6BR FL sizer die shoulder setback issue question

[Linko]

I am FL sizing my Lapua 6BR fired brass. This has been fired in a Savage 6BR target rifle.

after resizing with my Whidden FL die (die set down to the Co-Ax press shelholder) the brass consistantly is .001" longer at the shoulder after resizing. This does'nt permit me any setback. I have no additional adjustment range.

could use a few opinions of what I have going on.

 

[Travelor]

Use another press. Reason being is that the Forster press is not giving your die enough room to lower the die properly. Found this on mine also and now use a "C" press to body or FL size.

 

[Mulligan]

You may need to readjust your die.

I had the same problem with a Redding die.

The stroke needs to be at the bottom of the cycle (press handle all the way down) to utilize maximum travel of press.
I will look for the email I received from Redding at the time and post it here.
CW

I recommend setting your die up for cam-over, this will take the play out of the threads between the die and the press. To set your die up for a cam-over screw your die down another 1/8th to 1/4 past first contact. Adjust the die with as much cam-over as possible and then try the sized case in your rifle's chamber. If it fits then back the die away from the shellholder and work the die back down until the bolt handle closes freely. Keep in mind that 1/71 of a turn equals .001" of shoulder set back and you may be close to the setting you need.

Edited to include email

 

[Richard Jones]

Are you using the issued coax shellholder??

 

[RonAKA]

Is your die contacting the shell holder at full stroke?

 

[savagedasher]

Just go have the die shortened . The next time when you have your chamber set use painter tape on the go gauge . One piece it will close but firm two it won't Larry

 

[Linko]

Press is cammed over.
I am using factory Co-Ax jaws.
Die is in full contact with shell holder jaws.

 

[savagedasher]

Put some painter tape on the bottom of the case and resize . If that makes it work then you the amount of the cut on the die that is needed. If not add another . Whe you get it to work carefully remove the tape and measure the thickness . My self I use a drink can for checking It not only is cheap it is accurate . Good luck both ways work
Merry Christmas Larry

 

[savagedasher]

Put some painter tape on the bottom of the case and resize . If that makes it work then you the amount of the cut on the die that is needed. If not add another . Whe you get it to work carefully remove the tape and measure the thickness . My self I use a drink can for checking It not only is cheap it is accurate . Good luck both ways work
Merry Christmas Larry

 

[savagedasher]

Put some painter tape on the bottom of the case and resize . If that makes it work then you the amount of the cut on the die that is needed. If not add another . Whe you get it to work carefully remove the tape and measure the thickness . My self I use a drink can for checking It not only is cheap it is accurate . Good luck both ways work
Merry Christmas Larry

 

[Eddie Harren]

Put some painter tape on the bottom of the case and resize . If that makes it work then you the amount of the cut on the die that is needed. If not add another . Whe you get it to work carefully remove the tape and measure the thickness . My self I use a drink can for checking It not only is cheap it is accurate . Good luck both ways work
Merry Christmas Larry

Larry, could you repeat this for us please?

 

[BoydAllen]

How does the .001 over sized brass chamber in your rifle? The reason that I ask is that I am constantly reading of shooters who seem to feel the need to bump back shoulders of once fired brass that would probably chamber perfectly with the die set to reproduce the as fired datum to head dimension. In my experience, it takes several firings for cases to reach their maximum (for a particular rifle) shoulder to head dimension. Beyond that, you could take a few thousandths off of the tops of your shell holder jaws, or the bottom of your die. Generally I like to have a reference case as a record of the maximum shoulder to head dimension that is achievable with a given action/barrel combination. It is this dimension that I set my bump from. If I am not able to neck size and fire a case (with stout but safe loads) until this dimension reaches an apparent maximum, I set the die to produce the as fired dimension and try a case in the rifle. Generally it chambers just fine. We bump to create clearance, if it is needed. If clearance is sufficient, why increase it? Of course it is a good idea to check several cases because with a given die setting, results will have some variation, and if your first case was was the softest one in the batch, you may have to set the die farther into the press to create enough clearance for the hardest ones. This is much less the case if you are annealing.

 

[savagedasher]

How does the .001 over sized brass chamber in your rifle? The reason that I ask is that I am constantly reading of shooters who seem to feel the need to bump back shoulders of once fired brass that would probably chamber perfectly with the die set to reproduce the as fired datum to head dimension. In my experience, it takes several firings for cases to reach their maximum (for a particular rifle) shoulder to head dimension. Beyond that, you could take a few thousandths off of the tops of your shell holder jaws, or the bottom of your die. Generally I like to have a reference case as a record of the maximum shoulder to head dimension that is achievable with a given action/barrel combination. It is this dimension that I set my bump from. If I am not able to neck size and fire a case (with stout but safe loads) until this dimension reaches an apparent maximum, I set the die to produce the as fired dimension and try a case in the rifle. Generally it chambers just fine. We bump to create clearance, if it is needed. If clearance is sufficient, why increase it? Of course it is a good idea to check several cases because with a given die setting, results will have some variation, and if your first case was was the softest one in the batch, you may have to set the die farther into the press to create enough clearance for the hardest ones. This is much less the case if you are annealing.

Boyd
He is using a coax press it doesn't have a shell holder . If he puts a shim under the case head he will be able Push the shoulder back . I have used painter tape for checking and or a aluminum cold drink can cut to size it is only for checking . Larry

 

[ranger3]

I have used the coax press and had some issues similar to this and so whenever I have this problem I revert back to my Ammo master or Rock chucker. you can you can also use the alternate shell holder that you can purchase from the folks at Forrester.

 

[savagedasher]

I have used the coax press and had some issues similar to this and so whenever I have this problem I revert back to my Ammo master or Rock chucker. you can you can also use the alternate shell holder that you can purchase from the folks at Forrester.

I found it was easy to modify the die for the press. Mine I don't even use the handle on it when bumping . Larry

 

[SheepDog]

Linko,
Does your brass come out of your rifle easily? If so can you chamber a fired round easily? If the answers to those two questions is yes then you don't need to bump the shoulder back. If your brass will not chamber easily after sizing (try it before loading it) then there is something wrong in your sizing process and it is likely the expander stem pulling on the shoulder. Your sizing die should be set to do as little work on the brass as possible to hold a bullet. The rest of the case should be a close fit to the chamber.
Oh, if the answer to the first question is "no" then you need to back your load down - it is producing too much pressure for your rifle.

 

[Mulligan]

Press is cammed over.
I am using factory Co-Ax jaws.
Die is in full contact with shell holder jaws.[/QUOTE]

Call John Whidden!

CW

 

[Linko]

Linko,
Does your brass come out of your rifle easily? If so can you chamber a fired round easily? If the answers to those two questions is yes then you don't need to bump the shoulder back. If your brass will not chamber easily after sizing (try it before loading it) then there is something wrong in your sizing process and it is likely the expander stem pulling on the shoulder. Your sizing die should be set to do as little work on the brass as possible to hold a bullet. The rest of the case should be a close fit to the chamber.
Oh, if the answer to the first question is "no" then you need to back your load down - it is producing too much pressure for your rifle.

Yes and Yes

After I fire resized brass it comes out of the rifle chamber .001" shorter

 

[Linko]

Press is cammed over.
I am using factory Co-Ax jaws.
Die is in full contact with shell holder jaws.

Call John Whidden!

CW[/QUOTE]
I sent him an E Mail

thanks

 

[Linko]

Linko,
Does your brass come out of your rifle easily? If so can you chamber a fired round easily? If the answers to those two questions is yes then you don't need to bump the shoulder back. If your brass will not chamber easily after sizing (try it before loading it) then there is something wrong in your sizing process and it is likely the expander stem pulling on the shoulder. Your sizing die should be set to do as little work on the brass as possible to hold a bullet. The rest of the case should be a close fit to the chamber.
Oh, if the answer to the first question is "no" then you need to back your load down - it is producing too much pressure for your rifle.

Expander stem pulling on the neck/shoulder junction. Interesting.