90gn 0.224" VLDs as Varmint Bullets?

[Laurie]

Has anybody tried the Berger 90gn VLD as a varmint bullet, especially in the larger cases such as .22-250 Rem, PPC and BR?

Does it expand at the ranges that such cartridges would let you hit a PD size animal at?

Ricochet or break-up with a miss or after passing through the varmint? (A major issue for us in the UK given this is a small crowded country and bullet break-up on hitting the ground is an important requirement for our pest shooters.)

Also, any barrel life experience with such bullets and the required 1-7" twist in these cartridges?

Laurie,
York, England

 

[montana_native]

Don't know if this helps, but the 80 gr VLD out of a 22-250 pencils right through a prairie dog at almost all the ranges I tried them at. An 80 gr A-max was much more destructive.

 

[HillbillySniper]

An 80 gr A-max was much more destructive.

Cant go wrong with the Amax!

Hillbilly

 

[40X Guy]

As has been said the A-Max's are very destructive, I have zero experience with any of the .224 Berger heavy VLD's on varmints, but if you are worried about misses and the bullets not disintegrating in the UK consider the Barnes Varmint Grenade's. These will come apart in the varmint or if hitting a blade of grass. But the big problem with those are lo BC's and in my experience they need some tinkering to tune. Also light for caliber. Curious what caliber are you considering?

Frank

 

[fullersson]

I love shooting Berger but from what we have been able to tell the entire line of Berger bullets are better for target shooting than hunting. Very accurate bullets but do not seem to be very destructive.

 

[Laurie]

Thanks guys.

It looks like these VLDs aren't a top choice for varmints - A-Max bullets work better.

I only shoot paper and use these bullets for F/TR at out to 1,000yd at 2,900 fps MV from .223 Rem, but was drawn into a discussion about ideal varmint hunting calibres on the UKVarminting Forum.

http://ukvarminting.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=10603

The guys considering .224" dia match bullets would most likely shoot .22-250, .22PPC, and .22BR as well as some wierd and wonderful wildcats.

 

[manitou210]

Don't know if this helps, but the 80 gr VLD out of a 22-250 pencils right through a prairie dog at almost all the ranges I tried them at. An 80 gr A-max was much more destructive.

Laurie just pulled my freinds 224/28" Krieger 1.78 twist 3500 rounds mostly 80gr VLD Bergers at 2940fps and few 100 90gr match, his barrel would not stabilize the 90 vld,s
he cleaned well there was one or two small pieces of copper, throat was fine, rifling was strong rest of barrel fine, put some Wipeout over night patched out bore scoped barrel again absolutly no copper
go to go but he now has a 1/7 twist to shoot F/TR 90gr VLD

manitou

 

[Laurie]

.......... he cleaned well there was one or two small pieces of copper, throat was fine, rifling was strong rest of barrel fine ..... [Manitou]

Thanks - that's very encouarging to hear. I also have a correspondent, Eric Kennard, in Florida shooting a .223R gas-gun in long-range F with a 1-6.5" twist barrel which is still shooting well at 3,000 + rounds with 90gn Bergers, so although low round accuracy collapse is reported by some, it seems many barrels and chambers do just fine. My barrel has around 1,300 down it now, all 90s at high MVs, and is shooting as well as when new. There is around 20 thou' erosion which is quite reasonable all things considered.

I have an invite to shoot F/TR for Scotland against the USA national team at Blair Atholl in July and that meeting involves an 1,100 yard stage, which will be the rifle's first outing beyond 1,000, so we'll see what it can do at that range, too.

 

[CADDIE5]

Laurie,
What is the trim length of your 223 brass for 90 gr. bullets. I've trimmed 1000 of my 223 winchester brass to 1.747" for my barnard action 223 rifle/Chanlynn barrel 1-8 twist-I'm using 80AMAX and 75HORbthp bullets.Don't want to trim the rest if I need longer when I rebarrel down the road to use 90 gr for 1k F class.Thanks, Steve

 

[Laurie]

What is the trim length of your 223 brass for 90 gr. bullets.

CADDIES,
you've got me puzzled there. Trim length isn't determined by the bullet in use but by the chamber specifications. SAAMI / CIP set the maximum allowed case length based on minimum chamber length tolerances and the 'trim-to length' is normally 0.010" less.

Depending on the chamber, you sometimes find it is longer than SAAMI so you can allow cases to grow further before trimming. The only way of doing this safely is to measure the chamber. Sinclair sells chamber-neck gauges for all common calibres - little leaded steel mushroom shape buttons. You have to sacrifice a case by over-trimming it, knocking around 1/10" off the neck, seat the gauge just into the neck and chamber it in the rifle. The larger diameter section of the gauge hits the end of the neck section of the chamber and is pushed back into the case letting you measure the chamber's OAL. If it's a custom rifle, you would not expect to have a lot of extra room over SAAMI, but some factory rifle chambers are way above spec.

What you DO need to use 90s properly is a lot of freebore. PT&G Made up a reamer for us based on a new unturned Lapua Match case with a Berger VLD seated so its base was above the case-body to shoulder junction. That amounts to around 0.24" freebore. This chamber will barely allow 80s to reach the lands with shallow seating before any throat erosion occurs, so is very much 90s orientated, the VLD's COAL running at 2.710" with the bullet 0.015" into the lands after 1,300 rounds.

Your 1-8" twist barrel won't stabilise 90s, even the Sierra MK which is the shortest of the bunch. The minimum rifling twist rate needed for the JLK and Berger VLDs is somewhere in the 1-7.25 to 1-7.5" area. 1-7" is a sensible rate to specify. Don't use Sierra's recommended 1-6.5".