has been the bane of my life.

Here's what I think I need at minimum:
Seating die with ability to precisely set depth. Micrometer head?
Sizing die with appropriate neck bushing.

I have not figured out how to get neck dimensions on a finished round before I get dies or order a correct size bushing.

I also have questions about full length vs neck sizing. I know some size only a portion of the neck.

Shoulder bump or not?

Thanks for your help!

Aitch

 

[Winchester69]

You have a chamber diameter that was cut for a brass thickness of 0.015". This is determined by allowing a 0.003" clearance for brass, leaving 0.294". Subtracting 0.264" for bullet diameter allows 0.030" for brass material, apportioned to 0.015" for brass neck thickness. Backing up, you want to figure approximately,depending on brass tension and desired neck tension) a 0.002" interference fit between brass and bullet; this puts your projected bushing size at 0.292". It is still necessary to make measurements due to variances:,1) You may have brass that does not allow for 0.015" thickness; if it's less, you need a smaller bushing,2) The bullets may not be exactly 0.264". Any brass that is over 0.015" thick will require turning to that dimension. Once you know your final brass thickness, double that thickness, and add it to the bullet diameter. Reduce that dimension by by your desired interference,~0.002") to determine the bushing size.

The amount of neck that is sized is determined by the height of the die as set by the lock ring. It can be more precisely set by using shims between the die and press; these shims are available from Sinclair. A more costly means is provided by Redding in their micrometer-head seating die.

Bumping the shoulder is accomplished in a Redding set-up with their body die; it also sizes the case simultaneously. Forster and Hornady have bushing neck-sizing dies which will also bump the shoulder. These bushings are proprietary to each brand, and in the case of Hornady are available in only 0.002" increments. The case body will also require sizing periodically if these neck bump-dies are used. Bumping the shoulder minimally at each sizing assures more consistent case volume.

The primary benefit of a micrometer-head seating die is for its alignment sleeve. The micrometer is very useful,easy) if you're experimenting with bullet seating depth,another way of saying how far off the lands). Forster offers their sleeved seater without the micrometer head.

Those who full-length size,for target work) usually have custom dies that are patterned on the rifle's chamber. This is another means for achieving consistent case volume.

A set-up for covering all bases would be the following combination:,1) Either a Forster or Hornady bushing-bump neck-sizing die,2) A Redding body die,3) Either Forster or Redding micrometer-head seating die,4) A set of shims for adjusting the amount of the neck that is sized.

A simpler approach would employ a FL bushing sizing die and a sleeved seating die,micrometer-head Redding or Forster, or standard Forster). A set of the shims would ease fine tuning.

 

[Aitch]

Excellent information, just what I was looking for.
I have queried SG&Y for their recommendations with no reply.

I'm sure I'll have more questions, but you've addressed the main points and with specific recommendations. Thank you for sharing your experience.

Aitch

 

[Winchester69]

You're quite welcome. Please feel free to ask when you have more questions.

An excellent book covering all segments of reloading is Glen Zediker's Handloading for Competition. It's available from Sinclair,about $40 with shipping); ask for their catalog if you don't have one.

 

[chuckw2]

SG&Y is no longer in business..I have one of Speedy's guns and it shoots lights out. If you have any questions, you might want to talk to Stick at S&S, he did a lot of Speedy's work.


Take Winchester69 advice on Zediker's books..They are very good and contain a wealth of information.


I have 3 F-Class 6.5 x 284's, I prefer Laupa brass, CCI BR-2 primers,and H-4350 powder. They are really quite easy to load.

For my 6.5 x 284's, I use a Redding small base body die and a Wilson neck die and a Wilson seater. These are by no means the only dies that will do a good job for you, they are just easier for me to use than regular threaded dies.

I have a heavy bolt lift if I don't use a small base body die.

The Wilson seating die are my favorite bullet seaters without the micrometer head, I use shims to adjust the bullet seating depth.

I have had good luck with both Redding and Forester threaded
dies.

Some say it is best to have at least .003 clearance on your necks. With a .297 neck, the loaded round should be .294.
You should buy three bushings .293,.292 and a .291


Please keep us posted on your progress!!1

 

[Aitch]

Thanks chuckw2, I knew that Speedy had moved to Colorado and is teaching gunsmithing but the web SG&Y web site is still up so tried to contact there. I'd also heard that Stick was doing the lions share of the work. How do I contact S&S?

I see the Redding small base body die but don't understand the "small base". Is that a different thread? Do you use it in the arbor press? Do you decap with the Wilson neck size die?

Thanks for the bushing suggestions.

I bought 100 .284 Win brass five years ago for a project that did not develop but now am considering shelving those and buying Lapua brass.

I'm ordering the Zediker book. I appreciate the advice!

Aitch

 

[chuckw2]

I have Sticks number somewhere... I will get it for you


Chuck


It's S&S Precision in Argule,TX 940.566.7001

Sticks real name is Don Starks...

 

[Aitch]

Great, thanks!

 

[chuckw2]

Aitch,


I first punch the primers out with an arbor press and clean the primer pockets with a gator.

Clean the inside of the necks with an electric drill and a stiff nylon brush.

Clean the outside of the case necks with 0000 steel wool.

I have never worried too much about tumbling my cases, I might do it every 10 fires or so. But I can't tell any difference in the way the gun shoots with a dirty interior case wall or clean interior case wall.

It's more important for me to reload and shoot the cases in the same order each match. That is probably something that I do that doesn't make a hill of bean's difference in how I shoot, but some of these thing are old habits.

My 6.5 x 284 reamer has a .290 neck so I have to turn the necks. Some people think you have to turn necks to be competitive some people think that it is a waste of time.

A small base body die pushes the shoulder back and sizes the rest of the cartridge a little more than a standard die, The Redding small base die does not touch the neck.
I use a old Rock Chucker press with the small base die and Redding competition shell holders. With my 6.5's the bolt is hard to lift after you fire the gun, if you do not use a small base die.


Then I use a Wilson neck die and bushing to size the neck down. The Wilson dies are designed to be used with an arbor press or a hammer. I use both Redding and Wilson neck bushings, can't tell any difference between the two, with the exception that the numbers,.288, etc.) are hell to read on my Wilson bushings. One bushing that has not worked out very well for me are the Redding TIN bushings. They scratch the necks on my .22,6mm, and 6.5 necks.


To seat the bullet I use a Wilson seater and shims. Again I use a Sinclair arbor press to seat the bullet.

With the 6.5 x 284, 99% of the time I use 48gr of H-4350. This load might be TOO HOT for your gun, every gun is a little different. Work up your slowly to find out what your gun likes.


I like the Laupa 139gr and Sierra 142gr SMK's,no molly) Here again some of my friends have had great success with Burger 140gr. They are hard to find sometime, so I have not ever fooled with them.


Hope this helps..


Chuck