Can Barrel Droop Be a Problem?

[South Pender]

I've just come into a brand new heavy barrel Sako 6 PPC. It is built on the Sako A1 action, the smallest of the various Sako actions. The barrel mics about .86 at the muzzle, and so is pretty heavy. The way the gun came to me was with barrel contact at the forend tip--what looked like purposeful contact points in the wood stock at the tip. Folks have been suggesting to me that I leave it as is, but I am curious about free-floating the barrel--the pattern used by most precision shooters as far as I know.

So my question is about whether this small action can support a heavy barrel if I relieve the stock to free up the barrel. Or will it put too much stress on the action threads?

Any and all suggestions will be greatly appreciated.

Edit: If this is the wrong forum for this topic, please suggest the appropriate one.

 

[Sniper338]

Pillar bed it and there will be no problems...

 

[South Pender]

Pillar bed it and there will be no problems...

If I understand pillar-bedding, this will still leave the barrel completely unsupported. Or am I wrong about this?

 

[Sniper338]

Pillar bedding is beefing up the action/bolts/stock connections... they drill out the receiver bolt holes in the stock, then bed in the aluminum pillars... then do a regular bedding job after that... it shouldnt really mess with the barrel channel unless the smith beds the first part of the barrel too which ive seen... i think you would be better off taking it to get bedded and fit in the stock right unless you know how to do it yourself..

research pillar bedding on yputune amd ypu will likely figure out what im talking about but may not see the right ways to do it all... but ita give you and idea of what pillar bedding is..

all my rifles have the aluminum pillars in the stock...

at any rate i wouldnt want the barrel touching at the front of the stock... ot should free float

 

[swd]

F Class guys hang 30" 1.25" straight barrels off 700 Remington's all the time with no extra barrel support. Your little Sako will be just fine free floated. I love those baby Sako's btw.

 

[bheadboy]

I have found in mine that when bedding the action - pillar- that I then bed the first 1 1/2 inch under the chamber - very solid, shoot very well

Bob

 

[JRS]

Remember what pillar bedding accomplishes. It's only function is to eliminate any compression of the stock under the receiver. It beefs up nothing.

 

[CaptainMal]

Reads like you have compassion for that action having to hold up it's barrel.

Nuts to that. Listen to JRS about the bedding and pillars. Grind down that forend and free the barrel. Test.

If you wish after testing, bed a couple inches in the chamber area and see what that does.

 

[searcher]

I have the small-actioned Sako 6PPC benchrest model and it is free-floated and pillar and glass bedded with original stock and factory barrel. Shoots very nice - and no probem supporting that barrel.

 

[South Pender]

I have the small-actioned Sako 6PPC benchrest model and it is free-floated and pillar and glass bedded with original stock and factory barrel. Shoots very nice - and no probem supporting that barrel.

Searcher, is yours the heavy-barrel model (I assume it is since you've described it as the benchrest model)? If so, I should be OK free-floating the barrel. One other possibility that CaptainMal suggested would be to extend the glass bedding out an inch or so into the barrel channel. I imagine that this would produce pretty much the same results as fully floating the barrel and would provide a little support.

 

[Greyfox]

Just crush some Viagra and rub it on the barrel. It will stand up like a champ, but it might spit a shot now and then.......

Sorry, I couldn't help it

Seriously, I've owned the same Sako with the heavy barrel and no issues at all. They are arguably the most accurate factory rifle ever built.

Rick

 

[LHSmith]

If you do a search on this site and BRC, you will find the overwhelming consensus of the top Gunsmiths ( note capital "G") is to bed the receiver only. Bedding the barrel will cause problems as the barrel heats up.

 

[South Pender]

If you do a search on this site and BRC, you will find the overwhelming consensus of the top Gunsmiths ( note capital "G") is to bed the receiver only. Bedding the barrel will cause problems as the barrel heats up.

Yes, I know that this is the usual practice. My only concern (largely put to rest now) was suspending a very heavy barrel from a small action. Let me ask this: Would extending the glass (from a pillar-bedding job) one inch into the barrel channel--to provide some support--with the rest of the barrel floated defeat the benefits of free-floating the barrel?

 

[JRS]

If you do a search on this site and BRC, you will find the overwhelming consensus of the top Gunsmiths ( note capital "G") is to bed the receiver only. Bedding the barrel will cause problems as the barrel heats up.

Yes, I know that this is the usual practice. My only concern (largely put to rest now) was suspending a very heavy barrel from a small action. Let me ask this: Would extending the glass (from a pillar-bedding job) one inch into the barrel channel--to provide some support--with the rest of the barrel floated defeat the benefits of free-floating the barrel?

Absolutely not. Many gunsmiths have/do that very thing. To name just a few: Al Warner, Bob Brackney, Dan Dowling, Stu Harvey, Dave Tooley. I suppose it depends on the gunsmith and the length/weight of the barrel. Is it really that much different from a barrel block configuration, other than the clamping affect? If barrel heat : is going to create a problem with a bit of bedding under a small area of the barrel in front of the action, wouldn't the same would apply with a barrel block? The barrel block certainly isn't going to expand and contract with the barrel. At least not without damaging the stock

 

['Freak]

Any barrel contact, other than its being screwed into a totally stress free bedded receiver; will affect harmonics differently from what harmonics would be if the barrel were truly fully free floated. Then add varying amounts of heat so ever so slightly and variously increasing the barrel’s diameter so it’s bearing against the area of barrel contact with varying amounts of force so inducing various amounts of stress on the barreled action so variously affecting harmonics and causing inconsistencies in how that thing is gonna shoot.

 

[JRS]

Any barrel contact, other than its being screwed into a totally stress free bedded receiver; will affect harmonics differently from what harmonics would be if the barrel were truly fully free floated. Then add varying amounts of heat so ever so slightly and variously increasing the barrel’s diameter so it’s bearing against the area of barrel contact with varying amounts of force so inducing various amounts of stress on the barreled action so variously affecting harmonics and causing inconsistencies in how that thing is gonna shoot.

Would you be so kind, and explain that to Al Warner, and tell him how he screwed up my 1000 yard gun please? Is a barrel block not inducing stress also? I believe the many successful shooters using barrel blocks would have a different opinion. If the barrel is actually doing all of those things, how can the action withstand those inconsistencies, when you take into consideration the very thin bearing surface between the barrel and action. That is of course, if the action isn't heating up with the barrel which would mean the action would be crawling around also ;D

 

['Freak]

I don’t know how the barreled action is setup in the stock when the builder is utilizing a barrel bedding block. I’d assumed it likely that the block would be fixed to the barrel near the balance point, then let into and bedded to the stock to both anchor the barreled action and to act as a recoil lug, and in this case the receiver end would be the one that’s fully floated, dunno.

 

[LHSmith]

Would you be so kind, and explain that to Al Warner, and tell him how he screwed up my 1000 yard gun please? Is a barrel block not inducing stress also?

Hard to argue against someone who has shattered all existing records using a Warner build. :

 

[MQ1]

I don't know how much my 2 cents is worth, but I have a couple Dowling built rifles, and a couple that I've had fun with assembling myself...

Kevin Rayhill suggested that I bed all my Savages 3-4 inches ahead of the recoil lug. I'll be damned, but I've done it to a half dozen rifles, and they all shoot exceedingly well...the lst one was a 6br for my uncle, and he ended up with a hummer of a Criterion barrel...with many 1/4" groups....warm or cold...

I've also bedded my small action CZ527 the same way, and again...shoots very well.

In my experience, as long as you bed it well, bedding ahead of the lug will not necessarily harm the accuracy...it may well change the harmonics of the barrel, however until someone builds a tuning fork for a barrell I don't know how you'd know other than through experimentation...hmmm what an idea....

MQ1

 

[MQ1]

FWIW, I assume that bedding ahead of the recoil lug would not necessarily harm the harmonics as much as mute the harmonics....much like a guitar player mutes the ringing strings by laying his hand ahead of the bridge...the note is still the same, however the note intensity does not have the same duration or volume...

MQ1