Cleaning inside cases

[Barlow]

I have been handloading for 35 years, and do have a vibratory case cleaner that I use when doing either a lot of brass (100 rds or so) or real dirty cases. I do shoot F Class with a 6 Dasher, but use a Sinclair holder and spin them with a drill and clean the exterior with soft abrasive pads, then run a brush inside the case necks to clean them. I do not clean the inside of the case body on these cases, My theory is that once they are fouled, they are consistent. I have had good results doing it this way, but is there a good reason to clean the inside too. Barlow

 

[Lapua40X]

I suppose, theoretically, as the inside of the case builds up a layer of "dirty" burnt powder the case capacity may suffer to some extent but I've never found any reason to factor that in to the overall evaluation of reloaded round efficiency. I focus on clean necks and clean primer pocket and flash hole. Then I shoot .........

 

[fdshuster]

Barlow: This is what came out of 35 pieces of Lapua 6BR brass after being sized with a small base body die.

 

[Lapua40X]

Barlow: This is what came out of 35 pieces of Lapua 6BR brass after being sized with a small base body die.

Wouldn't that have come out at the end of a cleaning cycle using a vibratory brass cleaning medium?

 

[Barlow]

I do tap the cases on the bench to get loose residue out of them. Barlow

 

[ScottMcc]

I use birchwood-casey liquid case cleaner and a lyman tumbler. It's an acid cleaner that eats down to bare brass every time. The inside does not get shiny like the outside, but it removes deposits and maintains a uniform brass color.

 

[fdshuster]

Lapua40X: I use vibrator tumblers with corncob media, on occassion, and no, I don't believe it will come out with tumbling. The only reason it came out this time was that the small base body die changed the dimensions of the case to the extent that the carbon layers were fractured/ cracked/ broken free from the inside surfaces of the cases.

This was with the exclusive use of Varget powder. With VihtaVouri N133 in the 6ppc's I find much less carbon.

 

[Steve Blair]

Cleaning the case inside is more important if you anneal. The first time I annealed cases, carbon inside the case formed a hard residue that I could not remove. It may be that cleaning the neck inside would have been sufficient. I went whole hog and bought a tumbler and stainless pins. I tested the system with some old FA64 Match cases that had been fired many times. The water poured out jet black and opaque. It's not quite that bad when processing cases fired once. The right mix of Lemi-Shine, Lemi Shine Rinse and Ajax dishwasing detergent leaves them shiny and very clean. It takes thirty minutes to run one hundred cases. After tumbling and annealing, cases are the same state every firing.

 

[Tozguy]

Lapua40X: I use vibrator tumblers with corncob media, on occassion, and no, I don't believe it will come out with tumbling. The only reason it came out this time was that the small base body die changed the dimensions of the case to the extent that the carbon layers were fractured/ cracked/ broken free from the inside surfaces of the cases.

This was with the exclusive use of Varget powder. With VihtaVouri N133 in the 6ppc's I find much less carbon.

Frank, can you say whether all the carbon flaked off from body sizing or would there still be some 'scabs' left inside that didn't come off?

 

[bigedp51]

I wet tumble with stainless steel media and I'm very satisfied "BUT" less bumping and grinding occurs with ultrasonic cleaning. The British would pore boiling water down their bores to remove corrosive salts and the boiling water also removed carbon from the bore. I would think a heated ultrasonic cleaner would remove the most carbon and powder residue from inside the cases.

Below is a test comparison between vibratory tumblers and ultrasonic cleaners with good photos.

Ultrasonic Case Cleaning
http://www.brownells.com/.aspx/lid=12779/GunTechdetail/Ultrasonic_Case_Cleaning


The Hornady ultrasonic cleaner below has a heater with temp control and timer.

Hornady Lock-N-Load Magnum Sonic Cleaner Ultrasonic Case Cleaner Stainless Steel 110 Volt

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/344021/hornady-lock-n-load-magnum-sonic-cleaner-ultrasonic-case-cleaner-stainless-steel-110-volt

 

[fdshuster]

Walt: I checked several cases with my borescope and there was minimal carbon left. If I had to guess, about 20% remained.

 

[Barlow]

I appreciate all the replies, but the question remains; are cases that are cleaned internally more accurate than those that are left alone, or just shook out? I'm sure someone in accuracyland has studied this question. Barlow

 

[357Mag]

Barlow -

+ one on what scottmc said.

If you have " hard powder fouling " that ends-up lining some of your case' insides, the Birchwood - Casey case cleaner will get that out handily.

First time I encountered it, was w/ my .224" cal wildcat brass ( WW750 powder).
When I performed FL sizing ( after many reloadings), the hard powder fouling sluffed-off the inside case walls in multiple flakes or strips. I always used a neck brush on the ID of the case necks, so powder fouling was never a factor; there. I also use powdered graphite as an inside neck lube, prior to bullet seating ( FWIW ).

IF the fouling were to affect accuracy, IMHO..... it would be via partial-obstruction of or affecting diameter of the flash hole.
I don't think case capacity was notably affected.


With regards,
357Mag

 

[mshelton]

I appreciate all the replies, but the question remains; are cases that are cleaned internally more accurate than those that are left alone, or just shook out? I'm sure someone in accuracyland has studied this question. Barlow

I don't know how to measure or test it but I can tell you that a lot of 1k bench rest shooters sonic clean and anneal every time, these shooters also win.

 

[lpreddick]

a large enough deposit of carbon or whatever has to reduce the volume of a case. loaded with the usual charge and since the case volumn is reduced, the pressure upon discharge should be elevated...?enough to affect accuracy? these small carbon deposits probably don't have a negative effect, but a large deposit of cream of wheat (cow) just might. i fireformed a batch of 22 BR cases with cow and just happened to look into the case and...what the h..l! there was a large, VERY hard baked on cake of cow on the inside of the shoulder! i spent quite a bit of time scraping to get it out...don't know if ultrasonic vibrations would work. i found several more with the same. no proof but i suspect pressure in these cases would be affected. i shoot a lot of 22 BRS and ff cases with cow. as a test, i loaded half the case with cow and the rest with shot buffer and there has been no more caking. i routinely spin a nylon brush inside the br cases and do note some powder residue but the caked on cow would not come out.

 

[Barlow]

Thanks for the info. I am going to think about this for awhile. Barlow

 

[amlevin]

I do not clean the inside of the case body on these cases, My theory is that once they are fouled, they are consistent. I have had good results doing it this way, but is there a good reason to clean the inside too. Barlow

One of our local BR shooters who for years has been vigorously trying to remove all variables from his ammo, has recently started to use an ultrasonic cleaner on ALL of his match brass. He's collected all kinds of data on how much carbon his cases builds up as they're shot and how the brass performed as it got older.

In his opinion, the only way brass is "consistent" is if it's in a controlled condition. Clean is controlled, fouled is "what you get".

BTW, this individual even makes his own bullets, carefully checking each jacket for consistent thickness/run-out. At one time he "bored" the jackets for consistency. He sure wins a lot too.

OH, at the range a couple weeks ago he was using brass that had over 70 load/fire cycles on it. Apparently his cleaning has no effect on it's lifespan.