.243 Velocity - Real world

[wildcat284]

Hey guys,

I have a very nice Sako AII heavy barrelled varmint in .243 with a 24 inch barrel. According to my Nosler No. 5 edition, with 42.0 gr Varget behind a 70gr Nosler Ballistic Tip varmint with a 24 inch barrel, the velocity is 3616fps.

However, I cannot get near this velocity. My most accurate load is 42.7grs Varget and the 70gr Nosler for a 5 shot group at 125 yards of 0.354 of an inch. Velocity is very consistent - fired over the chronograph I got the following readings:

Shot 1: 3463fps
Shot 2: 3463fps
Shot 3: 3454fps
Shot 4: 3445fps
Shot 5: 3445fps.

I am thrilled with the accuracy and consistency of the loads, for me personally accuracy is way more important than velocity. But for curosity sakes I am just wondering if It is possible to get close to around the 3600fps mark with the 70gr and what powder would achieve that?

I see that Federal load the 70gr Ballistic Tip varmint to 3400fps.

 

[paulT]

Nice shooting Wildcat284, Have you tried the Lapua 90 grain scenar bullets in any of your loads, paul.

 

[Bobs243Ackley]

Hello,

The best answer to your question can be found in the pages of the Speer #9 reloading manual. In a nutshell, what you will find is that the rifle that the data was developed in may very well have shown those velocities. However, the test that Speer did was to show what two identical guns would do to illustrate what they would do for velocities. It boiled down to having what is called a "fast", or "slow" barrel. If memory serves, they used two S&W M-19 revolvers in .357 Magnum with 4" barrels. One of the guns showed velocities that were faster than a longer barrel gun would show and the other gun showed velocities that were slower than anticipated for the 4" gun. Bottom line is to try and nail the load to as a consistent shot to shot spread, as your load is showing, and then sit back and smile with a big grin on your face for finding what load your gun really does like to shoot for best accuracy. I will always put my money on the accurate load ahead of the fast load! Keep up the good work. It sure shows in you target, and chronograph data!

I have shot the 70gr. Nosler over 3,700fps, but I am using a .243AI to get it done safely.

Cordially,
Bob Blaine

 

[Forum Boss]

I ran a QuickLOAD Calc with Hodgdon Varget,ADI 2208), 24" barrel, bullets NOT touching lands, 2.630" Cartride OAL,that puts .240 of bearing surface in the neck.)

42.7 gr Varget shows velocity of 3441 fps at 59,453 fps, a good "practical max" for that case.

Note--that's just about right where you are. If you want to go faster, here is the QuickLOAD prediction for other powders. WARNING--if you go into the lands, or reduce the OAL pressure will go up dramatically. Always START LOW and work up.

It looks like 3500 fps or so is all you can expect, unless you go to 60,000+ psi pressure. Among extruded,stick) powders, it looks like the 4350 type powders will give you the most velocity--maybe an extra 80 fps compared to Varget. But you don't know if it will be as accurate.

Since 3600 fps seems unrealistic in a 24" barrel, I'd be tempted to stick with the load you have.

Cartridge : .243 Win.
Bullet : .243, 70, NOS BalTip 39532
Cartridge O.A.L. L6: 2.630 inch or 66.80 mm
Barrel Length : 24.0 inch or 609.6 mm

Predicted Data for Indicated Charges of the Following Powders.

Matching Maximum Pressure: 59400 psi, or 409 MPa

or a maximum loading ratio or filling of 102 %

These calculations refer to your specified settings in QuickLOAD 'Cartridge Dimensions' window.
C A U T I O N : any load listed can result in a powder charge that falls below minimum suggested
loads or exceeds maximum suggested loads as presented in current handloading manuals. Understand
that all of the listed powders can be unsuitable for the given combination of cartridge, bullet
and gun. Actual load order can vary, depending upon lot-to-lot powder and component variations.
USE ONLY FOR COMPARISON !

91 loads produced a Loading Ratio below user-defined minimum of 85%. These powders have been skipped.

Powder type Filling/Loading Ratio Charge Charge Vel. Prop.Burnt P max P muzz B_Time
% Grains Gramm fps % psi psi ms
--------------------------------- -----------------------------------------------------------------
Winchester 760 96.1 47.2 3.06 3507 97.6 59400 15578 1.023 ! Near Maximum !
Ramshot Hunter 98.2 48.8 3.16 3506 98.4 59400 15685 1.023 ! Near Maximum !
IMR 4350 100.4 46.3 3.00 3504 98.0 59400 15260 1.017 ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N550 96.0 46.7 3.03 3499 99.3 59400 15263 1.031 ! Near Maximum !
Accurate XMR 4350 100.4 46.8 3.03 3499 99.4 59400 15164 1.042 ! Near Maximum !
ADI AR 2209,H4350) 101.7 48.7 3.16 3495 95.7 59400 15709 1.011 ! Near Maximum !
Ramshot BigGame 96.8 45.4 2.94 3491 99.9 59400 14581 1.023 ! Near Maximum !
SNPE Vectan SP 11 94.4 45.4 2.95 3489 99.9 59400 14564 1.023 ! Near Maximum !
Raufoss RA11 92.0 42.9 2.78 3481 99.7 59400 14269 1.027 ! Near Maximum !
Alliant Reloder-15 92.0 42.9 2.78 3481 99.7 59400 14269 1.027 ! Near Maximum !
Somchem S365 102.0 47.3 3.07 3479 100.0 55875 14765 1.053 ! Near Maximum !
Norma 203B 92.4 43.1 2.79 3478 99.9 59400 14183 1.028 ! Near Maximum !
Norma 204 101.3 48.3 3.13 3470 95.6 59400 15364 1.018 ! Near Maximum !
IMR 3031 89.6 39.9 2.59 3465 100.0 59400 12745 1.025 ! Near Maximum !
IMR 4320 90.9 43.1 2.79 3464 99.8 59400 13784 1.012 ! Near Maximum !
Norma 203 old 96.9 44.2 2.86 3463 100.0 59400 14039 1.042 ! Near Maximum !
Hodgdon H4350 101.8 48.0 3.11 3463 94.8 59400 15245 1.014 ! Near Maximum !
Rottweil R903 96.9 44.2 2.87 3463 100.0 59400 14069 1.041 ! Near Maximum !
SNPE Vectan Sp 7 91.5 45.7 2.96 3457 99.8 59400 14265 1.032 ! Near Maximum !
Hodgdon H380 97.4 46.9 3.04 3453 96.6 59400 15063 1.034 ! Near Maximum !
SNPE Vectan SP 9 89.7 43.2 2.80 3451 99.9 59400 13807 1.023 ! Near Maximum !
Hodgdon BL-C2 85.5 43.3 2.81 3449 100.0 59400 13693 1.033 ! Near Maximum !
PB Clermont PCL 516 89.8 44.6 2.89 3449 99.1 59400 14236 1.024 ! Near Maximum !
PB Clermont PCL 507 86.4 42.1 2.73 3446 100.0 59400 13387 1.023 ! Near Maximum !
Ramshot TAC 85.8 42.0 2.72 3445 100.0 59400 13354 1.023 ! Near Maximum !
ADI AR 2208,VARGET) 91.0 42.7 2.77 3440 99.6 59400 13696 1.016 ! Near Maximum !
Accurate No.2520 86.0 42.7 2.77 3438 100.0 59400 13143 1.042 ! Near Maximum !
Somchem S321 85.6 42.5 2.76 3438 100.0 59400 13409 1.030 ! Near Maximum !
IMR 4064 92.0 42.0 2.72 3437 99.7 59400 13464 1.020 ! Near Maximum !
Hodgdon H414 92.6 46.5 3.01 3434 94.7 59400 14876 1.030 ! Near Maximum !
Accurate XMR 4064 94.5 42.6 2.76 3433 100.0 59400 13121 1.060 ! Near Maximum !
IMR 4831 102.0 47.4 3.07 3433 98.8 56491 14935 1.058 ! Near Maximum !
Norma 201 89.7 41.2 2.67 3429 100.0 59400 13184 1.035 ! Near Maximum !
Somchem S341 88.9 44.1 2.86 3428 99.8 59400 13533 1.026 ! Near Maximum !
Rottweil R907 92.1 44.8 2.90 3427 96.9 59400 14354 1.029 ! Near Maximum !
Rottweil R902 90.1 41.3 2.68 3424 100.0 59400 13133 1.036 ! Near Maximum !
Norma 202 89.6 41.1 2.66 3424 100.0 59400 12723 1.029 ! Near Maximum !
Accurate XMR 2495 90.1 40.2 2.61 3422 100.0 59400 12536 1.061 ! Near Maximum !
Raufoss RA4 102.0 47.6 3.08 3416 94.9 56362 15087 1.042 ! Near Maximum !
Rottweil R901 86.5 39.2 2.54 3414 100.0 59400 12553 1.040 ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N150 92.4 42.6 2.76 3409 100.0 59400 12520 1.035 ! Near Maximum !
Accurate No.2460 85.0 41.8 2.71 3408 100.0 59400 12800 1.043 ! Near Maximum !
Lovex S060 88.9 40.5 2.63 3404 100.0 59400 12659 1.017 ! Near Maximum !
Rottweil R904 102.0 47.6 3.08 3398 94.0 57447 14738 1.037 ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N540 90.6 44.1 2.86 3394 99.9 59400 13367 1.029 ! Near Maximum !
Hodgdon Benchmark 86.4 39.9 2.58 3393 100.0 59400 12357 1.018 ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N140 91.6 41.9 2.71 3390 100.0 59400 12277 1.029 ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N135 92.4 41.2 2.67 3388 100.0 59400 11991 1.037 ! Near Maximum !
Lovex S070 102.0 46.8 3.03 3388 98.3 54497 14785 1.083 ! Near Maximum !
ADI AR 2206 89.1 41.1 2.66 3387 99.9 59400 12625 1.017 ! Near Maximum !
Alliant Reloder-12 85.6 40.7 2.64 3383 100.0 59400 12052 1.024 ! Near Maximum !
ADI AR 2213 102.0 49.4 3.20 3381 92.0 52950 15741 1.065 ! Near Maximum !
Hodgdon H4895

 

[wildcat284]

Thank you very much moderator for compiling that data, helpful for other .243 shooters as well as myself. I'm amazed at the pressure reading of over 59,000 PSI, as I was under the impression the .243 operated at around the 50,000 PSI mark. This is the first time loading for the .243 and that load shows no sign of excessive pressure in my rifle. I am using Lapua Brass exclusively and it is a good price here in New Zealand. Any ideas what sort of brass life I can expect running at that pressure, or are the .243 cases designed to handle that sort of pressure?

Previous to the ADI 2208,Varget) load I listed above I had been loading the 65gr Hornady V-Max and 48gr's ADI 2209,H4350), as the guy I brought the rifle off claimed one hole groups and velocity around the 3600 fps mark. That 48gr load gave me the following over my chronograph:

Shot 1: 3341fps
Shot 2: 3375fps
Shot 3: 3392fps
Shot 4: 3392fps
Shot 5: 3379fps
Shot 6: 3367fps

The best group I could get with that load was over an inch at 125 yards. Guess the guy was full of the proverbial, and obviously, didn't take the time to work up loads to see what the rifle performed best with.

So it looks like the 42.7 gr load is definately the one for my rifle. And I hadn't checked the runout of those loads either, so there maybe some slight room to improve accuracy wise with the 42.7gr load yet.

When I was working up my loads, I tried 43grs Varget, but I noticed that I had reached the point of diminishing return. The velocity did not increase any more but pressure started to increase,ejector mark on the case head, bolt lift just started to get a little heavier).

I do not intend to go hotter, can't see the point. I'm happy with that velocity,it may be a few fps more, as the chronograph was about 5 metres from the muzzle - the range I was shooting on, had to shoot through a tyre tunnel, so chronograph was right at the end of this) and accuracy is better than I could ever have hoped for, out of what is basically an untuned factory rifle - apart from a lighter trigger pull.

Regards,

Michael.

 

[AndyW]

In my 6mm Remington I use h-414 with 70 grain bullets, Great velocity and great accuracy.

 

[Aussie_bob]

In my .243 Sako Forrester I use 44.8 grains of Ar2213sc/H4831sc behind a 87gr Hornady HPBT for 3045fps and good accuracy also the 85gr Sierra Game Kings 100 yards all holes touching.

 

[CPorter]

With my Rem 700 VLS w/26" Lilja 12 twist I got the following results:
Velocities 70 gr Nosler BT QL Test load
IMR-4831 IMR-4350 IMR-3031 Varget T2208
charge ave vel charge ave vel charge ave vel charge ave vel charge ave vel
44.8 3064 42.4 3202 36.4 3366 38 3616 37.9 3585
44.8 3153 42.4 3240 36.4 3425 38 3712 37.9 3584
44.8 3221 42.4 3220 36.4 3381 38 3678 37.9 3597
44.8 3240 42.4 3213 36.4 3396 38 3689 37.9 3585
45.2 3272 42.9 3261 36.7 3404 38.4 3687 38.3 3584
45.2 3243 42.9 3256 36.7 3460 38.4 3732 38.3 3626
45.2 3277 42.9 3232 36.7 3422 38.4 3723 38.3 3646
45.2 3254 42.9 3269 36.7 3415 38.4 3683 38.3 3642
45.7 3333 43.3 3254 37.1 3433 38.8 3682 38.7 3630
45.7 3317 43.3 3274 37.1 3465 38.8 3672 38.7 3650
45.7 3302 43.3 3293 37.1 3448 38.8 3683 38.7 3659
45.7 3310 43.3 3273 37.1 3431 38.8 3694 38.7 3674
46.2 3359 43.7 3322 37.5 3442 39.2 3758 39.1 3651
46.2 3379 43.7 3314 37.5 3583 39.2 3759 39.1 3690
46.2 3360 43.7 3331 37.5 3578 39.2 3722 39.1 3699
46.2 3366 43.7 3315 37.5 3617 39.2 3601 39.1 3683
46.9 3397 44.2 3333 37.8 3612 39.6 3623 39.5 3689
46.9 3408 44.2 3373 37.8 3619 39.6 3521 39.5 3468
46.9 3400 44.2 3332 37.8 3613 39.6 3567 39.5 3479
46.9 3426 44.2 3365 37.8 3618 39.6 3578 39.5 3473
44.8 3170 42.4 3219 36.4 3392 37.8 3674 37.9 3588
45.2 3262 42.9 3255 36.7 3425 38.4 3706 38.3 3625
45.7 3316 43.3 3274 37.1 3444 38.8 3683 38.7 3653
46.2 3366 43.7 3321 37.5 3555 39.2 3710 39.1 3681
46.9 3408 44.2 3351 37.8 3616 39.6 3572 39.5 3527
AGR vel AGR vel AGR vel AGR vel AGR vel
0.28 3170 0.26 3219 0.17 3392 0.29 3674 0.3 3588
0.44 3262 0.3 3255 0.38 3425 0.15 3706 0.14 3625
0.26 3316 0.2 3274 0.3 3444 0.45 3683 0.43 3653
0.28 3366 0.29 3321 0.3 3555 0.35 3710 0.18 3681
0.35 3408 0.27 3351 0.3 3616 0.23 3572 0.37 3527

 

[paulT]

The most accurate Load in my 1 in10 twist Blaser 243 is Lapua brass Lapua 90g molly scenar with vit n160 running at 3250 with light seating to lands.

 

[Bugs]

I have an old and battered .243 Forester that was my primary deer rifle for many years. 44 grains of WW760 or H414 behind the Sierra 85 Gr. HPBT always gave me around 3100 FPS and killed Pennsylvania whitetails stone dead.