220 Gr Lapua Scenar - Any Experience with 300 Win Mag??

[acloco]

G & Sons has the 100 count box of Lapua Scenar 220 gr projectiles on sale for 19.95 per box.

Anybody try any of these in a 300 win mag? Love? Ok to dance with? ....or otherwise?

 

[Deton8tor]

I run them in my 300WM. They were fairly easy to tune as well. I had a little trouble in the initial stages of getting a consistent group, but I went to my old friend 215M and the light came on. I like them as much as the 215's I shoot.

 

[Scooterbum]

I went ahead and ordered 300 to try in the mark 248 mod 1.

 

[Kurz]

Anybody try any of these in a 300 win mag? Love? Ok to dance with? ....or otherwise?

I was hesitating to write anything because I hate to appear to be trying to dissuade anyone from testing or trying any bullet/powder/cartridge combination. Here is the short version of what I found:

The 220 Scenar is a fine bullet if you don't have exceedingly high expectations. I think some of us are jaded by the newest versions of the high BC cup and core bullets as well as the Long Range solids being showcased. It's hard to back off of those results in order to analyze bullets which were produced before the scramble for high BC/heavy for caliber bullets took place.

I shot these in a .300 Win. Mag. and a .300 Norma Mag. with average results at the longer distance targets from 600 to 1,000 yards. The groups were reasonably round and consistent group to group. I expected this just because of the design of the bullet. Then I gave into the desire to see what a comparison between the 7mm versions of these two cartridges would yield if I used the Berger 180 grain Hybrid. So I loaded the same series of tests for the 7mm-300 Win. Mag. and the 7mm-300 Norma Mag. Yes, these are non-standard wildcats...

While the energy on target figures were similar for all four runs, the 7mm versions produced significantly less drop and drift and a somewhat noticeable lessening of recoil.

Does this simple comparison make the Scenar a bad choice? Heavens NO! It's a fine bullet which has not caught up with the newest trends in bullet making. At $20/box 100, these are a bargain!

Regards.

 

[4xforfun]

I was hesitating to write anything because I hate to appear to be trying to dissuade anyone from testing or trying any bullet/powder/cartridge combination. Here is the short version of what I found:

The 220 Scenar is a fine bullet if you don't have exceedingly high expectations. I think some of us are jaded by the newest versions of the high BC cup and core bullets as well as the Long Range solids being showcased. It's hard to back off of those results in order to analyze bullets which were produced before the scramble for high BC/heavy for caliber bullets took place.

I shot these in a .300 Win. Mag. and a .300 Norma Mag. with average results at the longer distance targets from 600 to 1,000 yards. The groups were reasonably round and consistent group to group. I expected this just because of the design of the bullet. Then I gave into the desire to see what a comparison between the 7mm versions of these two cartridges would yield if I used the Berger 180 grain Hybrid. So I loaded the same series of tests for the 7mm-300 Win. Mag. and the 7mm-300 Norma Mag. Yes, these are non-standard wildcats...

While the energy on target figures were similar for all four runs, the 7mm versions produced significantly less drop and drift and a somewhat noticeable lessening of recoil.

Does this simple comparison make the Scenar a bad choice? Heavens NO! It's a fine bullet which has not caught up with the newest trends in bullet making. At $20/box 100, these are a bargain!

Regards.

That sounds a lot like the 6mm Berger 105 and 108 BT's...great bullets overshadowed by new and shiny.

 

[Scooterbum]

Kurz,

Apples to oranges.

 

[Zero333]

I run them in my 300WM. They were fairly easy to tune as well. I had a little trouble in the initial stages of getting a consistent group, but I went to my old friend 215M and the light came on. I like them as much as the 215's I shoot.

Had the same thing with my 300winmag but with 208 eldm.
Started load development with CCI-250. Once I found the best powder charge I then tested 215m primers and the groups shrunk in half !

 

[Kurz]

Apples to oranges.

I realize that this is supposed to be one of those simple, yet brilliantly crippling replies to some comments. However, 'this comparison' is not meant to be an exacting comparative analysis at all but some observations gathered from some informal testing.

Simply stated, I find that jumping to the 220 grain Lapua does not achieve the improved results we might expect from this style of VLD bullets. In regard to this, I considered dropping down in both caliber and weight to demonstrate that this combination could and would achieve the same or better results as with the original investigation of the 220 grain version. The smaller caliber and lighter VLD bullets resulted in less felt recoil as well. While some may not consider this to be as important as other variables, it does have a definite effect on shooters during longer string competitions. There is nothing difficult here.

I then went on to state that this sale was an excellent chance to take advantage of good bullets at a more than reasonable price.

Regards.

 

[wboggs]

Recoil is substantial with all these heavy .308 bullets

 

[Laurie]

$19.95 / 100 (or around £15 / 100 to us in the UK in GBP) !! We last paid that sort of money for a quality match bullet way back sometime well before the year 2000. And ... Scenar Ls are quality bullets in their basic designs and certainly in their manufacturing quality. The UK MRSP for this bullet is currently £57.30 / 100 ($74.50 USD).

In itself that price has got to tell you something, such as low demand. This has to be a clearance price and below Graf's cost price.

When Lapua launched its three .308 Scenar Ls not that long ago, I was both puzzled and obtained confirmation on my long-held views about Lapua bullet design. The puzzle was as to what the new 175 and 220 Scenar Ls were designed to do and what markets are they intended for. (The third model is the 'l' higher grade manufacture version of the long established 155gn Scenar, a high-BC and very ballistically competent bullet in its class.) The 175 and 220 were in no way challenging the higher BC models appearing from other makers especially Berger. Form Factors of 1.033 (220gn) and 1.067 (175gn) are frankly pedestrian today (215gn Berger Hybrid = 0.898; 168gn Berger Hybrid = 0.966) and are only marginally better than antediluvian Sierra MKs.

Recent heavyweight 30s of the Scenar L's vintage nearly all have bearing surfaces below 0.5" length whilst the 220 Scenar L measures out at 0.550", not as long as the old 240gn Sierra MK which acquired a reputation for seriously coppering barrels through excessive friction, but tending that way. So in-barrel friction will likely limit MVs within acceptable pressures compared to competitor designs.

None of that is to say these bullets won't perform well and at 300 Win Mag MVs should have considerable legs. They may prove to be better stabilised at very long ranges too compared to many recent super-long nose / short bearing surface designs.

Confirmation of a long-held view on Lapua bullets? The company's designers seem to invariably turn out one very low-drag / high-BC bullet in a calibre with the rest being relatively short, high-drag models. That was long the case in its 30-cal designs, the 155 being very low drag on its introduction, the 167 and 185 amongst the highest drag models in class even against contemporary competitors. The 175 and 220 only partly remedy that, and by a very modest amount.