Is the 8x57 case larger in volume to the 7x57? The reason i ask is im going to make a wild cat from the x57 case and lapua makes 8x57 but not 7x57 norma makes 7x57 but im not paying ther crazy prices. But i thought i read somewere that the 8x57 case was slightly fatter which will help because i plan fire forming to 35* shoulder
7x57 vs 8x57 case
- Thread starter Hammer101st
- Start date
Liven The Dream
Gold $$ Contributor
8X57 is larger
The Mauser Brothers gave us Both.
The Mauser Brothers gave us Both.
When i'm wildcatting & looking to do load development, i don't use premium brass.
How many am i going to ruin & throw in the scrap brass bin?
I've actually had good results with 7X57 PPU brass.
Also used it to form from 7mm Rem Mag to 6.5mm Rem Mag & 25-6.5 Rem Mag.
After your initial research, forming, load developments are achieved would i go to the more expensive brass.
But then again, you may find out, as i did, that you don't need to.
How many am i going to ruin & throw in the scrap brass bin?
I've actually had good results with 7X57 PPU brass.
Also used it to form from 7mm Rem Mag to 6.5mm Rem Mag & 25-6.5 Rem Mag.
After your initial research, forming, load developments are achieved would i go to the more expensive brass.
But then again, you may find out, as i did, that you don't need to.
Edd
Gold $$ Contributor
The case diameter and case OAL length is the same.
The 8x57 has the shoulder moved .100" farther forward.
This will equate to about 3 grains more capacity.
Yea rws is awesome stuff but yea what you saidRWS makes 7x57, however if you didn't like Norma prices you will hate RWS prices........
Edd
Gold $$ Contributor
Doesn't RWS also make 6.5x57 brass?RWS makes 7x57, however if you didn't like Norma prices you will hate RWS prices........
Y not built a 6.5 prc same thing u reinventing the wheel
wildcatter
Silver $$ Contributor
The PRC case is not near as efficient as the 7x57, 8x57, 257 Roberts, 6mm Remington, and if you take it to the Ackley Improved version of this case, will be very close to the performance, using way less powder to do the same thing, resulting in better SD numbers, and longer barrel life, with optimum powders that are cooler burning,,, win win win in my opinion.
I prefer the 8x57 case for any of these cartridges for the simple reason Lapua only ofers these case dimensions in 8X57 IS. Fare more durable, and far more consistent than any other _x57 case offered. I found decades ago how efficient this particular case is when Ackleyized!
I built my first 257 Roberts AI and found I was even capable of running it faster than the 257 Weatherby, with less powder, no huge freebore, when loaded to the same pressures. Same for the next build with this case, a 6mm Remington AI, more performance than the 240 Weatherby with it's extreme free bore, accuracy with both was fantastic.
The 8x57 even when take down to the 6mm is simple with a few standard dies, I used 308 Winchester die adjusted to size the neck only in my rockchucker, then a 7mm Mauser die to fully size the case, to a 257 Roberts to fully size, and finally 6mm Remington to fully size. This got me ready to fireform.
When sizing down this much it does move a lot of bras to the diameter of the neck, creating a very thick neck. This was when I decided to fireform with 14 grains of bullseye and full cases of corncob media, sealed by bar soap. But paraffin, beeswax, or any kind of ticking could be used. This was best for me, and then after fireforming I was ready to neck turn for perfect cases to start load development without wasted barrel life.
Like I said, the more I work with this cartridge the more I like it, if the 257 roberts or the 7x57 Mauser were loaded to modern pressures at their introduction they truly were magnum beaters for the reasons I mentioned earlier.!
I prefer the 8x57 case for any of these cartridges for the simple reason Lapua only ofers these case dimensions in 8X57 IS. Fare more durable, and far more consistent than any other _x57 case offered. I found decades ago how efficient this particular case is when Ackleyized!
I built my first 257 Roberts AI and found I was even capable of running it faster than the 257 Weatherby, with less powder, no huge freebore, when loaded to the same pressures. Same for the next build with this case, a 6mm Remington AI, more performance than the 240 Weatherby with it's extreme free bore, accuracy with both was fantastic.
The 8x57 even when take down to the 6mm is simple with a few standard dies, I used 308 Winchester die adjusted to size the neck only in my rockchucker, then a 7mm Mauser die to fully size the case, to a 257 Roberts to fully size, and finally 6mm Remington to fully size. This got me ready to fireform.
When sizing down this much it does move a lot of bras to the diameter of the neck, creating a very thick neck. This was when I decided to fireform with 14 grains of bullseye and full cases of corncob media, sealed by bar soap. But paraffin, beeswax, or any kind of ticking could be used. This was best for me, and then after fireforming I was ready to neck turn for perfect cases to start load development without wasted barrel life.
Like I said, the more I work with this cartridge the more I like it, if the 257 roberts or the 7x57 Mauser were loaded to modern pressures at their introduction they truly were magnum beaters for the reasons I mentioned earlier.!
Attachments
Thank you sir i like the x57 cases to they seem to fit a certain area were powder allways seems to have its best fill ratio's
The PRC case is not near as efficient as the 7x57, 8x57, 257 Roberts, 6mm Remington, and if you take it to the Ackley Improved version of this case, will be very close to the performance, using way less powder to do the same thing, resulting in better SD numbers, and longer barrel life, with optimum powders that are cooler burning,,, win win win in my opinion.
I prefer the 8x57 case for any of these cartridges for the simple reason Lapua only ofers these case dimensions in 8X57 IS. Fare more durable, and far more consistent than any other _x57 case offered. I found decades ago how efficient this particular case is when Ackleyized!
I built my first 257 Roberts AI and found I was even capable of running it faster than the 257 Weatherby, with less powder, no huge freebore, when loaded to the same pressures. Same for the next build with this case, a 6mm Remington AI, more performance than the 240 Weatherby with it's extreme free bore, accuracy with both was fantastic.
The 8x57 even when take down to the 6mm is simple with a few standard dies, I used 308 Winchester die adjusted to size the neck only in my rockchucker, then a 7mm Mauser die to fully size the case, to a 257 Roberts to fully size, and finally 6mm Remington to fully size. This got me ready to fireform.
When sizing down this much it does move a lot of bras to the diameter of the neck, creating a very thick neck. This was when I decided to fireform with 14 grains of bullseye and full cases of corncob media, sealed by bar soap. But paraffin, beeswax, or any kind of ticking could be used. This was best for me, and then after fireforming I was ready to neck turn for perfect cases to start load development without wasted barrel life.
View attachment 1377412
Like I said, the more I work with this cartridge the more I like it, if the 257 roberts or the 7x57 Mauser were loaded to modern pressures at their introduction they truly were magnum beaters for the reasons I mentioned earlier.!
Making wildcats, IMO, are wasted time and effort.
There is nothing new that is better than tried and true original cartridges. You paint yourself into a corner by trying to be smarter than the average bear.
wildcatter
Silver $$ Contributor
I felt the same way till I actually did one hands on!! Try and remember this, most all cartridges your referring to were all once wildcats, till the big manufacturers made them standard offerings, reaping the big dollars of the brain child and skill the gunsmiths creating them offered!! Very seldom do companies create a cartridge that does not already show an interest from the shooters, once they see there is money to be made, in offering it as a factory offering, do they invest in the tools dies and machines and money to produce it!
Wildcatters are the reason we have some of the finest cartridges available today. Many cartridges that are wildcatted or improved are not of interest to the manufacturers for the simple reason it would cut into the profits of the tooling that is already paid for and being offered in the original version, often when they released it without enough testing and experimenting to be sure it was it's best, so they settle for good enough.
Most wildcatters demand on better and wont be satisfied with mediocre good enough!! I for one am the same way with factory offed go bang ammo! It all shoots, but I refuse to settle for good enough, when I have proven for decades how much better performance as well as accuracy can be when I roll my own, which is seldom in a good enough cartridge, but always better than factory!!!
I just built a 17 Mach IV barrel, a very well known wildcat for years with varmint hunters. It is the same exact cartridge Remington finally brought to the market as 17 fireball, in fact the 17 fireball factory ammo will work in my custom Mach IV, if I turn the necks for my tight neck chambering, but have a friend who has used it in his standard neck Mach IV, but trust me Remington watched for years while custom gunsmiths made nearly as many custom rifles as Remington sold in their 17 caliber offering!
Don't be delusional thinking manufacturers do anything on their own, custom gunsmiths around the world have given the the ability to claim the fame to most cartridges they did no more than copy and register it to legitimize it as a factory offering!!
Those who are afraid of stepping in to the wildcatting adventure should refrain from offering thoughts that show how little knowledge they have on the benefits. We have many here, many with more knowledge and experience than me, that offer the little things that offer others better results thinking out of the box most only read about.
We spend many hours and many dollars proving how much better things can be that has never been put in a book for those that "think being different is a waste" if it wasn't better people wouldn't waste the time, the effort, the money, or their knowledge helping others have it their way. It's better but manufacturers won't offer it, they would like them to think as you, and profit form it themselves. When they see they are loosing out on your money, they do as they did with the 17 fireball, and there dozens of other calibers they did the same thing with.
No manufacturer can make a dime off of you selling you on wildcats or improved versions of what they make a killing off of and selling to the clueless providing them with huge profits!
There are times they settle for so so because it will work better in all actions, from single shot to full auto applications. Much like the 223 Remington, far from capable when placed beside a 222 in a single shot bolt action when the 223 will be proven to offer inferior accuracy. But it will shoot good enough, and still be reliable in their full and semi auto actions it was actually designed for. But wildcatters have proven how anemic it is with the heavier per caliber bullets for long range use when improved to the 223 AI platform.
I am going to stop as the more I type, the more I realize what over 45 years of being influenced by gunsmiths like Fred Sinclair, Dwight Scott, Billy Stevens, Fred Moreo, etc. and realize how much can be said in the favor of wildcats, the people who bring them to life, those who refine them, and much about those who don't understand them to continue here.
Wildcatting and the benefits for those who are not aware of it's benefits needs it own thread, and can never be covered a single post, as I have only touched on the surface of what wildcatting brings to shooters, my apologize to the OP, I'm just opening a can of worms, and once open it is a huge can!
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