.308 bullet weight in use at Raton for F-TR

[Turbulent Turtle]

There has been a lot of discussion over the past year about bullet weight selection for F-TR. I have seen everything from 155 to 230 being discussed, proposed or reported on, with all manners of predictions about the outcome.

The matches are completed, the results are in. What we do not have is the bullet weights used by the "top shooters".

I figure anyone who shot over 1200 in the Nationals AND over 400 in the Worlds is probably shooting a bullet that performed well enough for the varying conditions we experienced. I don't want to spend time on the "cutoffs" above, I'm trying to make it as open as possible for folks who do not want to hazard a guess about where they fall, while still making it relevant. So it's not a hard and fast limit.

That said, I shot my .308 bullet of choice for the past several years, the incomparable 180gr Long Boat Tail from JLK by Swampworks. I find the bullet to be very consistent lot to lot, with nice clean and small meplats. I do not trim, point or otherwise sort these bullets, however one of the shooters I shot with almost convinced me that I should al least sort on bearing surface length.

So, what other bullets were used?

 

[aj300mag]

Denys I know a bunch of the Michigan shooters were using 215gr Bergers.

 

[Laurie]

Denys,

the 'official' GB team all shot 155s throughout, everybody using the 155.5gn Berger bar Steve Thornton who shoots the Australian 155gn Dyer HBC (a high BC VLD type) and Ross Opperman (I think) who uses the newer 155gn SMK #2156 largely because the Bergers copper his barrel up too fast for some reason.

This was a policy decision made 18 months ago as the team wind coaches knew 155 ballistics and wind deviations better than other weights and everybody had to be on similar bullets in case of being selected as a team shooter. Since Russell Simmonds shot 449.31v for 2nd overall, it obviously didn't harm his scores too much.

It's as well we didn't select the 185gn Juggernaut like the US teams and Canada as these bullets have been unobtainable in the UK for the last year, so would have caused terrible logistical problems.

Almost everybody used Lapua Palma brass mostly with F205M primers and most people went for H4895, a couple or so for Varget, and me alone for 8208 XBR.

Our sole privateers who did well were John Chambers who arrived on Thursday night for 3 days of the Worlds practice and the individual matches. He brought his ammo already loaded with a choice of 185 or 210gn Bergers - I don't know which he used as I didn't see him during / after the matches. He shot 411.18v. Steve Donaldson came early and shot EVERY match in both lots of comps and got 430.21v for 29th in the Worlds Individuals, a very good result. Steve shoots 230 Hybrids mostly in the UK with Viht N550, but I think he had major supply problems with this combination in the US. In any event, he switched to the 210gn Berger VLD and I don't know what powder. (Steve was a member of The Connecticut Yankees Rutland team put together by Biff Conlon, but I don't think the team matches went as well for him and the other three shooters.)

I remember the many talks I had with lots of people in Raton, but have got confused as to who was who! Did we talk on the bus on the way to the pits?

 

[Turbulent Turtle]

I'm sure there were lots of those in use. I want to see how they fared.

If you remember the discussions earlier; light and fast Vs heavier and slower Vs uber (where's the umlaut) heavy and slower still.

 

[Turbulent Turtle]

Laurie, we spoke very briefly behind the firing line as you were looking to connect with the Forum Boss. Told you you would not remember.

 

[XTR]

Our sole privateers who did well were John Chambers who arrived on Thursday night for 3 days of the Worlds practice and the individual matches. He brought his ammo already loaded with a choice of 185 or 210gn Bergers - I don't know which he used as I didn't see him during / after the matches. He shot 411.18v.

I'm going to tell a story on John here, and I hope he doesn't mind. I was scoring for him on the first day of the worlds. I know for a fact he used both his loads, at least at 1000 yards. I forget which way he went but after shooting his sighters he reached in his box and started shooting a different bullet for record. (That cost him a couple of points in the first shots.)

I shot 185s in the Nationals and found my load that I thought was thoroughly vetted (600 rounds or so in practice and matches here in TN) was too hot for the conditions there. I popped a few primers over the course of the week. The result was that I had awful vertical and I was very disappointed with the results. . (1205-21)

I went to my backup gun and load in the Worlds and shot 215s. That load, that had been tested for a grand total of 3 rounds the day before I left, performed very well. I had given up on 215s months ago and sold all of mine except for a partial box and some that needed to be pulled down. I realized that my backup gun was throated for 215s and 185s probably weren't going to cut it, so I shot one OCW test at 200 yards with lower load range than I had used in the past. Picked the best answer from a 200 yard test and loaded 197 bullets to take with me. (some days you get lucky) I on the other hand got completely and totally beaten by the wind at 1000. (410-22)

I was told that the clean (200-7) that Clint Cooper shot at 1000 was done with 185s.

 

[Laurie]

Laurie, we spoke very briefly behind the firing line as you were looking to connect with the Forum Boss. Told you you would not remember.

It was THE HEAT, THE HEAT !! - gets guys like me from the cold north of England confused. I did eventually meet up with the Forum Boss and he did a video interview on shooting .223 Rem at long ranges which I regret forum members will likely have to suffer at some point.

 

[Laurie]

Our sole privateers who did well were John Chambers who arrived on Thursday night for 3 days of the Worlds practice and the individual matches. He brought his ammo already loaded with a choice of 185 or 210gn Bergers - I don't know which he used as I didn't see him during / after the matches. He shot 411.18v.

I'm going to tell a story on John here, and I hope he doesn't mind. I was scoring for him on the first day of the worlds. I know for a fact he used both, at least at 1000 yards. I forget which way he went but after shooting his sighters he reached in his box and started shooting a different bullet for record. That cost him a few points.

Ah .... I've seen people do that back in the UK too when some guys used to bring two lots of ammo and make a decision on the day. The only way to go is to decide from the off what you're going to use and stick with it throughout the whole event as any switch whether planned or (as here) due to an error can cause terrible zeroing problems. John did really OK then considering this mistake and his lack of time to acclimatise to Raton's temperatures and altitude.

 

[Turbulent Turtle]

Laurie, we spoke very briefly behind the firing line as you were looking to connect with the Forum Boss. Told you you would not remember.

It was THE HEAT, THE HEAT !! - gets guys like me from the cold north of England confused. I did eventually meet up with the Forum Boss and he did a video interview on shooting .223 Rem at long ranges which I regret forum members will likely have to suffer at some point.

Heat? What heat?

I do remember we discussed .223 Rem at long ranges on this forum. I look forward to the video as I've never been past 1000 yards shooting my .223 in F-TR. But I moved to a .308 about 4 years ago.

 

[280man]

My daughter shot 185 Berger Juggernauts

 

[broncman]

Which 185 did Clint Cooper use?