.223 almost identical to 204 performance

[ba_50]

I read something interesting in Layne Simpson's book stating that the .223 loaded to 3700 with a 40 grain bullet only shoots about 1" lower than a 204 at 300 yards with more energy. If that's the case I's go with a .223. especially since I have lots of brass>(If I was going to).

 

[Terry]

The BC is not the same. The 204 has a higher BC.

 

[17VLD]

What's interesting is the newer 53grn V-Max in 22cal has a bc of .290
which is a bunch better than the past 22cals of similar weight.I think
Hornady might be changing the rules back a little in favor of the 22.
While the 20's do have a better b.c. for a given weight the new 53 V-Max
is really a flat shooter,and it does hit hard.Don't get me wrong as I love 20
calibers,I just think its about time that someone came out with a mid weight
22 caliber that has a better bc than .255.
Just imagine a .22-250 pushing the 53@4050fps
Matt

 

[xswanted]

What's interesting is the newer 53grn V-Max in 22cal has a bc of .290
which is a bunch better than the past 22cals of similar weight.I think
Hornady might be changing the rules back a little in favor of the 22.
While the 20's do have a better b.c. for a given weight the new 53 V-Max
is really a flat shooter,and it does hit hard.Don't get me wrong as I love 20
calibers,I just think its about time that someone came out with a mid weight
22 caliber that has a better bc than .255.
Just imagine a .22-250 pushing the 53@4050fps ü
Matt

You could shoot the 55 Berger in a 20-250 at close to 3700!

BC of .391! Holy flat

 

[stinnett1981]

What's interesting is the newer 53grn V-Max in 22cal has a bc of .290
which is a bunch better than the past 22cals of similar weight.I think
Hornady might be changing the rules back a little in favor of the 22.
While the 20's do have a better b.c. for a given weight the new 53 V-Max
is really a flat shooter,and it does hit hard.Don't get me wrong as I love 20
calibers,I just think its about time that someone came out with a mid weight
22 caliber that has a better bc than .255.
Just imagine a .22-250 pushing the 53@4050fps
Matt

Those 53gr Vmax are flat out awesome! Ha Ha, no pun intended ;D They shoot very very flat. My load is 25.7 grains of Benchmark and the 53 grain Vmax .005 off lands. When zerod at 100 yard it dropped 1" @ 200 yards, 5" @ 300 yards and 17-18" @ 400 yards. They shoot so much more flatter than the 69 grain SMK's that im use to shooting. I was shooting a 6"x 6" steel gong at 600 yards with ease 2 weekends ago! Anybody who says you cant kill a coyote past 300 yards with a .223 needs to shoot these bullets. It will change their mind!

Compared to a .204...I have no idea, never shot one

 

[Kermit in Va.]

What twist are you shooting the 53's ?
I've had a box of'em for several months and ain't got to try'em yet. Looks like I need to...LOL


Kermit

 

[stinnett1981]

What twist are you shooting the 53's ?
I've had a box of'em for several months and ain't got to try'em yet. Looks like I need to...LOL


Kermit

Im shooting them out of a 9 twist .223. Im not sure but I have heard that the longer 53g Vmax shoots best out of a 9 twist. It shoots great in mine anyway. I have heard of some people shooting them out of a 12 twist not having great accuracy. Who knows? If I had a 12 twist .223 I would still try the 53g Vmax out for sure.

 

[Kermit in Va.]

Mine is a 9 twist that I was planning on tring them in.
I'd heard the 12 didn't do good with'em too...


Kermit

 

[moorepower]

1-12 is fine, 1-14 is not so fine.

 

[zcrackshot]

+1 on the 1-14" not being good. I've tried like heck to get them to shoot in my 14 twist 250AI. Even at 3950 they won't stabilize. My 8 twist 223 likes them a bunch though!

 

[BigDMT]

I read something interesting in Layne Simpson's book stating that the .223 loaded to 3700 with a 40 grain bullet only shoots about 1" lower than a 204 at 300 yards with more energy. If that's the case I's go with a .223. especially since I have lots of brass>(If I was going to).

A 223 cannot have more energy than the 204.
The 223 may push a 40gr bullet at 3700 fps, but the 204 will push a 40gr bullet from 3900-4000 fps. 40gr of bullet weight is 40gr of bullet weight. Don't matter what caliber it is. So the same bullet weight going faster equals more energy. And the 20 cal would be losing less speed at 300 yards due to higher BCs, so the energy difference between the two rounds would become even greater than it was at the muzzle.

There is no 22 cal bullet 60gr or lower that can match the BC of the Sierra 20cal 39gr Match King. So the 204 will have even more energy yet than any identical weight bullet launched from a 223.

The 223 is a very fine round and always will be, but Mr. Layne Simpson is feeding folks a platefull of nonsense if that is truly what his book states. Perhaps he was referring to energy produced from a 40 gr 22 cal bullet vs. a 32gr 20 cal bullet? But that's not comparing apples to apples now is it?

The 204 is a much larger case. If you were to neck the 204 up to 22cal and make a 22/204 it would still outperform the 223 with any like bullet weight.

 

[zcrackshot]

Oh ya and as for the original posters thoughts on a 223 comparing to a 204, I say there is no comparison. Run a 40 gr .224 bullet with a bc of .2 @ 3700 fps and run a 40 gr .204 " bullet with a bc of .275 @ 3700 fps and watch the 22 cal fall on it's face. If you're only going to shoot p-dogs out to 3-400 yards then as long as the wind doesn't blow you'll be okay with the 223. Once you want to reach out there the little 204 runs away with the game and matches or passes a 22-250 in everything but raw energy. I shoot 39 gr BK's out of my 20 ppc at 4050 fps and not even my 250 ai can touch it for the fun factor on p-dogs. I'll take a 204 on anything bigger than a p-dog over a 223 any day, unless you want to shoot heavies in a 223 for larger animals and distance. Then the 223 becomes a contender. Just my thoughts.

 

[Laurie]

A 223 cannot have more energy than the 204.
The 223 may push a 40gr bullet at 3700 fps, but the 204 will push a 40gr bullet from 3900-4000 fps. 40gr of bullet weight is 40gr of bullet weight. Don't matter what caliber it is. So the same bullet weight going faster equals more energy. And the 20 cal would be losing less speed at 300 yards due to higher BCs, so the energy difference between the two rounds would become even greater than it was at the muzzle. [BigDMT]

Right on! In fact, the maths favour the 204 even further with respect to ME as velocity is squared in the ME Calculation before division by a constant then multiplication by bullet weight. So, if the 204 gives a 40gn bullet 3,950 fps compared to 3,700 fps for the 223, that's an extra 250 X 250 = 62,500 in the calculation while bullet weight remains constant at 40gn. (That is: 3,700 fps / 40gn = 1,216 ft/lb Me ..... 3950 fps / 40gn = 1,386 ft/lb. A 6.75% velocity increase therefore gives a same weight bullet 14% more energy.)

Downrange it's the combination of MV + BC and the 204 wins again, so should move less in the wind.

Yes, the 223 can be used with much heavier bullets that handle the wind better and retain much more or their initial velocity at longer ranges, but at the expense of a more curved trajectory. Bryan Litz argues in his book 'Applied Ballistics for Long Range Shooting' that 'flat trajectories' are no longer as important as they used to be in this age of affordable rangefinders, and that much varminting has become like target shooting - ie at known distances in which case having a good zero, accurate MV and BC values is all you need. I don't shoot varmints and we don't have either prairies or prairie dogs in the UK, but my pest shooting contacts pooh-pooh the rangefinding argument and say while a valuable tool in some situations, it's simply impractical for many shots.

I'd also been given to understand through the writings of Layne Simpson and others that there are other benefits to the smaller case 20s such as a reduction in dust raised by muzzle blast, recoil and rifle disturbance that allows the shooter to spot the fall of shot better than with the 22 calibre cartridges, so a miss scan be corrected. Also slower barrel heating in rapid strings?