Competition Cartridges - Bad Ideas

[Cheechako]

I’m taking a chance in showing these two cartridges because I think at least one of the originators is till alive. So, if he’s reading this I hope he is not offended. I don’t mean it to be.

The lowliest benchrest shooter on the line, the guy who always finishes last, is still a better shooter/handloader/ballistician than the best of the best over on the public range. But nobody can be smart all the time. All of us have done things that border on being foolish or, worse yet, dangerous. Being one who has done both, usually at the same time, I’m not here to embarrass those responsible for todays two competition cartridges but it’s always better to tell of others’ mistakes rather than your own.

Many shooters have at least one odd-looking, even bizarre, “joke” cartridge that they enjoy showing to any unsuspecting novice who is unfortunate enough to be in the vicinity. But the two that I will describe and show are for-real benchrest cartridges that were actually used in competition. I like to call them the .22 IT SEEMED LIKE A GOOD IDEA AT THE TIME and the .30 HOLD MY BEER AND WATCH THIS.

22 DSH - Based on drastically reformed and shortened 30-30 brass, this 22 caliber double shoulder wonder was supposed to be the ultimate in efficiency and, therefore, accuracy. It may have even used a duplex powder charge for all I know. The fact that it made only a brief appearance and then disappeared should tell us something.

30 FAT ALBERT - While usually found in shortened 284W brass, this specimen is made from a Federal 308W nickeled case fire-formed in the much larger Fat Albert chamber. It’s not an isolated example because I have a whole supply of others just like it. Most everyone will agree that the .035" expansion at the case head is far too much for a cartridge generating more than 50,000 psi pressure. The fact that the shooter apparently survived attests not to his good judgement but to the strength of the brass and rifle.

I know, I know, there are some of you out there who will say that these cartridges are neither foolish nor dangerous. I'd like to hear your arguements for the defense.

 

[GermanS1]

Ray, that .22 DSH looks like the biggest headspacing nightmare I can imagine! I can visualize having to use 2 separate FL dies on it but no thanks!
German Salazar

 

[Cheechako]

German

You're right. I think that's why he used a rimmed case. I tried to track down a reamer but I think he made it with two seperate reamers also.

I had the barrel and actually shot some of the Fat Albert cases,I don't know what I was thinking) and it was fairly accurate. I was at a match when the 22 DHS was being used but the guy didn't do too well with it.

BTW, I have several more extra-shoulder cartridges in my collection. Most of them are jokes but a couple are real and even more unusual than the DSH. But alas, they are not competition cartridges so are out of place here.

Ray

 

[Forum Boss]

Ray,

What about two designs,venturi shoulder and hemispherical shoulder) that were both claimed to produce better velocity/efficiency, but for different reasons.

The venturi shoulder is supposed to work better by accelerating the gas flow out of the case--sort of like what you see in a ramjet engine. Here's a sample of a machined venturi for some kind of industrial machinery. Note the concave shoulders.

The hemi-shoulder is supposed to work better by having a hemispherical combustion chamber. Here is the inspiration is internal combustion car racing engines.

- - -

Ironically, I think we're learning from Stan Ware's no-neck Wolf pup, that neck and shoulder may be far less important to accuracy than we think and that load density and pressure may be more important.

Of course, having said that, my 45/70 is VERY accurate shooting smokeless loads at about 20% of case capacity, and less than 20K psi. so who knows??

 

[Cheechako]

Mr Mod

The trouble with most of the radical approaches to case design is that they seldom, if ever, result in actual, measurable, and repeatable positive results. They are soon forgotten only to return in a few years with a new generation of shooters. The venturified shoulder was born in the 1940s if I remember right. I haven't seen it tried lately but maybe we haven't heard about it because the new "inventor" didn't get the results he had hoped for and simply shoved it back under the work bench. By "hemispherical" I assume you are talking about the SMC cartridges? I'm not sure if this is something new but, as a competitor, I don't see any of these on the firing line today. ,Okay, maybe one - we both know him.) The same goes for things such as frontal ignition. How many times has that been re-visited. And the Weatherby double radius shoulder,the venturified times two) was mostly a sales gimmick but I have a brand new cartridge in my collection using that same approach for supposed ballistic advantages.

I wasn't going to show any of these but you started it, so here's a couple of odd ones to keep the pot stirring. Left is the 228 Magnum Double Shoulder by no less than P.O.Ackley hisself. This was supposedly loaded with a duplex or triplex load to produce some astonishing velocities. Did it do what it was supposed to do? I dunno.,And we thought short and fat was the only way to go!) Right is the 7mm Vom Hofe Super Express, from the 1960s. Check out that modified venturified shoulder. I can't say if it worked because I have no idea of what it was supposed to do in the first place.

Ray

 

[6Dasher]

Playing around with a shoulder setback die

The 22HHH ,as in HaHaHa)

I also used the same setback die to make a 22-44mag as a joke. Stick the bottom out between your fingers to hand a case over and when they pull it out of your hand and see the 22 bullet. The look on their faces

 

[Cheechako]

Hey Jim, I think that one will work. Have you got the reamer.

 

[6Dasher]

 

[chuckw2]

Jim,

What powder are you using with the 22HHH to obtain 6000 FPS?

Mine is a 22HHH AI.


Chuck