Bullet Meplat trimming and pointing perspectives. What works for you?

[Blaster-37]

It's that time of year to get the Bullet Meplat trimming and pointing done if you have not already. Most of us have experienced the improved results of this effort.
I have tried most of the manufactured systems. I get along best with the system John Hoover, Accuracy One, makes. It still was not a perfect system mostly due to bullets irregularities and learning deficiencies on my part. I have spent much of John's time discussing a better tip for several years now. John just sent me one of his new carbide cutters to try. The difference was huge including much more accurate meplat trimming. I think this tight system helps align the bullet better also. This was light years from the Widden full length cutter that tore up the inside of my Wilson many years ago.
We all have our trial and error system to improve a bullet's BC7, how do you do it?
For example, this is briefly my way that I am sure can be improved on.
After Bearing Surface sorting the bullets to 0.01mm, I set the cutter for a group at 0.003" cut. After the meplat trim, I then set the punch die to 0 on that bullet group. I test down to a level where it starts to deform the base or groove the tip about 1/4 " down. I back off a little and do the group watching the results by examining each bullet and marking the foulers. I still don't get them completely closed down as many do with other bullets. I have tried some repetition with limited improvement. Some bullet lots seem to do better.
I have punched 6 hybrids from 17 to 51 depending on the lots and tips, that's huge. Spencer's, Bib's and Lapua's were all different to work. I miss the perfectly CNC turned solids that did not need the help.
There are some great shooters that will share on this site. Let us know what you do. Please explain why and how you got there.This is not a National Security Breech.
Let's keep it positive. Thanx for your advice and experience.
greg

 

[jr600yd]

This is how I do it:
1) you are right to sort your bullets. Bullet length varies from lot to lot and manufacturers. Not uncommon to find several different length in each box.
2) after sorting I adjust my Widden die per the instructions and point.
3) once pointed I trim the meplat. I only trim about .001 - .002
I use moly so I have some additional steps. After pointing I put the bullets in an old pickle jar and fill it with denatured alcohol and shake them around some. This removes any oil from my hands, residue from the manufacturing process. Once completed I let them air dry (only takes a few minutes) and begin the moly process.

 

[Terry]

My goal is increasing overall consistency. Using the Whidden pointer I close the points by 50%. By doing this the bullets with variations are visible. If they are long the hole closes a little tighter, if they are short it is larger. It's easy to sort visually if you choose to do so. Some bullets look like the tips were cut with a machete. Pointing them 50% uniforms them.

Consistent,that's all i'm looking for.

 

[PMA3]

I also use the Hoover meplat trimmer and tipping die. I find meplat trimming to be my "most" frustrating procedure in all of the steps for 1000 yd BR reloading. Last August I prepped 500 Berger 6MM 105 hybrids and just finished another 500 2 days ago. These bullets were all from the same lot# of 4000 I bought last July.

I sort by diameter first, looking for that oddball. All 1000 bullets were .2432"-.2434", no oddballs.
I then use the Buhay comparator to sort by .001" bearing surface increments and got 8 + or - lots each time.
Now for the meplat trimming. The first 500 I took a representative sample (about 10-15%) from each .001" lot to find the shortest bullet, then set up the trimmer off that bullet to cut .005" off the tip to clean it up and make it square. I then trimmed ALL 500 bullets to that OAL which turned out be be 1.230". The range of OAL from these 500 bullets was 1.235"-1.250". Thus, the amount of cut ranged from .005"-.020".
I wasn't pleased with taking up to .020" off this group, so for the next 500 I measured ALL 500 rather than take a representative sample. The range of OAL for these 500 was 1.234"-1.252". I left the trimmer set at 1.230" and trimmed ALL bullets to 1.230" again. A few friends suggested "pre tipping" the bullets BEFORE meplat trimming to make the OAL more uniform for trimming. I tried that for 4 .001"lots but found that all the pre tipping did for me was extend the range by the amount the tipping lengthens the bullet(about .003"). Basically, the 1.234"-1.252" became 1.237"-1.255". In order to make bullets uniform in length, i still had to take off .004"-.022".
My most consistent trim-to-lengths were achieved with the steel cutter and crank handle. The carbide cutter used with the power adaptor, using a power screwdriver or drill, produced unacceptacle lengths.
Tipping the bullets was the easiest part for me. I followed the directions (also watched the video for a refresher) and ended up tipping ALL bullets .030" to get the close up diameter I wanted.
Getting CONSISTENT OAL's with the meplat trimmer has been an issue. I know an uneven boat tail will cause SOME bullets to trim differently, but approx. 30% (300 of 1000) had a variance of more than .001" in OAL,
still not acceptable IMHO.....I could live with 3-5%.
Final step was to weight sort each BS .001" lot into half tenth groups.(108.00"-108.04", etc.)
Lot of time and effort goes into searching for the perfect bullet.

 

[Blaster-37]

Thank you. This is great feedback. Keep it coming. Bullet processing seems to take up more bench time than any other loading discipline. I personally know it is worth the effort with group feedback. Like everything else with 1000 yard BR, it can always be done better as perfection seems unobtainable, (1 hole 10 shot group, repeatable...).

Paul, I quit using the power screwdriver and just put black tape on the hex portion of the adaptor. The new carbide cutter works surprisingly accurate just by using my thumb and forefinger. I can feel the cut and do not rip the tip nearly as much as the power screwdriver can do with the old cutter. It requires very little effort as the spin is easy, fast and accurate.
I assumed the punch did not lengthen the bullet. It does not if I trim first. I measured 10 bullets before and after base to tip. I will test some again by punching first before trimming. This might give me a tighter tip. I can't close them down completely without compromising the integrity of the HB bullet.
By trimming first, I am getting a 0.0360" at the tip with 6 Hybrids. The last few 1000 lots produced 0.0400-0.0450s with the old cutter and power screwdriver. What are you getting?
greg

 

[PMA3]

Greg, I found it very hard to consistently measure the tip diameter with a 1" mic. I tip the bullets until the hole is almost closed up, then check a few under a B&L microscope to visually make sure the amount of closure is where I want it....for me, starting at 0, then screwing the die down in .005" increments, I ended up at .030" for both lots of 500.

If I tipped the bullets BEFORE or AFTER trimming, it didn't seem to matter as I still got about a .003" stretch either way, so I quit the pre tip and just tip AFTER trimming. If you tip first, then trim WITHOUT tipping again, I believe you lower the BC of the bullet.

I like your idea on using the carbide cutter by hand and will try it the next time.