Berger 180g Hybrid OAL

[Dave M.]

Hey guys,
I took a brand new box of 500 Berger 180g hybrids and sorted them based on OAL. Total variance in box was 0.0155”. In my Berger 105g hybrids, the max variance is never more than .005-.006”. I was astounded how inconsistent this box of 500 Berger 180g hybrids was. Pictures attached below. Take special note of the crazy short one at 1.5075” (5 thou shorter than ANY other bullet in the box). Good job on Berger to almost hit the 500 bullets on the nose with 499 total in the box. Call me crazy but I think Berger should ALWAYS err on the high side with regard to quantity in the box. Nobody should EVER get LESS than 500 in a box, especially considering what we pay for these bullets.

Dave M.

 

[prwhite]

Remember this: assembling the two parts (cup and core) each with their own manufacturing tolerance you will get the extremes of short/short, long/long and the mid range of short/long, long/short and perfect/perfect, with the last three combos being the most found.

 

[Sandstorm]

Whats your lot #
Mine never seem to be that bad ....

 

[barefooter56]

Hey guys,
I took a brand new box of 500 Berger 180g hybrids and sorted them based on OAL. Total variance in box was 0.0155”. In my Berger 105g hybrids, the max variance is never more than .005-.006”. I was astounded how inconsistent this box of 500 Berger 180g hybrids was. Pictures attached below. Take special note of the crazy short one at 1.5075” (5 thou shorter than ANY other bullet in the box). Good job on Berger to almost hit the 500 bullets on the nose with 499 total in the box. Call me crazy but I think Berger should ALWAYS err on the high side with regard to quantity in the box. Nobody should EVER get LESS than 500 in a box, especially considering what we pay for these bullets.

Dave M.

View attachment 1373224

The biggest variance from bullet to bullet in a box of bullets is the bullet OAL. The dimensions that we track within A LOT OF BULLETS . Are the bullet base to ogive and the bullet weight. :https://bergerbullets.com/information/why-berger/
If you are worried about the affect on this on the BC variance it is not a factor as in testing we found that the BC variance in a box of BERGER BULLETS is less than 1%.

 

[tthomp302]

yeah, the more important measurement would be bullet base to ogive.

 

[davidjoe]

Call me crazy but I think Berger should ALWAYS err on the high side with regard to quantity in the box. Nobody should EVER get LESS than 500 in a box, especially considering what we pay for these bullets.

Dave M.

View attachment 1373224

Those Blue boxes of Lapua brass sure are off on count often, doesn’t even matter what cartridge it is. Wonder if they know .

I can say this about the 180’s, they are the favorite, - Berger has different levels of tip “improvement” - some of which might conceivably shrink that particular variance somewhat, (190 comes to mind) but those processes have never been as well-received by the match guys as the unchanged, highly tippable180H.

 

[tthomp302]

Those Blue boxes of Lapua brass sure are off on count often, doesn’t even matter what cartridge it is. Wonder if they know .

I can say this about the 180’s, they are the favorite, - Berger has different levels of tip “improvement” - some of which might conceivably shrink that particular variance somewhat, (190 comes to mind) but those processes have never been as well-received by the match guys as the unchanged, highly tippable180H.

It is rather funny. The 180s just plain shoot...it was very easy to find a load and tune it well. They work great for long range and wreck deer and other critters just fine.

 

[Dave M.]

Whats your lot #
Mine never seem to be that bad ....

P02846

 

[Dave M.]

Remember this: assembling the two parts (cup and core) each with their own manufacturing tolerance you will get the extremes of short/short, long/long and the mid range of short/long, long/short and perfect/perfect, with the last three combos being the most found.

I’m very familiar with manufacturing processes and their inherent associated tolerances. I’ve never seen a box of Berger hybrids of any weight or size that had this much variation.
Dave

 

[davidjoe]

I’m measuring them, too, and I have been glad that I recently started doing this. I try to set length parameters, basically regardless of the bullet, so as to get 50-60 percent of a large box to fall into the “middle”.

Those will be shot together. The shorts and longs will each be loaded into 50 or 100 count boxes together. That eliminates the possibility of a longest and a shortest being consecutively shot.

 

[Dave M.]

The biggest variance from bullet to bullet in a box of bullets is the bullet OAL. The dimensions that we track within A LOT OF BULLETS . Are the bullet base to ogive and the bullet weight. :https://bergerbullets.com/information/why-berger/
If you are worried about the affect on this on the BC variance it is not a factor as in testing we found that the BC variance in a box of BERGER BULLETS is less than 1%.

Who is we? I plan to shoot the outliers from the shortest versus the longest and see what the BC difference is.
Have you read Litz’s book that discusses trimming and sorting? OAL can have a fairly decent effect on the BC and therefore vertical at 1000 yards.
Dave

 

[Dave M.]

I’m measuring them, too, and I have been glad that I recently started doing this. I try to set length parameters, basically regardless of the bullet, so as to get 50-60 percent of a large box to fall into the “middle”.

Those will be shot together. The shorts and longs will each be loaded into 50 or 100 count boxes together. That eliminates the possibility of a longest and a shortest being consecutively shot.

Exactly what I’m doing David.

 

[Dave M.]

I’m measuring them, too, and I have been glad that I recently started doing this. I try to set length parameters, basically regardless of the bullet, so as to get 50-60 percent of a large box to fall into the “middle”.

Those will be shot together. The shorts and longs will each be loaded into 50 or 100 count boxes together. That eliminates the possibility of a longest and a shortest being consecutively shot.

Measuring bullets for OAL is a real PITA. How are you doing it to get consistent results. I just bought a measuring stand from Bama6ppc and I’m hoping to get a fixture made that will simplify getting consistent results.
Dave

 

[davidjoe]

Right, it’s hard to consistently get exactly the same measurement, if I revisit the same bullets, which is why I’m content with only the three sifts. I’m just using quality digital calipers and setting zero at the mean length after about 20-25 have been measured, then I put those back in the box and start over.

I agree it’s difficult. The pressure applied needs to be very consistent and so I like to measure many of them in one sitting,

There will be a “break” number at the low and high end, that could put the bullet in either the big middle sift, or not, and for those I’ll eyeball the quantities accumulating, and place them accordingly, with an eye to avoiding an unusable amount of either low or high end bullets.

 

[Ned Ludd]

I have length-sorted Berger bullets for the purpose of pointing them for years. Typical OAL variance within a single Lot# is typically about .015", and sometimes I might find a very small number of extreme outliers that would boost the variance to around .020" to .025" or slightly more. The bullets I have length-sorted regularly include 80.5 Fullbores, 90 VLDs, 168 Hybrids, 175 OTMs, 185 Juggernauts, 185 Hybrids, and 200.20Xs. Having about a .015" OAL variance has been routine for all of them. So although I have never specifically sorted 180 Hybrids, an OAL variance of .0155" seems about average as compared to the other Berger bullets I have routinely sorted.

 

[Sandstorm]

Yup .i make 3 piles out of my 1000 and dont get too worked up about exact numbers.
The wind will haunt you ir regardless of how well you sorted…