223 Twist rate

[Mhall]

I'm building a 223 to shoot 55-60grs and was wondering if I would be way off using a 8 twist? I know a lot of AR's have 8 twist and shoot 55-60gr bullets but is it optimal? The only reason I ask is everyone seems to have 8 and 14 twist in stock but I haven't found a 5R 10 twist anywhere. Any thoughts? Past experiences?

 

[tjtjwdad]

It will shoot them but I wouldn't say it is optimal. If you have settles on either a specific bullet and / or barrel I would contact them and get some input. Krieger barrels has always been helpful for me in this regard as have various bullet makers.

HTH

 

[Mhall]

That's what I was thinking just looking for real world versus theory. Thanks 8 it is.

 

[Ksmirk]

I'm in the same boat! my PDog rifle finally gave up and my groups look more like patterning buckshot than shooting a rifle but it's well over 5K rounds so it's finally toast. It's a 1-9 and have had real good luck with the 50-55 and even some 75gr bullets but looking around it seems that the 8T is everywhere! I've ordered barrel blanks several times and I really don't want to wait months before it shows up so I'm thinking going with the 8T.... being it a 223 I'm not really sure I could get the RPM's to spin the jackets off but I have in a 7T. Later,

Kirk

 

[Laurie]

Unless you use some of the very thin jacketed varmint bullets, especially those designed for the .222 Rem, you'll be OK. I did have some 52gn Hornady AMAXs blow-up on me around 90 yards down-range in 3,300 fps loads from a one in eight Lilja match barrel some years back, but it was well worn by then (getting on for 5,000 rounds) and likely a bit rough in the throat area. (It was also temperature and fouling affected - they shot very well indeed at short ranges during extended sessions in the winter, and still did so in subsequent use on a really hot summer afternoon for the first 5 or 6 shots. Then bullets strung vertically; finally, after 12 or 15 from a hot fouled barrel they started to break up in flight and none made it to a 100 yards target.)

 

[Cuando]

The 8 twist is the one to have if you want to shoot 40's to 75's.

 

[Ksmirk]

95% of the time I shoot 50gr. VMax and when I can find some pasture maggots and some of the Barnes Varminator bullets (the one I'd worry about in the 8T) well the rifle has always made me giggle! I do like to push some 75gr BTHP or AMax which I wasn't having problems with the 9T and I'm sure the 8T the heavies would be great just don't want to loose my accuracy with the 50's. I think all would be just fine but I have that small amount of doubt that I've not ordered my blank yet. Later,

Kirk

 

[711rollerdog]

Berger Twist rate calculator

http://www.bergerbullets.com/twist-rate-calculator/

I have had good luck with 9/12 in those bullet weights

 

[Ksmirk]

Yea looked around and couldn't find any blanks in stock that I was after so I'll just give Bartlien a call tomorrow and see what kind of wait I'll be looking at.... no good reason to settle when you can wait a bit to get what you want and not my first barrel I've ordered so I'm hoping for some Christmas miracles. Later,

Kirk

 

[CJ6]

Whatever twist 7-12, having the freebore set-up for the bullets you'll be using will help.

 

[K22]

All my 223's (seven) have 12" twists because I want to shoot 50 to 55 grain bullets since I use mine for varmint and predator hunting. I can understand target shooters wanting an 8" twist for heavier bullets for target shooting but I don't understand the reason why most manufacturers' are currently trending towards 8 and 9" twists in hunting rifles. Ruger, Weatherby (Vangurad), Savage, Tikka are all trending this way even in their sporter weight hunting rifles. I would think that the heavier bullets do not shoot a flat as the 50 or 55 grain bullet but maybe I have that wrong. You guys who hunt and shoot the 8 and 9" twist 223's please comment.

 

[SheepDog]

Every manufacturer is looking at the lead free bullet performance. That is the way things are headed and the copper bullets are longer than cup and core so they need faster twist.

 

[CJ6]

All my 223's (seven) have 12" twists because I want to shoot 50 to 55 grain bullets since I use mine for varmint and predator hunting. I can understand target shooters wanting an 8" twist for heavier bullets for target shooting but I don't understand the reason why most manufacturers' are currently trending towards 8 and 9" twists in hunting rifles. Ruger, Weatherby (Vangurad), Savage, Tikka are all trending this way even in their sporter weight hunting rifles. I would think that the heavier bullets do not shoot a flat as the 50 or 55 grain bullet but maybe I have that wrong. You guys who hunt and shoot the 8 and 9" twist 223's please comment.

My thoughts are that because of the use in deer hunting and such where heavier bullets are prefered as well as longer range shooting.

 

[Ksmirk]

A lot of the PRS and a few F/TR guys have been talking about the 80 and trying the 90's. I ended up settling on a Krieger 8T as it was going to be 4-6 mo for the Bartlien and I couldn't see a good reason where the 8T would hurt me.... a fast high RPM 50gr VMax meeting a pdog is always exciting and should make the 75gr BTHP more fun at range. Later,

Kirk

 

[jepp2]

All my 223's (seven) have 12" twists because I want to shoot 50 to 55 grain bullets since I use mine for varmint and predator hunting.

Exactly my experience. I just never got the same accuracy from 7T, 8T, or even 9T with bullets in the 40 to 55 grain range. So I just go with 12T.

I did have some Speer 52 gr HP (4708) blowing up coming out of a 8T AR barrel. I checked with Speer and they confirmed the 280K RPM was too fast.

But I don't have the need to shoot heavier bullets in these rifles, so I go with what gives me the best accuracy.

 

[jpx2rk]

I have a RAR 223 with the 22" pencil barrel, 8T, for a ghog/yote carry rifle. I just started the long trip down the reloading rabbit hole, but the 1st homemade load I tried for this gun (Nosler 55g FBHP/CCI400/WW brass/23.0g of Varget) with .0300 jump does a mickey mouse face/cloverleaf that hides behind a dime at 100 yds.

Beginners luck is written all over this project but I'll take it. This rifle did NOT like any factory ammo, no matter the brand/weight/cost, etc., a 3 shot group would be 2 shots at .5 - .75 group and then throw the 3rd out to 1.5 or more. I considered trading/selling it away.

I have a Savage FV12 9T 26" HB (100% stock) 223 that seems to prefer the lighter weights (50's) in factory ammo so far but I'm just starting to do load work up for this one. 1/2" groups at 100 yds is normal with some vertical/horizontal stringing using factory ammo. It does shoot the 68/69/75 weight factory ammo decent at 200 yds, so I've got options as I see it.

I also have a 204R FV12 that seems to prefer 32's and 40's Vmax's so far, all factory ammo. No load development yet on this one either.

 

[tgoss]

current varmint gun is .22/6mm with 26" 1:8 Bartlein 5R. I live in that state of confusion called California and forced to shoot lead free. Current load is Barnes 62 gr. TTSX with 44 gr. IMR 4350. Will shoot low to mid .2 with 2.5lb trigger. Haven't tried lighter bullets but it likes most bullets up to 80 grs. Hated 70 gr.tsx.

 

[Ksmirk]

Well the brown truck dropped off the Kreiger today so I guess when I get some time to make some squiggly things and some time where the weather is kind I'll get out and see what happens, I've got some of my old loads that my other barrel really enjoyed so I'll post up my results with some 50, 55, and 75gr bullets. I'm hoping for good things! Later,

Kirk

 

[Larryh128]

8 twist is a really good twist for the bullets that you want to shoot. I use them all the time & it's my favorite twist. If that wasn't available I would use a 9 twist over a 7 twist which I know will get some people howling. Why over spin a bullet? If you are not shooting bullets over 64 grs you don't need it and it probably will cost you accuracy. This is real world, not theory.

 

[Ksmirk]

I'd have preferred the 9T but didn't want to wait the 4-6 months to get it I never had issue with the 75's from the 9T but as for more RPM? it sure is fun when those high RPM varmint bullets hit a prairie dog