6x47 L and RL-17 ???

[tbeasley]

Hey fellas, I just ran some numbers on the Exbal program and "IF" Alliant RL-17 can and do produce velocity gains with the follwing:,Consistant vel., single digit extreme spreads, and safe pressures, lets not forget accuracy) then it seems to me the 6x47 Lapua with 105 Bergers will be the Bread-N-Butter of all great worlds.
Lets see compared to the 6.5-284:
-Should have longer barrel life than a 6.5x284
-Defintaly less recoil
-The wind drift is identical to the rival 6.5-284 w/140 bullets all the way out to 1000yds
-The 6x47 L is 3ft 9in. flatter out to 1000yds, but the 6.5 has 140 ft/lbs more of energy.
-This all done on a short-action
Exbal gave me these numbers and BC's were used via the berger website. and using a 10mph crosswind
RANGE 6.5x284 w/140Berger Velocity=2950 fps
yds Elevation Wind Drift Velocity Energy
400 -24.5 -8.0 2386 1769
600 -69.8 -19.1 2130 1410
800 -146.3 -35.9 1891 1111
1000 -261.9 -59.5 1669 866

6x47 Lapua w/105 Berger RL-17 Velocity=3325 fps
yds Elevation Wind Drift Velocity Energy
400 -18.5 -8.0 2629 1611
600 -55.1 -19.0 2318 1252
800 -117.8 -35.9 2030 960
1000 -214.5 -59.9 1764 726

sorry numbers are hard to track, but can't figure this thing out

 

[memilanuk]

Where did you get the QL cartridge & powder info? I've got a 6-6.5x47L in the works and I'd love to be able to run some 'whatif' scenarios to kill time while waiting...

 

[tbeasley]

The 6x47L can run the 105's at 3100+ in a 1-8 26"+barrel. I have a 26" 1-7.5 in 6x47L shooting the 115 dtacs and I'm settled on 40.5gr of H-4831 giving me 3055 fps. So I'm very convinced that RL-17 is going to be a power-house with this cartridge given all varibles definitley in the 1-8twist barrel's. I've got the feeling that it may not be ideal for the 7.5 twist barrels launching heavy bullets, but the powder is so new that only time will tell.
After reading what the RL-17 did with velocity gains in the 6XC, Look what us 6x47L shooters can look forward too.

 

[memilanuk]

I'm sorry, I thought you originally said 'QuickLoad', not 'Exbal', which is why I got all excited. I was looking forward to being able to actually do some modeling of the case vs. available powders.

 

[flatlander]

I'm currently getting well over 3000fps with moly'd DTAC 115s out of a .237" bore 8-twist 30" Bartlein chambered for a .273" no-turn neck 6x47L, using N160 with R 7-1/2s. Groups at 600 & 1000yds. are excellent. So if RL17 will produce the same accuracy with an additional 150-200fps of velocity, that's going to give the 6x47 the same wind drift at 1000yds. as my 284s with Berger 180s at 2800fps, according to Sierra Infinity V.6.
Hmmm - wonder if Alliant has any plans to bring out something in RL22's burn rate range with the new deterrent coating process that RL17 is using? If that would allow me to get another 100-150fps out of the 180s using the 284, I'd still have an excuse to keep shooting the big bullets at 1000.

 

[Forum Boss]

Dennis,

We convinced Alliant to send a couple pounds to Robert Whitley. He'll test RL17 in a straight .284, 6.5-284, and 6.5x47.

Like you, we are very curious if RL17, used in the .284, will get the 180s up to 2950 or 3000.

RL17 may be slightly too fast for the .284 with 180s--just don't know yet.

Alliant has said they plan to "explore" using this new powder technology for other burn rates--both faster and slower. There's no planned release date at this point--much depends on how well the new RL17 is received.

 

[flatlander]

Based on the fact that I hit max pressure with H4831 & B180s at around 2800fps in both my 284s,one with a Bartlein, the other with a Krieger, both 9-tw), and that even N165 gives somewhat sticky extraction that same velocity range, I'm going to bet that RL17 is going to prove faster than optimum, especially with 180s. However, its burning characteristics with the new deterent technology may still allow it to produce respectable velocities - I'll be watching for Robert to post his results.

Best case scenario in my opinion would be for Alliant to extend the new deterent technology to the entire line of Reloder powders.

 

[tbeasley]

flatlander
"Best case scenario in my opinion would be for Alliant to extend the new deterent technology to the entire line of Reloder powders."

Amen my fellow-shooter....
I think we all would like to see Allaint redo their recipes "IF" this new powder can prove itself... Time will tell and were all ears and watching this forum like hawks I bet?

later
tim b.

 

[flatlander]

Well, based on Jerry T.'s & Robert W.'s results with RL17 in 284s, I'd have lost my bet - RL17 may be THE powder to use with 180s in the 284. I'm also interested in trying it with S175MKs - though they shot really well in my first 284 bbl. - a 28" PacNor 3-groove 9-twist - neither of my current 30" barrels like the 175s very much.

I've only fired two rounds with RL17 in the 6x47L to date - I went with German's starting charge of 39.5grs. for 115s in his 6XC, and got 2980fps out of moly'd DTAC 115s in a 30" Bartlein 8-twist/.237" bore barrel. Will work my way up with the 115s and see where we wind up - max loads with 115s and N160 or Data 86 in this barrel have given 3060fps, so it remains to be seen where the top velocity will be with RL17. More importantly, I'm interested in where the next accuracy node with DTAC 115s is. They don't seem to be at all picky about velocity - I've had good groups at 1000 at velocities from 2980 through 3060fps.

 

[tbeasley]

flatlander
good buddy keep us posted!!! Your the first I've seen post anything regarding actual field testing with 6x47L and RL-17.
Let us know what comes out of all this hipe, I've got some 115 Bergers I'm goona try with mine, The dtacs shoot good to, but wanted to see if the Bergers would tighten things up.

Keep us Posted!!!!!
tim

 

[flatlander]

tim - I've been sitting on about 1000 of the Berger 115s - couldn't get them to shoot nearly as well as the DTACs in either of my 6x47s - at times, they had nearly three times as much vertical spread. However, all the loads I'd tried in both rifles have had the Bergers jammed .010"-.020", so the next logical step was to seat a few to jump .010". That did the trick - vertical shrank to under 2" at 600yds, which is a huge improvement.

I also fired five 6x47s with 40.5grs./RL17, Wolf SRM primers, and moly'd DTAC 115s through the same 30" Bartlein 8-twist bbl. as last time - avg. vel.= 3095; ES=25; Sd=9. Didn't measure the group as it was on steel, but it was very respectable. Bolt lift was easy, but caseheads are starting to show the first signs of pressure. Will bump the charge .3gr and try it again when I get the chance. I'm particularly interested in trying RL17 in the 7.5-twist Krieger on a BAT 3L, as max loads in that barrel with N160 & DTAC 115s are producing only around 2950, and I'm hoping RL17 will net me 3000+fps. I'm not complaining about the Krieger - it shoots great - I'd just like to get a little more velocity out of it.

Also loaded 10rds. of 284s with RL17 - 52.5grs, BR2 primers, once-fired WW cases, and five each with moly'd Berger & JLK 180 VLDs. Out of a 30" Bartlein 9-twist in hvy. Palma contour, the Bergers had an avg. vel. of 2849; ES=16; Sd=6. JLK 180 avg. vel.=2836; ES=20; Sd=7. Both bullets shot very well at 600. Max loads in this rifle with H4831 have been right at 2800, with occasional sticky extraction. These loads showed none of that, so I'll bump the charge to 53grs. next time. RL17 is looking good so far...

 

[flatlander]

Received notice of a 'like' on one of my posts in this old thread, thought I'd report that I used RL-17 behind Berger 130 hunting VLDs in a 30" Krieger 1-8tw med. Palma bbl on one of my BAT 3L prone rifles. I shot this rifle in several 600yd prone matches several years ago, and also shot it in the 1000yd any rifle matches during the 2010 Berger SW LR Nationals at Ben Avery, with very good results. Was getting 2930fps with excellent accuracy out of the 130VLDs, but the barrel just flat stopped shooting at around 1300rds. Looking back on the chrono data for this barrel, it's pretty obvious that after doing a fair amount of testing with different powders & bullet, the vast majority of what I shot through it were RL-17 loads with either the 130s or Berger 140 LRBT or VLDs. Since 2008 when this thread was started, it's become apparent that RL-17 is rather hard on barrels, and I seldom use it today. Would appreciate hearing opinions & experiences from other shooters who've shot a fair amount of RL-17...

 

[watercam]

My foray into RE-17 cost me money! When I was shooting 185s in my Palma gun I tried it and, like you, saw excellent accuracy. Right up to the point where the throat burned out. Too bad! Back to Varget

 

[Riesel]

I use and am still using RL17 in my 6.5L and 6.5 Creedmoor Hunting Rifles.
Outstanding accuracy and velocity using the 135 Berger Hunting bullet.
Don't put but 30 rounds a year thru each rifle.