Beyond Stumped!

[Butte Sink]

My Giraud is driving me nuts!!
I’m getting variations in trim length .0035 - .005

I FL case and they are all spot on with a few differences .0005??

280 AI
Nosler Brass

I was using Whidden lock rings but canned those and went back to Hornady lock rings, still no luck.
I have had issue with locking the whidden allen screw and get movement

I tried cleaning all Giraud components, still no luck

The only thing I can think of is that it may have something interfering with spring loaded case holder? I cleaned it twice

My 300RUM is a non spring holder and I have had no issues at all.

Any ideas??

 

[vonb]

How many rounds has the Giraud trimmed? Is it possible it's bearing play?

 

[243winxb]

From instructions-
Flipping the trimmer vertical allows you to let the brass shavings naturally drop
away from the cutter and shell holder. If you use the trimmer horizontally,
eventually you will get shavings inside the case holder. With shavings in the
case holder, the index for the case shoulder is no longer true. Your cases will
come out longer by the same length the shavings prevent the case from entering
the case holder.

 

[mac86951]

Also, don't forget thermal expansion; are you seeing variation case to case; or first piece to last piece?

 

[K22]

Not familiar at all with the Giraud trimmer but the mention of a "spring" sent up a red flag for me.

I have never had any consistency problems with the Wilson trimmer (with Sinclair upgrades) but there are no "springs" involved, just metal to metal contact with a Dylon bearing washer on the inside of the handle.

 

[Butte Sink]

How many rounds has the Giraud trimmed? Is it possible it's bearing play?

400 +/- runs smooth no issues

 

[Butte Sink]

From instructions-
Flipping the trimmer vertical allows you to let the brass shavings naturally drop
away from the cutter and shell holder. If you use the trimmer horizontally,
eventually you will get shavings inside the case holder. With shavings in the
case holder, the index for the case shoulder is no longer true. Your cases will
come out longer by the same length the shavings prevent the case from entering
the case holder.

Thanks Yes I have always run it vertical, again no issues at all with my non spring holder

 

[Butte Sink]

Also, don't forget thermal expansion; are you seeing variation case to case; or first piece to last piece?

Thanks
It's case to case

 

[Butte Sink]

Just not a fan of this spring holder

I think I'm going to try and find someone that maybe able to make me a custom non spring holder.

By chance, does anyone know of anyone?
I asked my gun maker sometime ago about that and no luck there, wasn't something he had ever done but really, he probably didnt have the time

 

[Gabe22BR]

Why not remove the spring?

 

[shoot4fun]

Thanks Yes I have always run it vertical, again no issues at all with my non spring holder

Two things I learned about the Giraud trimmer.
You are FL sizing BEFORE trimming. If you have any variance in your post FL sized brass you will have same in your trimmed brass.
Also, as I learned with ALL tools used in the reloading process, you must be consistent and learn to feel just how your processes are.
Oh, one other thing that can cause you pains, I found that the amount of neck length sized can cause very big swings in trim length. The necks need to be sized down past a certain point in order to fit in the case holder properly.

 

[mongo chicago]

Why not contact Giraud?

 

[Shooter13]

Have you checked the cutter? Use another side of the 3 way cutter and adjust.

 

[Butte Sink]

Two things I learned about the Giraud trimmer.
You are FL sizing BEFORE trimming. If you have any variance in your post FL sized brass you will have same in your trimmed brass.
Also, as I learned with ALL tools used in the reloading process, you must be consistent and learn to feel just how your processes are.
Oh, one other thing that can cause you pains, I found that the amount of neck length sized can cause very big swings in trim length. The necks need to be sized down past a certain point in order to fit in the case holder properly.

Exactly!
Yes I FL before trimming and have a few variations of .0005, most part they are all spot on.
I to thought maybe inconsistent downward pressure but the shoulder bottoms out in the holder.
After trimming, I'll check my Base to Datum and it's dead nuts as prior, CRAZY!!

You know I did not mention, that this is new brass but I wouldn't think it would mattter with a consistent Base to Datum
I'll put a call into Giraud and get there thoughts.
50 rounds, I'm going to shoot them, get them formed and try again.
Wierd, not the first time I've trmmed for 280, just dont recall having any issues like this before but is the first time with new brass??


You can not just pull the spring, two separte parts.

I like how they do their 30cal + holders, 1 unit, no spring

 

[Butte Sink]

Have you checked the cutter? Use another side of the 3 way cutter and adjust.

Are you suggesting "use another side' of the chamfered edge?
Now it is slightly favored to the inside neck

 

[Shooter13]

Are you suggesting "use another side' of the chamfered edge?
Now it is slightly favored to the inside neck

The cutter itself has 3 edges to cut with, I'm suggesting you "flip it" to a different cutting edge as the edges or blades do wear after a while.

 

[Butte Sink]

The cutter itself has 3 edges to cut with, I'm suggesting you "flip it" to a different cutting edge as the edges or blades do wear after a while.

Well I'll be damned, I had no idea
I think I'll try and rotate it

Thank You!!

 

[akajun]

Make sure your brass is clean, not shiny but at least tumbled to knock off tarnish and burrs on the body. Try cleaning your die , the case holder on a gr indexes off the shoulder so a buildup can cause problems as can overlubrication or dirt.

Proper adjustment of the cutter is crucial and make sure the set screw is tight. To adjust my cutter I use the supplied case or chamfer one by hand to the desired angles and set it with that.
Lastly you can disassemble the case holders , at least the older ones idk if there’s been a change, I’ve made solid ones for straight wall case that index off a shelholder from a Lee hand trimmer for 30 carbine and 45/70
A conversation with Doug said that the spring is necessary for consistency so the few I’ve made for oddball stuff I’ve used the spring

FYI I run mine vertical as you do the chips fall. If all brass is annealed before and from the same gun then I can hit .001+- but if rangepickup or different guns .002+- is not uncommon. I’ve also found the more you take off the more variation you get.