300 wsm verses 300 win for long range

[muleman69]

Thinking of building up a long ranger. Like to ask you folks about the pros and cons of each?

 

[shoot4fun]

I have been shooting a 300 Win Mag for about 5 years in LR comps (not BR). The rifle was built by Surgeon back when Wade was running it and is a very smooth and accurate rifle. Brass has gotten noticeably harder to get over the last couple of years (especially high quality brass). I personally feel (subjective) the 300 WSM is as good as the 300WM; maybe better. No worries with the belt and the WSM brass, especially WW brand, is very good brass that will never wear out.
So, decide more if you want to shoot long action or short and if you want to do the extra step of the Larry Willis collet die for the belts and go from there.

 

[4xforfun]

Don't know if I would do a WSM on a short action for LR shooting. LR means long and heavy bullets which means long OAL.

Tod

 

[shoot4fun]

Don't know if I would do a WSM on a short action for LR shooting. LR means long and heavy bullets which means long OAL.

Tod

True, I guess. While I started out my 300WM adventures with the 190 SMK I eventually went to the 230 Hybrid. After four years of the 230 I am starting to rethink the bullet weight thing. I'm probably going back to the 190SMK (pointed) or to the 208 ELD-M. Recoil versus reward makes me think anything heavier than the 208 is unnecessary.
Also, is it Deviance that makes an action in what they call medium length? That would likely be my choice for the WSM.

 

[JBT47]

Depends on the rifle’s purpose. If this is for long range BR the .300 WSM I tough to beat. Inherently accurate. Good brass with no belt.

 

[Depart123]

I have been shooting a 300win longrange precision rifle for several years now. The one I currently have is on it's 3rd barrel. The 300win has more powder capacity and will reach out further for sure, all else being equal. But the 300win really needs attention paid to the reamer specs. Freebore in a 300win can be as much as 0.250".

The 300wsm is more efficient and with the much stronger brass, it will withstand higher pressures regularly. This will somewhat close the performance gap should you want to push it. Good brass for both runs about $0.80-$1.00.

All being said, if I was starting over and was going to shoot a 30 cal longrange kind of gun, I would go to the 300 Norma. I would lay in a good supply of brass, say 500 peices of good quality stuff and go to town.

For twist, I would run a 10 twist for standard VLD type bullets. I run 210 Sierra's and 208 Amax's currently. But if you ever wanted to really push it and run something like the Warner Tool Flatline 198's then you will need a 9 twist.

 

[retired]

define the task first then design the chamber.
what is the specific goal ?
distance
accuracy
my limited opinion is a wsm will run with a wm if the limit is 1000 yds, if you go longer,
i would go with the wm.
and in both cases a long action for bullet length.weight

Thinking of building up a long ranger. Like to ask you folks about the pros and cons of each?

 

[muleman69]

Wanting to shoot gongs mostly, farther the better (with in the 300's capability of course)

 

[gunnermhr]

I was told a long time ago, do a 300 WSM, 210 Berger, 61 grains of H4350, if it doesn't shoot take it back to to the Smith. They've broken a lot of records, accuracy is hard to beat, and no matter what anyone says, they hold their own against any cartridge for accuracy at mid to long range.

I have nothing against the Win Mag, I just haven't seen the reason to switch to it.

 

[muleman69]

Sounds like equal amount of pros and cons for each, now I have to make a decision , thanks for the great info

 

[Sniper338]

Id dabble in the 300 norma if it was me. I have a defience 338 lapua action already So im thinking about a 300 norma barrel for it too. Just to really push 30 cal bullets.

jmo.

 

[dkhunt14]

The one thing nobody mentioned is the 300 Win throat will move about an average of .030 a season. That would be about 350 shots. The 300 WSM only moved .005 in 3 seasons which was 1100 shots. This was documented with multiple barrels over multiple seasons.

The brass is really tough and the cartridge is inherently accurate. Matt

 

[Depart123]

The one thing nobody mentioned is the 300 Win throat will move about an average of .030 a season. That would be about 350 shots. The 300 WSM only moved .005 in 3 seasons which was 1100 shots. This was documented with multiple barrels over multiple seasons.

The brass is really tough and the cartridge is inherently accurate. Matt

Don't you think powder choice could affect that erosion rate Matt? Or did you see it with ball powders as well as stick?

 

[Larryh128]

Don't know if I would do a WSM on a short action for LR shooting. LR means long and heavy bullets which means long OAL.

Tod

I built mine on a long action.

 

[Larryh128]

I've shot a good number of both and here is my take on the issue. 300 WSM burns less powder and generates less recoil and is only a tick slower.

 

[4xforfun]

The brass is really tough and the cartridge is inherently accurate. Matt

I shoot both the 300 WSM and the 300 WBY and use Norma brass for both. The WBY case must be 20 % "bigger" , but the WSM brass weighs 15% more.

Truly tough stuff!!

Tod

 

[dkhunt14]

Don't you think powder choice could affect that erosion rate Matt? Or did you see it with ball powders as well as stick?

I have only shot H4350. It is pretty much the powder of choice for 1000 yard BR. Some guys are using one of the new Reloader powder and getting good results. Not sure which one but I think it is Re26. Matt

 

[Depart123]

I have only shot H4350. It is pretty much the powder of choice for 1000 yard BR. Some guys are using one of the new Reloader powder and getting good results. Not sure which one but I think it is Re26. Matt

H4350 is pretty fast for the big bullets, and burns pretty hot too. I don't doubt guys were seeing that kind of erosion. In the realm of long range unknown distance type shooting H1000, RE25 and Retumbo are the norm. I am an odd man out because I have settled on Ramshot Magnum. It seems to be as easy on throats as this type of caliber gets. I got over 1,500 rounds out of my last barrel, but I'm not holding to benchrest standards either. I replace my barrels when they will no longer hold minute of angle.

 

[retired]

he was talking wsm not wm....

H4350 is pretty fast for the big bullets, and burns pretty hot too. I don't doubt guys were seeing that kind of erosion. In the realm of long range unknown distance type shooting H1000, RE25 and Retumbo are the norm. I am an odd man out because I have settled on Ramshot Magnum. It seems to be as easy on throats as this type of caliber gets. I got over 1,500 rounds out of my last barrel, but I'm not holding to benchrest standards either. I replace my barrels when they will no longer hold minute of angle.

 

[dkhunt14]

H4350 is pretty fast for the big bullets, and burns pretty hot too. I don't doubt guys were seeing that kind of erosion. In the realm of long range unknown distance type shooting H1000, RE25 and Retumbo are the norm. I am an odd man out because I have settled on Ramshot Magnum. It seems to be as easy on throats as this type of caliber gets. I got over 1,500 rounds out of my last barrel, but I'm not holding to benchrest standards either. I replace my barrels when they will no longer hold minute of angle.

Minute of angle is not good enough for 1000 yard BR. .005 in 1100 rounds is hardly moving.The 300 Win, 308 Baer and 300 Weatherby move at least five times that. A lot of guys rechamber or go with new barrells before 1000 rounds. It's the rate of fire that hurts them. They get really hot.