30 dasher

[wildchild]

After owning a 30 BR and finding that H4198 is the powder of choice and with experiences I had was the you couldnt get enough of it in there, So Im going to do a 30 dasher in the next week or so, I thinking that Ill pick up 80 maybe 100fps and not give up any in accuracy department.
Whats the owners of 30BR's think???

 

[cmillard]

are you getting your own reamer spec'd?

 

[wildchild]

are you getting your own reamer spec'd?

Being this is an experiment, Im having the chamber cut with a 30 BR reamer then chase it with a 6 dasher reamer. If it works out Ill have one made.

 

[Hombre0321]

I can not imagine why you would want to do this. The 30BR shoots just fine with the amount of 4198 you can get in the case now. The 30BR is one of the top four "NOW" in the accuracy arena. Out shooting 6PPC's on a good day, and is absolutly the go to cartridge for VFS shooting as it is.

It has accuracy knodes from 2850 to 3050, and maybe another one a little slower. These velocity's are easily obtained with 4198 and to be honest it just does not need to go any faster, can't imagine why anyone would want to fix whats not broke or there isn't much if "Anything" to gain with this cartridge.

Now if what you are wantng to do is come up with yet another .308 caliber cartridge, use a faster twist rate to stablize a longer bullet. There are at least a dozen or so NOW existing cartridges that do that very thing. That would be kinda reinventing the wheel thing.

Then there is the engineer philosophy which is : Oh yea lets fix this sucker until it's broke kinda thing.

I applaud a Expermenter and this certainly would be that. I look forward to hearing your results from this after all you are using your own money that means you ought to spend it the way YOU WANT. And Good Luck.....

Roland

 

[WayneShaw]

There are several people that have and use an "improved" 30BR and they work! Yes, the plain Jane 30BR does fine, but it is usually stuffed with a slow drop. The bigger BR just plain works well, easily makes the velocity. I always felt it was a better balanced round than the 30BR.

 

[Hombre0321]

Wayne, I am not trying to be argumentative, I mean these type of discussions are like talking philosophy, I like philosophy.

I take your word that some are using a improved 30BR, have never seen one anywhere, not on a single equipment list and I attend a Benchrest match every weekend during the summer. But that doesn't mean its not so, , I saw my first Mole Rat Lizard Hybred, at a roadside park about a week ago. Who would have thought that?

The 30Br is a very good cartridge as is. If someone wanted to play around with it thats cool with me, but my orginal statement stands -- Why? If you are looking for more speed, the 30BR doesn't need any more speed. If you are looking to not having to use a Drop Tube in reloading this cartridge maybe that would be a reason, If you are a Lazy Reloader.

Other than those two reasons I simple can not see a reason to redo something that works so well as is. Now humans are by nature inquisitive and maybe that alone is a good enough reason.......

Roland

 

[ckwatson]

Sorry I am new here, what dose DASHER mean?

 

[Hombre0321]

Donovan, This is what I like a real discission. I am going to type this pretty quick as I happened to see it as I was leaving for the range. So excuse the spelling errors.

Donovan, not the same argument not at all. The 6MMBR is a fine and accurate cartridge. And works fine within its limitations. It shoots the Point Blank competition well, does real good at the Mid-Range distance around 600 yds. It is sorely lacking though the speed that the 6MM bullets to shoot 1,000 yd competitipn on the windy days. It does pretty well as is at a 1,000 yards, but needs more speed at 1,000 yards. Give it more speed by going to the Dasher or its kissing cousins and they excell at a 1,000 yds.

The 30BR was designed and built many years ago as the .308X1 1/2 . That cartridge a standered .308 case shortened to 1 1/2" is the basis for all of the BR cartridges. The 30BR was made to shoot VFS. That is were it is at it best, distances being 100 to 300 yards. It has accuracy knodes in the 2950 to 3050 range, and "HAS" shot many groups in competition in the 0's and 1's. That is a velocity easy to attain with the 30 BR case as is.

the only reason I can even Imagine wanting to mess with this case is to have a desire to shoot it at longer ranges. If that is the goal there are at least half a dozen other .308 cartridges that exist now without having to reinvent the wheel.......

Roland

 

[wildchild]

WHY?
We do a score shoot out to 500yrds and the straight 30br is at its limits, I like the idea of a 135 MK at around 3000+ fps with decent BC. The 308W is to much recoil. Big bullet holes and high mag scopes win here.
I'll get it done and post velocities and give input on the velocity gain. My old 30 BR was at 2950 with 135's

 

[boltfluter]

Maybe he just wants to do it. Paul.

 

[Hombre0321]

Fluter,
And thats all the reason any of "US" need. "Want to" is usually way under rated.

Wildchild,
I applaud your attempt at this new toy. I still have to ask MYSELF. "why?" But thats just me. After giving this quite a bit of thought I just may have answered my own question of. Why?

My 30BR and the way I came to this cartridge is a little unusual. I bought a Farley switch barrel Point Blank Rifle just for the action. I am not a point blank shooter and have no desire in that discipline but I did want an action to build a Long Range Benchrest rifle on.

The rifle came with two barrels one a 6PPC and the other a 30BR. I turned the 6PPC barrel into a dedicated fireforming barrel for my match rifle that is in 6MM Dasher, no sense in putting round count on the match barrel. The 30BR was kind of intriquing to me. I really liked that fat stubby case and while I was waiting for the parts for my Long Range build I thought I would like to hear that 30BR at least go bang a few times.

So I spent some time turning necks and forming a 100 30BR cases, this rifle does have a .330 neck. Ordered myself a few BIB 118 grn FB bullets and went to the range. Sense I am not interested in close up shooting I shot the thing at 400 yds. There wasn't enough accuracy to get your blood to pumping to hard at that range but it did shoot some groups in the 1/2 MOA area.

I had the first Mid Range match coming up in a couple of weeks, the parts hadn't come in so I thought for this up coming match I would shoot two slots one with the Dasher and one with the 30BR just for kicks.

I did quite a bit of load work-up on that 30BR and just could not come up with a bullet with a high enough BC to shoot very well at 600 Yds. So I shot it with 125 grn Bergers which had shown some promise. I still have those targets I shot that day of the four the Aggs. were 2.887, 3.774, 3.886 and the fourth at 2.572 and that one shot late in the day there was a little switcy wind. The groups while nothing to write home about were OK. I never did find center that day so my score was not to good at all.

I did win that match that day with the Dasher and shot a total agg of 1.860 and a score of 196 -15x. I still wanted to "Make" the 30BR shoot at 600 yds and that is 300 yds further than this cartridge with the bullets available for a 17 twist was ever designed to do.

I kept at it and just was not going to give up on this little cartridge. Finally on the XMas shoot we had a Mid Range match and right behind it a Heavy Gun Match. Never mind that at this shoot there was not even a rifle that weighed more than 17 LBS we still had a heavy gun match. I shot the 30BR in the Heavy Gun. It was right around 3:00 PM when I went to the line. There was almost "NO" wind, my wind flags didn't move twice for my intire relay. I won that heavy gun match and also still have those targets today. They measure from 1st to 4th -- 1.112, 1.218, 2.780 and 1.254, score was 189 - 14x.

Finally my parts came in and I built that Farley into a 6.5x47 Lapua. I of course kept the 30BR barrel and it is on the rifle almost all of the time. It comes off only the day before I have a match.

So wildchild I am interested in whatever results you ended up having. I do think you may need to go a little faster with the twist for the 135's maybe a 15 or 14 twist. I whish you luck and hope you are succesful enough with it that I build one for myself......

Roland

 

[Hombre0321]

Mr. Moran, I believe if you read the rest of that post you will see the distance was 600 Yds, the when was the XMAS shoot so that must be in December wouldn't you think!! As to the sanction there was none it was a club shoot. I also I am complettly aware of how good the AGG and the score were--complettly. I have been shooting for many years after 30 years in the Corps I better at least know how to shoot, however I am Old and even a blind squirrel finds an acorn every once in a while. I can not do this on demand anymore but everyonce in a while I do have a good day or two.

Thats all of the Bonifides I will ever share. I do still have the targets---Wouldn't you?? And a couple of posters right here on Accurate Shooter have seen them. Awards and records mean absolutly NOTHING to me personally, I learned long ago in endeavors much more important than a shooting match, that a man needs to take personal satisfaction in what he does. Without out that there really is not much more........

Roland

 

[wildchild]

-Roland
I had a 17 twist and was shooting 135's in fact out of curiosity to see what what would stabilize I got all the way up to 165 vld before accuracy went to about 2" AT 100YDS. 150 BT and 150 nosler Ballistic tips worked fine.