nakneker
Gold $$ Contributor
Starline makes great 222 brass. When their brass shows back ordered my experience is that it delivers in 1-8 weeks. Link below.
Lapua temporarily delays production of certain brass types
- Thread starter Sleepyhollow
- Start date
The last time I tried Starline 223rem I couldn’t fit enough 8208 in it to get the velocity I needed. Seemed that the walls were too thick.
It might be better than some but shouldn't be mentioned in the same breath as Lapua
nakneker
Gold $$ Contributor
When you can’t get Lapua what would you suggest?
First I think lots of manufacturers fill Lapuas shoes.
It’s your second sentence.
So give the Military second class ammo so you can shoot at some damn range?
So there might not be Lapua brass around for your entertainment? What a viscous world.
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coldboreshot
Silver $$ Contributor
Nah, I'm sure plenty was left behind for the Tali during that disasterous Evac, thanks to that dem clown.
coldboreshot
Silver $$ Contributor
No surprise, It's a prominent civilian competition cartridge in Europe. It's also where it got started.
I got my box of 6.5x47 from Scheel’s yesterday. The seal had been neatly cut on both sides and had a price tag on it like it had been out on the floor. All101 were there, I guess they sent it to the right guy!
I’ll borrow this from Dusty!
I’ll borrow this from Dusty!
TylerFromMS
Gold $$ Contributor
I’ve been pleasantly surprised getting away from the allure of the blue box.
Dusty Stevens
Shiner
From Sleepyhollow:
Forum Boss: Folks,
I have just discussed this with Lapua representatives. Production of certain types of brass is being temporarily suspended so that the production lines can produce more 5.56 and 7.62 NATO brass for military. When the military requirements are met, brass types listed will go back into production, probably in 2023.
Are you employed by Lapua or a spokesperson for them?
Just wondering as to me your opening sentence makes it seem so.
If you are can you pm me?
Forum Boss: Folks,
I have just discussed this with Lapua representatives. Production of certain types of brass is being temporarily suspended so that the production lines can produce more 5.56 and 7.62 NATO brass for military. When the military requirements are met, brass types listed will go back into production, probably in 2023.
Are you employed by Lapua or a spokesperson for them?
Just wondering as to me your opening sentence makes it seem so.
If you are can you pm me?
Last edited:
@M-61, I think the forum moderator edited the original post by Sleepyhollow.
Thanks
I'm not at all surprised [at Lapua suspending the 6.5X47mm Lapua case]. Its use has never been high in mainstream terms, and has declined substantially from its early days. It is a very specialist cartridge.
Bear in mind Lapua's purpose in contracting in Grunig & Elmiger (ISSF upmarket rifle specialist manufacturer) and spending a great deal of time and money in its development back in 2005. European rifle competitors, we in the UK aside, are largely limited to 300 metre ranges and ISSF 3-position shooting is the pinnacle of competition precision rifle shooting for many with lots of publicity and major companies sponsoring top competitors.
The dominant cartridge for a generation or more has been the 6mm BR Norma - note the final word in the name. Although many (most?) top competitors use Lapua factory ammo, Lapua really, really wanted a winning cartridge with its name on it, hence the 6.5X47 Lapua developed to be a 300 metre winner and knock the 6BR out of that slot.
On the face of it, the 6.5 spec had a lot going for it. Precision that was believed to be as high as the 6BR's, considerably longer barrel life, the only potential downside being a small increase in recoil. (The barrel life issue is significant as top ISSF competitors practice and practice, then practice some more. A full ISSF match involves a lot of shots fired rapidly, and 6BR barrels lose their 'edge' at not that high round counts in such circumstances when people want BR precision levels.) Lapua put a lot of effort into getting competitors to switch to its new cartridge, especially the sponsored big names. I'm not into ISSF (it barely figures in the UK), but I've been told by European ISSF followers that the 6.5 Lapua 'bombed' in the role for whatever reasons. The top names who tried it in year one soon reverted to 6BR and within a few years, it hardly figures in the discipline.
Fortunately for Lapua, the cartridge was found to be a superb mid and long-range performer in disciplines like F-Class. It was also seen for a while as being a potential future Special Operations Forces and sniper cartridge in Europe with barrels offered by some specialist riflemakers. It quickly found a niche in the UK in McQueens, Practical Rifle, Tactical Rifle etc type disciplines, as well as F-Class. Same as the US in other words, but not nearly so much in continental Europe where the lack of mid to long-distance rifle ranges open to civilians is the constraint.
Times have changed though over the last 10 years. Use in F-Class has dropped precipitately and whilst McQueens and tactical disciplines still have their 6.5Lapua diehards, there has been a considerable move to 6.5 Creedmoor. A gunsmith friend who is a very keen and successful competitor in these disciplines plus the new PRS used to build or rebarrel a lot of 6.5L rifles and recommend the cartridge to customers seeking advice on rifle spec and cartridge choice, but doesn't do so any more. He's moved to 6.5 Creedmoor and that's the primary cartridge choice today in this bracket. For anything short of BR, the Creedmoor matches the Lapua for precision, but crucially has a larger case so that pressures can be kept modest for the same performance (or no doubt pushed as hard as the 6.5X47L with small primer brass for higher performance) and is better suited to the new generation of uber-heavy / super-high BC bullets. My gunsmith friend told me privately he was appalled at some of the 6.5X47L loads being run by people pushing this little cartridge far harder than Lapua ever envisaged or would countenance.
No other manufacturer has adopted the cartridge, the few European rifle manufacturers offering 6.5X47L options even as a 'special order' no longer do so, and the European military SF users have largely gone too.
So, I'd imagine this case has become a small production run number for Lapua these days. Fine when you have the capacity in the factory to chop and change products, but an embarrassment when maximum output is needed for huge military orders as now applies.
I found one article that said the US sent 7000 small arms, including "some" M-4s to Ukraine. I never saw any of our NATO allies carrying the M-4 although many did use the 5.56 round like Germany and their HK416, but they also used 7.62 weapons like the HK G3.
M4A1 5.56mm assault rifles donated by US are now in service with Ukraine army | Defense News May 2022 Global Security army industry | Defense Security global news industry army year 2022 | Archive News year
M4A1 5.56mm assault rifles donated by US are now in service with Ukraine army
Dusty Stevens
Shiner
They also got some type of israeli rifle that was a switch bolt/barrel from 7.62x39 to 5.56. I cant remember what they called that but it was in response to our sending the 5.56 over
Adam in WI
Practically lives here
Anyone ever heard of the 9x18 Mak being designed to allow the use of 9x19 Parabellum in a pinch, but not vise-versa?
Dusty Stevens
Shiner
I think the mak was the original right?
Adam in WI
Practically lives here
The Mak looks to be a product of WWII, I believe the 9x19 predates WWI... I think
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