338-06 Ackley Improved

[loadnplenty]

I am new here and this is my first post so bare with me please.

Do any other members here have a 338-06AI. I am just looking for some new load data to try. I have a SS Remington 700 detachable Mag. rifle with a 26 inch barrel from ER Shaw. It is a tack driver and frequently get one hole groups.

I am currently loading 58 grains of IMR 4064 with a magnum primer with a Nosler 180 grain Accubond and get an average velocity of 3130FPS. My only problem is this is a compressed load with no pressure signs, but over time the powder tends to push the bullet out giving me OAL issues when trying to eject a loaded shell from the chamber.

Mainly just looking for other loads that are tested in actual rifles. I have plenty of manuals so that's no in issue.

thanks

 

[wboggs]

I have loaded a .30-06 Ackley for15+ years in a R700 with a 24" barrel. My best loads come with IMR 4350, Nosler 180BT or Barnes 180 TTSX at about 2850 fps and these are near max loads. I think your 58grs. of IMR 4064 is about 10 grains too much and a very dangerous load. It is hard to believe you can even extract the fired case. The velocities you note of 3130 are .300 Win Mag velocities. Something is very wrong with this picture.
You should reevaluate everything.

 

[villarreal]

I have loaded a .30-06 Ackley for15+ years in a R700 with a 24" barrel.

He's a 338-06.

G.

 

[loadnplenty]

I built the rifle in 2011 and the load data from the Hogdgen manual is 55.5 as a max for IMR 4064 in the standard 338-06. The manual velocity is 2920FPS. This is not my only Ackley and I have been reloading for over 15 years so I am not rookie. No flattened primers, no sticky brass. I think I am ok with my load as I worked up accordingly.

 

[jcampbellsmith]

Surely some more neck tension would help? Regards JCS

 

[wboggs]

My apology to loadnplenty. I misread your post as a .30-06 Ackley.

 

[loadnplenty]

It's no problem were all human. But yes with velocity I am getting it is in magnum velocities. Nice thing is I am getting them with less powder and recoil. My favorite rifle by far and it is my go rifle, 257 Roberts Ackley Improved. It was built on a Mauser action and has a 21 inch Douglas barrel with a match chamber. I get 3180FPS WITH 50 grains of Hybrid 100V witha Berger 115 grain VLD. Without this powder I would not have achieved that velocity. IMR 4350 gave me around 2900FPS.

 

[wboggs]

The .257 Improved was one of P.O. Ackley's favorite rifles with a great improvement over the standard round. He felt it was almost ideal case capacity.
I haven't been that impressed with the improved .30-06, giving only about a 4% increase in powder capacity. Loaded to equal pressures, the standard round will come within about 50fps of the improved round.
You have two very good calibers.

 

[Laurie]

QuickLOAD doesn't list the AI version, only the 338-06 A-Square which I think is the bog standard necked-up case version. It still gives a feel though for what powders might work.

Running your load in that version gives an estimate of a shade under 65,000 psi pressure and 3,010 fps MV from a 26-inch barrel with a fill-ratio of nearly 110%. that's in a chamber throated for the standard COAL of 3.340". Don't worry about discrepancies from your MVs etc as it's a) a computer model and b) we're looking at the 'cooking version' with a bit less case capacity. But it's close enough to see what might work.

The program recommends a bunch of ball powders and they have the advantage of improved bulk density letting you get a bit more weight into the case. If you're prepared to use the ball type, Hodgdon BL-C(2) and its near relative Winchester 748 offer the near ideal mix, followed by Ramshot TAC, and H335.

For stick powders, H4895 gives the best mix of MV and a close to 100% case fill (just over) at max pressure in the standard case. Alliant Re15 is a bit bulkier but reduces pressures at loads that are slightly compressed and may be suited to the Ackley version with an estimated MV around 30 fps below H4895. Re17 and Viht N530 are in the same ball park, N530 almost on the ideal 100% fill-ratio with the standard case at its maximum load.

If you want me or somebody else to do a QuickLOAD run for your actual rounds, just advise two things:

the COAL you run at.

the case overflow water capacity. (Take a fired, unsized case. Weigh it. Fill it with water level with the case mouth and reweigh. The difference between the two is the case capacity in grains water which the program converts to capacity in cubic centimetres and which also takes account of your exact chamber size which is important. If you use more than one make of brass, the exercise should be done for each as there may be a significant difference between makes depending on their wall thickness.)

In any event, you can revisit your printed data sources and see if there are any loads listed for those powders that the program suggests are worth looking at.

 

[loadnplenty]

I will try and weigh a case my next day off. That would be some interesting info to have.

 

[louielouie]

According to 4D Reamers their 338-06 has 71.42 grs while the improved has 73.74 gr. I was always wondering how well 9.3x62 brass would work in this endeavour...

 

[loadnplenty]

I used 35 whelen brass to form my 338-06. I necked it down untill the 35 caliber neck was holding the case tight in the chamber. Loaded the case with 16 grains of bullseye and two sheets of toilet paper and pointed the rifle up in the air. Fireformin worked out great and it was cheap. Then I just trimmed all the cases to same length.

 

[alf]

I've got one, but most my work was done with 200/210 grain bullets.

I found that H-4350 was the very best powder tested. I ran the velocity up to 2950 with various powders, but the accuracy day in and day out was at 2800 or so, tested to 600 yards, with the 4350, using Lapua brass and 210 primers.

My only load work in the lighter bullets was with the 180 grain Ballistic Tips, and all I did was load to the velocity that matched my drops out to 600 with the 200's, using powders that i felt were "expendable". I did run up to 3050 in my 21 1/2" barrel, so your speeds in a 26" tube are probably not out of line, although Nosler's book shows max at 58 grains of 4064 running 2971 in a 24" tube.

 

[loadnplenty]

My actual load is 58.5 grains of IMR 4064 with a mag primer. How Nosler gets 58 into a case that is not improved is beyond me. My load takes up 3/4 of the neck space. Did loads up to 59.5 grains but saw no increase in velocity and poor grouping. The 58.5 load have best velocities and is very very accurate in my rifle.

I have some 225 grain bullets on the shelf but down here in Ga. they are extreme overkill for our deer.

 

[alf]

My actual load is 58.5 grains of IMR 4064 with a mag primer. How Nosler gets 58 into a case that is not improved is beyond me.

Sorry, I must have selective reading comprehensive....when I went to the Nosler book, I saw 338-06 A and quit looking, when in fact it's not Ackley, but A Square, who was the first to register the cartridge with SAMMI, and effectively killed the round.

Have you tried more neck tension, and/or slower powder drop with a longer drop tube? Occasionally I'll use an electric hand engraver that vibrates to beat the band, held to the loading tray to help settle the powder.

 

[loadnplenty]

I am probably gonna try another powder I have in the shelf which is a ball powder and see how the load density goes with that. Of no luck I might look into some sort of crimp die.

 

[Mohawkjohnny]

I just cut my first .338/06 AI chamber yesterday. The 24-incher was short-chambered for A-Square and was given to me. I decided that since I didn't have a nickel in it, what the hell? It's a project gun that I'm doing just to prove it can be done. That is, I'm stretching the boundaries of what you can do with a standard sporter-weight barrel. It'll be partially octagon, with a quarter rib and all the other bling-y tchotchke I can hang on it. It's going to be my "billboard" gun, so it'll be tackier than anything I'd want to be caught in the woods with, but it's kind of fun playing artist. Whatever I gain over the A-Square chambering in terms of velocity, case life, and maybe even throat erosion may not amount to that much, but it's an, uh, improvement, and it looks cool.