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AR Side Charging Uppers

When you put an adjustable stock on an AR most designs that I have seen prevent the use of the charging handle. One design to solve this problem involves installing a knob on the bolt carrier. This design is limited to the minimum threads allowed by the thickness of the bolt carrier. Also the knob cycles with the bolt and must be removed to clean the rifle. I have seen a better design by High Performance International which has the side charging handle made into the top of the upper receiver and does not cycle with the bolt, a much better design. However HPI is currently not building them. Is anyone aware of another source for a product that gets this done without the knob screwed into the bolt carrier?
 
I seem to recall several out there. The ones I'd be looking at would be with the nonreciprocating charge handle. One that immediately comes to mind is the JP Rifles one that comes complete for $900. There are others that run around $300 just for the receiver and handle I believe.
 
There are several out there. Gibbz is one. Check out http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_3_4/682956_Side_Charging_.html for info. Vic
 
hdbiker1 said:
I seem to recall several out there. The ones I'd be looking at would be with the nonreciprocating charge handle. One that immediately comes to mind is the JP Rifles one that comes complete for $900. There are others that run around $300 just for the receiver and handle I believe.
Thanks for the response. It looks like they are all using the basic design. The non reciprocating feature is what I am looking for but these all seem to be on the left side of the receiver. For my application the charging handle needs to be on the right.
 
vlcakc said:
There are several out there. Gibbz is one. Check out http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_3_4/682956_Side_Charging_.html for info. Vic
Thanks for the response. Please see my response to hdbiker1 above.
 
You probably would have to go with a left port upper. See https://gibbzarms.com/?product=g4-left-handed-side-charging-upper-receiver for an example. Vic
 
So the non reciprocating type would be threaded into the charging handle instead of bcg. I think one could mill it, but it might structurally weaken the picatinny rail. I agree that I'd rather not have one reciprocate, but truthfully the bcg in my humble opinion is a better answer reciprocating or not. Since I don't use side charging handles, I have found the BCM gunfighter in medium more than appropriate, or the ambidextrous version, and it doesn't reciprocate.

-Mac
 
vlcakc said:
You probably would have to go with a left port upper. See https://gibbzarms.com/?product=g4-left-handed-side-charging-upper-receiver for an example. Vic
Thanks for your response. I am right handed so the left handed option is not suitable for me and my application. I have a High Performance International (HPI) upper with a right handed side charging nonreciprocating handle built into the upper portion of the receiver and it works well. The problem is that HPI is not currently making them. If you are right handed and you try one of the right handed HPI side charging uppers you would find it superior to other options. This is America and the free market gives us what we desire so I am sure there is a market of this design.
 
mac86951 said:
So the non reciprocating type would be threaded into the charging handle instead of bcg. I think one could mill it, but it might structurally weaken the picatinny rail. I agree that I'd rather not have one reciprocate, but truthfully the bcg in my humble opinion is a better answer reciprocating or not. Since I don't use side charging handles, I have found the BCM gunfighter in medium more than appropriate, or the ambidextrous version, and it doesn't reciprocate.

-Mac
Mac, thanks for your response. Please tell me what the bcg is, I am sure I should know but I can not remember. I looked up the BCB gunfighter it looks like it does not solve the problem for the configuration where the AR is used in the high power rifle match rifle configuration because the adjustable buttstock assembly prevents the use of the standard design charging handle.
 
T-REX said:
mac86951 said:
So the non reciprocating type would be threaded into the charging handle instead of bcg. I think one could mill it, but it might structurally weaken the picatinny rail. I agree that I'd rather not have one reciprocate, but truthfully the bcg in my humble opinion is a better answer reciprocating or not. Since I don't use side charging handles, I have found the BCM gunfighter in medium more than appropriate, or the ambidextrous version, and it doesn't reciprocate.

-Mac
Mac, thanks for your response. Please tell me what the bcg is, I am sure I should know but I can not remember. I looked up the BCB gunfighter it looks like it does not solve the problem for the configuration where the AR is used in the high power rifle match rifle configuration because the adjustable buttstock assembly prevents the use of the standard design charging handle.

Ahh, I get it now. Yes it is tricky as some adjustable cheek pads have a bitch cut out for the charging handle. The bcg is short for bolt carrier group.

There are those that solved this dilemma, and those like that move the scope back and use a pad at a location that allows the charging handle to work, combined with an increase in length of pull. If you are not limited to A2 stock, then you should be allowed something like a White Oak adjustable, or a Fulton armory adjustable butt pad.

Larue has another method as the CTR attachment slides with charging handle, and I believe the LuthAR stock leaves clearance as well.

I apologize to have to give this answer, but if you are shooting high power and are allowed an adjustable stock, there are manufacturers out there who have solved your problem if cheek height/charging handle. I'd recommend the full match stock like White Oak.

-Mac
 
mac86951 said:
T-REX said:
mac86951 said:
So the non reciprocating type would be threaded into the charging handle instead of bcg. I think one could mill it, but it might structurally weaken the picatinny rail. I agree that I'd rather not have one reciprocate, but truthfully the bcg in my humble opinion is a better answer reciprocating or not. Since I don't use side charging handles, I have found the BCM gunfighter in medium more than appropriate, or the ambidextrous version, and it doesn't reciprocate.

-Mac
Mac, thanks for your response. Please tell me what the bcg is, I am sure I should know but I can not remember. I looked up the BCB gunfighter it looks like it does not solve the problem for the configuration where the AR is used in the high power rifle match rifle configuration because the adjustable buttstock assembly prevents the use of the standard design charging handle.

Ahh, I get it now. Yes it is tricky as some adjustable cheek pads have a bitch cut out for the charging handle. The bcg is short for bolt carrier group.

There are those that solved this dilemma, and those like that move the scope back and use a pad at a location that allows the charging handle to work, combined with an increase in length of pull. If you are not limited to A2 stock, then you should be allowed something like a White Oak adjustable, or a Fulton armory adjustable butt pad.

Larue has another method as the CTR attachment slides with charging handle, and I believe the LuthAR stock leaves clearance as well.

I apologize to have to give this answer, but if you are shooting high power and are allowed an adjustable stock, there are manufacturers out there who have solved your problem if cheek height/charging handle. I'd recommend the full match stock like White Oak.

-Mac
Mac, bcg = bolt carrier group, got it thanks. I am shooting the NRA match rifle configuration. I am using the White Oak Armament adjustable buttstock which is not compatible with the standard charging handle. The HPI sided charging handle works perfect for this application but the problem is that it is not currently available and I am looking for an acceptable substitute. Thanks again.
 
mac86951 said:
T-REX said:
mac86951 said:
So the non reciprocating type would be threaded into the charging handle instead of bcg. I think one could mill it, but it might structurally weaken the picatinny rail. I agree that I'd rather not have one reciprocate, but truthfully the bcg in my humble opinion is a better answer reciprocating or not. Since I don't use side charging handles, I have found the BCM gunfighter in medium more than appropriate, or the ambidextrous version, and it doesn't reciprocate.

-Mac
Mac, thanks for your response. Please tell me what the bcg is, I am sure I should know but I can not remember. I looked up the BCB gunfighter it looks like it does not solve the problem for the configuration where the AR is used in the high power rifle match rifle configuration because the adjustable buttstock assembly prevents the use of the standard design charging handle.

Ahh, I get it now. Yes it is tricky as some adjustable cheek pads have a bitch cut out for the charging handle. The bcg is short for bolt carrier group.

There are those that solved this dilemma, and those like that move the scope back and use a pad at a location that allows the charging handle to work, combined with an increase in length of pull. If you are not limited to A2 stock, then you should be allowed something like a White Oak adjustable, or a Fulton armory adjustable butt pad.

Larue has another method as the CTR attachment slides with charging handle, and I believe the LuthAR stock leaves clearance as well.

I apologize to have to give this answer, but if you are shooting high power and are allowed an adjustable stock, there are manufacturers out there who have solved your problem if cheek height/charging handle. I'd recommend the full match stock like White Oak.

-Mac
One other point, although I have shot the NRA National Match Course with the M14 in the NRA service rifle category, I am experimenting with shooting the National Match Course with an AR match rifle and with a scope. This requires the ability to adjust the axial position of the scope for each NMC shooting position; standing, sitting and prone. This requires the scope ocular lens to be in the exact position, both vertical and axial to accommodate each of the shooting positions. The match rifle with adjustable buttstock has adjustments for stock length, cheek height, hand stop etc. but the axial position of the scope must also be adjustable and is critical to attaining the proper position. It is important not to compromise the shooting position to properly see thru the scope but to have the ability to make scope position adjustment to obtain the best shooting position. The proper configuration side charging upper is critical to achieving this objective.
 
I've built 3 rifles using a right side charging handle and have had zero problems with the handles getting loose. The carrier has to be drilled and tapped and the port has to be modified. I use blue lock-tite to secure the handle to the carrier.
 
racesnake said:
I've built 3 rifles using a right side charging handle and have had zero problems with the handles getting loose. The carrier has to be drilled and tapped and the port has to be modified. I use blue lock-tite to secure the handle to the carrier.
I understand completely, I have one like you describe and have used the low strength lock-tite however I shoot the National Match Course and I clean the rifle after each match so the handle has to come off each time, not good. I have a right handed, side charging upper by High Performance International which has a non reciprocating side charging bolt built into the upper receiver, a much better design. However HPI is currently not making them and I am looking for another source for this design. Thanks again for your response.
 
vlcakc said:
You probably would have to go with a left port upper. See https://gibbzarms.com/?product=g4-left-handed-side-charging-upper-receiver for an example. Vic
Thanks. The HPI side charging upper has the charging handle (knob) on the right with the loading port on the same side. The HPI has the charging function in the top of the receiver so I know it is possible to have the knob on the right side and same side as the port. All of the options that we have discussed here have the charging function on the left side of the receiver and are probably all the same basic design.
 
With the charging handle on the left side, a right handed shooter doesn't have to take their hand off of the fire controls group to cycle the bolt. Nor are you breaking butt stock to shoulder contact.
 
BMW said:
With the charging handle on the left side, a right handed shooter doesn't have to take their hand off of the fire controls group to cycle the bolt. Nor are you breaking butt stock to shoulder contact.

You've never shot an NRA-style spacegun in XTC competition then. Righties use their left hand with a glove on to support the front of their rifle in 3 of 4 positions fired. Add a sling, wrapped around left arm & back of left hand, trying to use left hand to cycle bolt manually would require completely breaking down any position other than offhand.

You don't need to re-Loktite charging handle every cleaning. I use blue on mine, clean & add new blue maybe every three cleanings. Doesn't loosen up if properly tightened during reassembly.
 
I'd seriously reconsider whether or not cleaning was required between each stage. Your rifle should be reliable to shoot hundreds of rounds w/o cleaning, and even OCD F-Open shooters, who shoot at a target ¼ the size of an XTC target rarely clean more than once a day.
 
XTR said:
I'd seriously reconsider whether or not cleaning was required between each stage. Your rifle should be reliable to shoot hundreds of rounds w/o cleaning, and even OCD F-Open shooters, who shoot at a target ¼ the size of an XTC target rarely clean more than once a day.
I did not mean to imply that I clean after each stage, I clean after each match, that is at the end of the shooting day.
 
Ive got a rt side charging handle and have had no issues with it loosening or striking or any other. Also makes a good case for WS2 or HbN to avoid unnecessary cleaning.
 

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