I recently sold my tumbler, corn media, etc. Hardly used it. I liked the IOSSO dip solution. But now I'm going to start shooting XTC again and will have considerably more brass to clean. I was looking at the ultrasonic cleaners. Was decided on one of those until I ran across the article on here about the stainless media tumblers. From what I've seen of both, they do a really good job. But it seems the stainless media does a little better and the fact that the media is infinitely usuable is another plus. So which is better in your opinion?
Brass cleaning. Which is better?
- Thread starter schumi
- Start date
For the stainless steel media, you will need a real tumbler with a rubber inner liner, not a vibratory tumbler. The Thumbler's Tumbler model B is about $180 - $200 or so, more expensive than the RCBS, Lyman, etc., vibratory tumblers that use corncob or walnut media.
Using the SS media is a wet process - water, dishwasher soap and a surfactant (Lemishine). After you buy the SS media ($25-$50, depending on the source) and the tumbler, the operating costs are minimal. There is a bit of a learning curve, pouring off the water, rinsing, separating the SS media from the brass without pouring the SS media down the drain, then drying the brass. The brass ends up "almost new" clean, inside and out. it helps to deprime first, both to clean the primer pockets and to dry the cases faster. This will add a step to your usual brass processing if you usually deprime/size as one step. Occasionally the SS pins get stuck in the flash holes, no big deal to push them out - maybe 1-2% of the cases for small primer brass. You will need a rotating brass/media separator - more startup cost.
A vibratory tumbler with walnut/corncob media has a lower startup cost, but you will have to keep buying the media. Your tumbling times will increase as the media gets dirty. Frequently the primer pockets fill with impacted media if you deprime first. This is probably the "easiest" method. Smart guys buy walnut media in bulk at pet stores, so this makes the media cost fairly low.
The small ultrasonic units will do relatively few cases at a time, limited by the power of the transducer, not the size of the tub. However, they typically need only 20 min or so per batch, compared to hours for the wet tumber or dry vibratory tumber. The cases will be very clean, inside and out, like the SS/water/dishwasher soap method. Larger, commercial US units are much more expensive. The smaller US units are $70-$100. Disposable costs are minimal - vinegar, a drop or two of dishwasher soap, baking soda, Lemishine surfactant that you get at Walmart.
Link: http://www.6mmbr.com/ultrasonic.html
Just pick one and go with it. With either the vibratory tumbler or the real tumbling tumbler, it helps to have a rotating case/media separator. Almost mandatory, in my opinion. You don't need that with the US cleaner.
I have a Harbor Freight 2.5 liter ultrasonic unit that I will sell for $40 + shipping if you are interested. I think the current "sale" price is $70, and you might find a 20% off coupon as well. Used little, like new with original box. I ended up buying the SS media and expensive tumbler as a special "deal", so I won't need the Ultrasonic cleaner. Send a PM or email if interested.
Randy
Using the SS media is a wet process - water, dishwasher soap and a surfactant (Lemishine). After you buy the SS media ($25-$50, depending on the source) and the tumbler, the operating costs are minimal. There is a bit of a learning curve, pouring off the water, rinsing, separating the SS media from the brass without pouring the SS media down the drain, then drying the brass. The brass ends up "almost new" clean, inside and out. it helps to deprime first, both to clean the primer pockets and to dry the cases faster. This will add a step to your usual brass processing if you usually deprime/size as one step. Occasionally the SS pins get stuck in the flash holes, no big deal to push them out - maybe 1-2% of the cases for small primer brass. You will need a rotating brass/media separator - more startup cost.
A vibratory tumbler with walnut/corncob media has a lower startup cost, but you will have to keep buying the media. Your tumbling times will increase as the media gets dirty. Frequently the primer pockets fill with impacted media if you deprime first. This is probably the "easiest" method. Smart guys buy walnut media in bulk at pet stores, so this makes the media cost fairly low.
The small ultrasonic units will do relatively few cases at a time, limited by the power of the transducer, not the size of the tub. However, they typically need only 20 min or so per batch, compared to hours for the wet tumber or dry vibratory tumber. The cases will be very clean, inside and out, like the SS/water/dishwasher soap method. Larger, commercial US units are much more expensive. The smaller US units are $70-$100. Disposable costs are minimal - vinegar, a drop or two of dishwasher soap, baking soda, Lemishine surfactant that you get at Walmart.
Link: http://www.6mmbr.com/ultrasonic.html
Just pick one and go with it. With either the vibratory tumbler or the real tumbling tumbler, it helps to have a rotating case/media separator. Almost mandatory, in my opinion. You don't need that with the US cleaner.
I have a Harbor Freight 2.5 liter ultrasonic unit that I will sell for $40 + shipping if you are interested. I think the current "sale" price is $70, and you might find a 20% off coupon as well. Used little, like new with original box. I ended up buying the SS media and expensive tumbler as a special "deal", so I won't need the Ultrasonic cleaner. Send a PM or email if interested.
Randy
I use the cheapest Thumblers model A? tumbler with SS media and in 2 hours the brass looks better than new with no rubbing or scrubbing. You can split a load of media with a friend since only half a bag is needed if doing 50-100 cases a time.
Just throw brass in the drum with warm water and a dash of liquid dish soap and pinch of lemishine and tumble and couple hours later pull out the shiney brass then rinse out drum of stainless media a few seconds under the spigot while still in the drum. If you won't do any more tumbling for a week you just spread the stainless media on a shamwow to dry and your ready for next time. It's fast and will last forever.
Trick: to keep media from sticking inside the case when you remove them from the drum hold case inverted UNDER THE WATER in the drum and give a quick shake and that allows the media to fall out without sticktion.
Just throw brass in the drum with warm water and a dash of liquid dish soap and pinch of lemishine and tumble and couple hours later pull out the shiney brass then rinse out drum of stainless media a few seconds under the spigot while still in the drum. If you won't do any more tumbling for a week you just spread the stainless media on a shamwow to dry and your ready for next time. It's fast and will last forever.
Trick: to keep media from sticking inside the case when you remove them from the drum hold case inverted UNDER THE WATER in the drum and give a quick shake and that allows the media to fall out without sticktion.
I was looking at the same thing. I like the tumbler vs vibrator cleaning of brass. I did not like the idea of the SS rod media. I am just concerned with the SS rod being rough on my brass.
I found some brass rod media at H&H gunshop in Tulsa that I have and will use once my tumbler comes in. (Its on its way as we type....)
I found some brass rod media at H&H gunshop in Tulsa that I have and will use once my tumbler comes in. (Its on its way as we type....)
I recently bought a thumlers tumbler with the ss media, and have been very impressed with it. I can only clean 2 lbs of brass at a time but that is about all that I could get into a vibratory cleaner. I ordered the tumbler and media, got in the mail 2 days later. Which I thought was awesome.
I switched from ultrasonic to stainless media about 2 months ago. It's a bit of an investment to get started, but well worth it IMHO. Ultrasonic was more work, took longer, and did not get the cases as clean as the stainless method. Also, I'm concerned about how long the ultrasonic machines will last under heavy use. Another nice thing about the stainless method is I can dump 210 cases in one setting. This is supposed to be more brass than recommended, but I simply remove enough water to keep the brass/water combo below 10lbs. This insures the tumbler is not over-stressed and the brass still gets super clean.
I"ve got 3 ultrasonic cleaners and a gallon of Citrinox if anyone is interested!
I"ve got 3 ultrasonic cleaners and a gallon of Citrinox if anyone is interested!
I have finally settled on the process.
Wet thumlers tumbler with brass rod media for four hours or so, then dry, lube and resize, then walnut in a vibratory polisher to remove lube.
Thats it.
Long process. It does a good job tho.
Wet thumlers tumbler with brass rod media for four hours or so, then dry, lube and resize, then walnut in a vibratory polisher to remove lube.
Thats it.
Long process. It does a good job tho.
scotharr said:
I'll stick with the Ultrasonic for my go to cleaning method, I use the same "wet" components as most listed above, water, dish soap, Lim-n-shine, the brass comes out clean, I don't care if it looks like "BLING". Add 500-800 .223 Rem. into the basket, dunk it, turn it on and in 20-30 mins. you have clean brass, couldn't be easier.
I've had the same unit for close to 30 yrs. now, an L & R 28 that has cleaned well over a 1/2 million rounds of brass, gun parts and an unknown number of carburators through the years, I don't think "hard work" has hurt it.
Are any of you folks that are using the stainless media having issues with the case mouths being peened during cleaning? When I first heard of this process, I remember someone saying that the case mouths needed to be deburred after tumbling. Perhaps it was for a tight neck chamber?
memilanuk said:
Well Monte it's not as big as Jay Leno's in his Garage, it's 11"x12"x10" and came out of a old Jewler, Clock Repair shop in the early 80's and is an Industral unit, not a "hobby unit".
I have seen one of the Harbour Freight ones die in just under 2 weeks at a small engine shop cleaning carbs, so I wouldn't expect one to last long with the amounts I've cleaned. My brother and his son go through close to 20-25 K each per year with their NFA Toys, so I think it's paid for between the 3 of us.
I'm the one who mentioned that in another post. Yes, slight peening occurs: it's probably from the brass cases bumping into each other and not the media. This probably could be minimized with more water and less brass at one time. I addressed this issue by using my Giraud trimmer every firing.fayettefatts said:
I also use the Thumbler with 3mm ceramic media which in indestructable and good forever . The media is easy to rinse and from the cases .The cases can be placed in an oven at 180- degrees for 1 hr to dry.The finish is impeccable . Most handgun cases are not deprimed prior to tumbling but rifle cases can be if the prime pockets need more help. cost is $6.00 / lb for ceramic medfia. you need about 3# with a small amount of detergent to do roughly 300-400 cases . The thumbler cv=can be filled almost to the tip with enough water to cover thre cases . Merv
I use a Thumblers Model A which is the cheap model that has a rounder drum unlike the expensive models with the flat faceted sides that probably promotes a more robust tumbling effect (for better or worse?)
My brass comes out shiney new looking but if you look really close in good light there is sort of a micro-peening texture to the entire surface and is very very subtle and not peened or dented in any way you would think and almost surely not enough to effect accuracy and definately no noticable peening of the necks visible even with a hi-power magnifier. The neck peening that folks seem to talk about may be urban legend? as a few have mentioned being worried about it but nobody actually seeing it? and i was also concerned till trying it but am a convert after doing a few batches and to call it a texture even is probably an exaggeration its really not measurable and has to be seen to appreciate as you can't feel it.
I only use half of the media which if memory serves is about 2 1/2 pounds and never tumble more than 100 rounds at a time and could not be happier with the method.
My brass comes out shiney new looking but if you look really close in good light there is sort of a micro-peening texture to the entire surface and is very very subtle and not peened or dented in any way you would think and almost surely not enough to effect accuracy and definately no noticable peening of the necks visible even with a hi-power magnifier. The neck peening that folks seem to talk about may be urban legend? as a few have mentioned being worried about it but nobody actually seeing it? and i was also concerned till trying it but am a convert after doing a few batches and to call it a texture even is probably an exaggeration its really not measurable and has to be seen to appreciate as you can't feel it.
I only use half of the media which if memory serves is about 2 1/2 pounds and never tumble more than 100 rounds at a time and could not be happier with the method.
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