6br to 22 dasher forming

[Benchrest Braxton]

tried to form some just now and unfortunately i'm not able to get the false shoulder low enough to cam the bolt over using a le wilson 6 dasher die and 249 bushing.

should i pick up a 22br die to get this done?

 

[chuckshooter]

I use my 6br redding dies to form both 22br and 20br with a just smaller bushings and of course the smaller decapping rod

 

[RegionRat]

@chuckshooter , To get from BR to Dasher, he will need that false shoulder not just the neck. The Dasher neck-shoulder junction is a little longer than a straight BR.

@Benchrest Braxton , Not sure why you couldn't get that false shoulder down far enough? It may be that I don't follow your post?

You can also use a BR die to set that False Shoulder. Just crank the BR die out to set the shoulder with your bushing.

I assume you still opened up the neck with a 0.25-ish mandrel and then sized it down with the bushing?
You have to factor for the neck-should chamfer in the chamber, and also the chamber neck diameter too. Thats why you should still open the neck with a mandrel before you start the false neck.

Roughly speaking, going from 6 BR to 22 Dasher is very similar to the 6 BR to 6 Dasher problems.

You can also use a slight jam to help hold that case back in addition to the false neck/shoulder.
Good Luck and in for the range reports.

 

[Benchrest Braxton]

@chuckshooter , To get from BR to Dasher, he will need that false shoulder not just the neck. The Dasher neck-shoulder junction is a little longer than a straight BR.

@Benchrest Braxton , Not sure why you couldn't get that false shoulder down far enough? It may be that I don't follow your post?

You can also use a BR die to set that False Shoulder. Just crank the BR die out to set the shoulder with your bushing.

I assume you still opened up the neck with a 0.25-ish mandrel and then sized it down with the bushing?
You have to factor for the neck-should chamfer in the chamber, and also the chamber neck diameter too. Thats why you should still open the neck with a mandrel before you start the false neck.

Roughly speaking, going from 6 BR to 22 Dasher is very similar to the 6 BR to 6 Dasher problems.

You can also use a slight jam to help hold that case back in addition to the false neck/shoulder.
Good Luck and in for the range reports.

i assume the chamfer in the neck bushing is whats preventing from getting the false shoulder from going down anymore. I tried reversing the bushing to hopefully get a smidge more but no avail.

guess a straight 22 br die is in my future?

 

[madmixerman]

IMO, you need to use a 6br die to form for making a false shoulder for a dasher not using the Dasher die.

 

[Benchrest Braxton]

IMO, you need to use a 6br die to form for making a false shoulder for a dasher not using the Dasher die.

yeah I was kinda hoping I could get away with it but i guess not.

i totally forgot i had a 6br die here that i'm selling so i'll just throw that 249 bushing in there and try again.

will post an update tomorrow

 

[RegionRat]

Have you thought about just starting with 6 Dasher brass and working the necks to 22?

You should still be able to run the fireforming on good old 6 BR into your wildcat, but since some Dasher brass is already available it would be less of a change than blowing the shoulder.

 

[Benchrest Braxton]

i assume i'd probably run into the same problem as i'm having now because of the bottom portion of the neck being untouched by the bushing.

 

[RegionRat]

i assume i'd probably run into the same problem as i'm having now because of the bottom portion of the neck being untouched by the bushing.

That sounds like it would be a die/shell holder problem at that point.

Before factory Dasher brass was available, I made 22 Dasher out of regular Lapua 6 BR brass. Later on, I ran wildcats to 0.20 cal to run those 55 Bergers.

Something else might be going on with your die or shell holder? Maybe we should double check some of the dimensions and see if they make sense?

 

[Benchrest Braxton]

That sounds like it would be a die/shell holder problem at that point.

Before factory Dasher brass was available, I made 22 Dasher out of regular Lapua 6 BR brass. Later on, I ran wildcats to 0.20 cal to run those 55 Bergers.

Something else might be going on with your die or shell holder? Maybe we should double check some of the dimensions and see if they make sense?

before factory dasher brass was available, what die were you using to turn 6br into 22 dasher?

 

[RegionRat]

before factory dasher brass was available, what die were you using to turn 6br into 22 dasher?

I used a false shoulder method.
I opened the neck with a 0.257 mandrel, then necked it down with a Redding type S bushing die for 6 Dasher and used the bushings to get either the 22 or the 20 cal. version to make the false shoulder.

I didn't have a problem doing that false neck with either the Redding Type S 6 BR or the Type S in 6 Dasher.

In the 6 Dasher Type S die body, after the fireform step, I adjusted the position of the bushing to match the neck junction that makes the chamber happy. (I ran with no-turn chambers).

I used Imperial Sizing Wax to lube the operation. After bushing the necks down for the false shoulder, I would anneal and then run the final mandrel, tumble to clean the lube, and chamfer before seating long for a slight jam.

BTW, now that Alpha is making factory Dasher brass, and the Short Action Customs dies have the bushings with the integrated shoulders, this is an easy task if you don't mind using their dies and Alpha brass.

 

[Benchrest Braxton]

I used a false shoulder method.
I opened the neck with a 0.257 mandrel, then necked it down with a Redding type S bushing die for 6 Dasher and used the bushings to get either the 22 or the 20 cal. version to make the false shoulder.

I didn't have a problem doing that false neck with either the Redding Type S 6 BR or the Type S in 6 Dasher.

In the 6 Dasher Type S die body, after the fireform step, I adjusted the position of the bushing to match the neck junction that makes the chamber happy. (I ran with no-turn chambers).

I used Imperial Sizing Wax to lube the operation. After bushing the necks down for the false shoulder, I would anneal and then run the final mandrel, tumble to clean the lube, and chamfer before seating long for a slight jam.

BTW, now that Alpha is making factory Dasher brass, and the Short Action Customs dies have the bushings with the integrated shoulders, this is an easy task if you don't mind using their dies and Alpha brass.

maybe the redding dies get further down on the neck compared to the wilson...idk.

thanks for the tip on annealing them first, i will do that. ill report back when i get these all formed up

 

[Clancy]

@Benchrest Braxton I know you you what’s up… but necking down with a bushing die is never a good idea.

I formed my fire forming rounds with a 22 BR FL die and (I BELIEVE) a .025 feeler gauge but double check that.

 

[Benchrest Braxton]

@Benchrest Braxton I know you you what’s up… but necking down with a bushing die is never a good idea.

I formed my fire forming rounds with a 22 BR FL die and (I BELIEVE) a .025 feeler gauge but double check that.

update time: tl/dr - I give up.

I was able to use my straight 6br die with the 249 bushing with no issues and got a few test pieces fireformed.

I did a batch of 100 today to figure out that I ran into another issue. Setting up the false shoulder wasn't much of a problem, but now I found out that once a bullet gets loaded into them it changes the angle of the false shoulder ever so slightly that now I can't get the bolt to close consistently, some pieces work and some pieces won't close at all unless I cranked on it which I refuse to do. I assume that this is due to the angle of the false shoulder due to the bushing die.

Probably just going to get some alpha dasher brass and a short action customs modular die with the neck shoulder bushing to eliminate this neck bushing die headache....