45 ACP and old Bullseye

[asquared19]

going to try out my recent loads on 45 acp, which are actually the first loads I put together in this new adventure of reloading. projectiles will be 230 grain Hornady XTP and 230 grain Xtreme coppper plated steel. Powder I have is an OLD red and orange can of the Bullseye powder, when it was Hercules (not Alliant). The can was still sealed. My Lee book shows a starting load of 5 grains Bullseye (same as the Alliant site), but speaking with others they have loaded 3.6-4.2 for the CPRN and 4.5-5 for the XTP, so that's what I started with. Obviously I'll need to make sure the pill flies and the action cycles, but wanted to do a quick sanity check to see what others have used.

 

[stork]

For a great accurate load, try the 185 HAP's with 4.5 BE, taper crimp to .468-.470. That load has shot 1-1 1/2" 10 shot groups at 50 yards out of 6 different bullseye 1911's.

Nothing at all wrong with 230's, they just don't shoot quite as well as the 185's in precision games.
Allen

 

[Fuj]

I'll still stick with my 200 gr hard cast H&G's over 452AA.

 

[mac86951]

Old bullseye, 3.5gr; 230gr round nose. Enjoy


Edit:. A primer helps. I've got 8lbs of old Hercules bullseye. Good stuff, maybe lifetime supply.

 

[asquared19]

Old bullseye, 3.5gr; 230gr round nose. Enjoy


Edit:. A primer helps. I've got 8lbs of old Hercules bullseye. Good stuff, maybe lifetime supply.

Thank you for the info, and yes, loaded over a CCI LPP. any printed load data I can have for reference sake too?

 

[asquared19]

Hope it makes it out the end of the barrel?

Alliant loads are maximum. Reduce 10% for a starting load.View attachment 1287129

looked back at my notes as I had some errors on the original post that are now updated. I have loaded the CPRN at 3.6 and 4.0 gr, and the XTP at 4.5 gr for starters.

 

[divingin]

I'll still stick with my 200 gr hard cast H&G's over 452AA.

Wish I could. I used the last of a 12# carton of 452AA about 2 years ago. Bought the carton in the 80's (there was a significant hiatus from shooting in there, though.)

 

[Walt Schmidlin]

Because the container is steel and old Check the appearance of the BE powder before using it. A friend gave me a 1lb of supposedly unopened metal can of IMR-4064. When I opened it smelled OK but when I poured some into the powder measure there was orange colored dust (actually rust). I assumed the powder had been improperly stored, hot/cold cycles causing rust to form on the inside of the can. Used it in a flower bed

 

[asquared19]

Because the container is steel and old Check the appearance of the BE powder before using it. A friend gave me a 1lb of supposedly unopened metal can of IMR-4064. When I opened it smelled OK but when I poured some into the powder measure there was orange colored dust (actually rust). I assumed the powder had been improperly stored, hot/cold cycles causing rust to form on the inside of the can. Used it in a flower bed

appreciate the warning. Powder does look and smell fine.

 

[jackson1]

Over the years, I had only 1 can of powder go bad on m e. A metal can of DuPont 4320. In the process of using the last of my Hercules Bullseye (paper can). Have an old paper can of Hodgon 4831 that I plan to use. Upon reading this thread, I became aware of a brain cramp I may have had. Got the bright idea and put it a metal can after man years. No my Mom and Dad weren't brother and sister.

 

[fkimble@charter.net]

Used a whole 20 pound keg of IMR4895 in my 308 match rifle. Every time I poured some in a container to weigh out on my scale, I got a little orange dust cloud. Powder was fine. The inside of the keg had some rust spots. Didn't seem to affect the powder at all. Shot just as good as the last keg. And there was a 20 year gap between keg useage even though only a year difference between purchase. That's what happens when you switch from a 308 bolt gun to a AR for across the course.

Frank

 

[divingin]

Used a whole 20 pound keg of IMR4895 in my 308 match rifle. Every time I poured some in a container to weigh out on my scale, I got a little orange dust cloud. Powder was fine. The inside of the keg had some rust spots. Didn't seem to affect the powder at all. Shot just as good as the last keg. And there was a 20 year gap between keg useage even though only a year difference between purchase. That's what happens when you switch from a 308 bolt gun to a AR for across the course.

Frank

Um, I suspect your powder was not fine. The orange cloud was a giveaway. You just got away with it.

https://www.rifleshootermag.com/editorial/how-to-determine-gunpowder-shelf-life/83922

 

[asquared19]

thanks for all who chimed in. it appears my start loads are within acceptable range. Looking forward to trying.

 

[D-4297]

As a teen ; I loaded thousands of rounds for my Dad's 45's , both his standard Comp gun , and his "Hard-ball" pistol . They all got Bullseye . I loaded , He shot . And Dad was a very highly ranked shooter who won multiple Ohio Governors Cups , and Natls. , a regular competitor at Perry in the early - mid 60's . Bullseye is a excellent choice for a .45ACP ...Just start at reasonable load weight , and work up slowly . No one ; and I mean no one will have to tell you when you're getting close to the edge of the cliff .

 

[Retired Engineer]

I believe either in Ackley's books or slight possibility of Hatcher's Notebook they mention the standard load for military use was 5.0 grains of Bullseye. Dont worry, the 1911 will take a lot of pressure. Basically the differences between a Mark 4 Series 80 and the Delta Elite reduce the Delta Elite's durability. The original Norma loads were over 30k psi. That is proof load on a .45. They used a dual recoil spring with a short plastic guide with about a .020 steel cover at the guide base. The Norma loads ate the ears off the guide and dished that dinky plate. Go to a 24# single spring and steel guide, and shoot. I have an oehler chronograph 33P I think and the LabRadar. I had found some loads that approached the original specifications using AA#7 powder. I was getting close to the original velocity, but the brass was landing further behind me. I was going 1 rounds at the load, added .2 grains, ten more etc until I had covered one grain, 10 shots per load, total 50 rounds. I policed up the brass, took it home and deprimed them. There were about a dozen cases that required no effort to remove the primer. I could seat new primers with my thumb. The .45 ACP brass isnt particularly strong, but the 10mm cases were well above a safe pressure.

I just pulled out two boxes of 10mm Factory loads:
Hornady Custom 180 grain JHP XTP Muzzle velocity 1180 fps.
Buffalo Bore (Made in Montana) 180 grain JHC Muzzle Velocity 1360 fps ME 728 FP
available 200 gr FMJ FN 1200 FPS ME 639 FP
220 gr Hard Cast 1200 FPS 703 Ft Lb
They mention using special powders not available to the public, somtimes they mix them.
Barry Retired Engineer




heavy 10 mm

 

[divingin]

When I opened it smelled OK but when I poured some into the powder measure there was orange colored dust (actually rust). I assumed the powder had been improperly stored, hot/cold cycles causing rust to form on the inside of the can. Used it in a flower bed

I think that's some sort of nitric acid caused breakdown of the powder. It happens in plastic containers as well. Though that's not a given, as many powders break down and become acidic; I'd think that much rusting would have eaten through the can.

 

[cem]

As noted many times above published loads are not so much pressure limited as purpose limited. One of 2 loads that I will quote without written references is an H&G 130 with 3.5 Bullseye and Alox/beeswax. The other is 2.7 Bullseye with a hollow base wadcutter in .38 S&W Special.

I wouldn't shoot either load indoors these days for smoke but they were once the most common midrange or gallery pistol loads. 5 grains of Bullseye +/- is equally common in full range loads.

I am inclined to prefer Unique for full range and 452 for midrange. I have some Bullseye left, though open can, from the Hercules days myself because I moved to 452 of which I also have some left.