Is the AMP Annealer an essential piece of equipment for all reloaders regardless of skill level?

[carlsbad]

For long range, probably. You need an AMP or other REPEATABLE annealer so you can get consistency throughout your brass.

Or you can just buy new brass after a couple of firings. If money is no object, You have plenty of time for prep, and brass is available, that is probably the best.

--Jerry

 

[Alex Wheeler]

I have a Bench source annealer. I currently dont anneal for anything I load for including my LR BR stuff, and I shoot that stuff for quite a while across multiple barrels. I test it with every rifle to see what it prefers. I have had combos in the past that really liked annealed brass, however they shot very well on non annealed as well. Annealing always makes things feel better at the loading bench, I think thats where its popularity comes from.

 

[JimSC]

Extreme Spread and Standard Deviation is vastly more important at the longer ranges than in the Point Blank game. Consistent neck tension is a big player in that realm.

Here is a recent velocity ladder I did with my Savage 6BR, I am going to put together a Savage tactical style in 6BR and wanted to see how the little 80 gn bullets did in a 8 twist barrel. These are Peterson cases on their 15th firings, I bought 100 of them when I first bought the barrel and it currently has 1647 rounds down it. While the groups will not impress the BR crowd, they tightened up after tweaking the seating, the ES and SD numbers can't be argued with. The cases have not seen a annealer since they left the Peterson factory.

edit - I have yet to lose a case because of either neck splits or primer pocket issues, kudos to Peterson

 

[Willie]

OK, I'll be the idiot.
I started annealing about 20 years ago. I have experimented with numerous methods and noticed a real improvement the first time using a BenchSource gas unit with 2 torches. The downside to that unit was the constant changes I had to make to adjust for each of the dozen different cartridges I shoot. Then there's the Tempilac and propane pressure to deal with. I found myself spreading out to 2-3 firings between annealing, just to save the hassle of changing for each cartridge.

Sold the BenchSource and bought the AMP and I've never looked back. All my annealing is now fast and consistent. I can run large or small batches much faster and changing setup for different cartridges takes about one minute to change pilots and verify the Aztec code.

Expensive? Yes! Purchasing one depends on how much you shoot and your budget.

All my rifles group better, some better than others. My bump is very consistent, bullet seating and neck tension also. SD and ES are noticably lower.

My AMP has no dust on it because it's constantly in use. My son's and I shoot about 7 to 8 thousand rounds per year. I consider it one of best purchases I have made, but it's just my opinion.

 

[big john 5394]

I shoot 600 yds i bought the amp about a year ago at first my groups got worst and after some loads adjustments my groups got smaller and more consistent .
Big John

 

[noylj]

I've reloaded for almost 50 years and NEVER needed an annealer. I can't even remember the last bottleneck case I disposed of for neck cracks or anything.

 

[ImBIllT]

Short answer. “No”.

Annealing will extend the life of your brass. If you use expensive brass, or spend a lot on prep(fire-forming, neck turning, weight sorting, buying 1000 pcs of brass to use 200 etc.) then getting a lot more life out of your brass is very valuable in terms of time, money, and in the case of fire-forming even in terms of barrel life. If you’re shooting relatively cheap brass and doing relatively little prep, then it’s pointless.

Now that you have a better idea of whether or not you need to anneal...the AMP is a great setup, and well worth it if you anneal a lot. I only anneal a few hundred cases once or twice a year, and for me, I have absolutely no problem using a socket in a drill with a small propane torch. Might the AMP be better? Sure. But I recently shot a three shot group st 200yds that measured .089” with brass I annealed in a socket with a torch(and I’ve never experience any accuracy issues after annealin with a torch) so whatever imperfection that method has compared to the AMP is not particularly important.


I anneal after necking down to form brass, and after brass either developes enough spring back that my normal sizing die setting isn’t bumping the shoulder properly or I get a crack in a case neck. That’s usually 4-10 firings depending on the setup. I have tightneck .308 cases that went through over 30 firings before a few started showing signs of impending case/head separation. I never had a neck crack, but the cases would get to where I couldn’t bump the shoulder. I have a wildcat hunting rig that will start cracking necks at 4-6 firings. The neck in the chamber is a little on the fat side.

 

[JFrank]

I've read many comments regarding the AMP annealer but am still undecided regarding my purchase. for those purists out there, do you consider annealing an essential function of reloading regardless of skill level?[/QUOTE

I’m a terrible shot and still don’t use annealing.

 

[zipollini]

If you are jamming your bullets into the lands then neck tension is not an issue and you don't really need to anneal. You anneal not to extend brass life but to create even neck tension. Your primer pockets will most likely give out long before you see any split necks.

 

[Alex Wheeler]

If you are jamming your bullets into the lands then neck tension is not an issue and you don't really need to anneal. You anneal not to extend brass life but to create even neck tension. Your primer pockets will most likely give out long before you see any split necks.

I have read this before but I think if you do the testing you will find its not true. Neck tension matters in of off the lands.

 

[Richard Coody]

I've read many comments regarding the AMP annealer but am still undecided regarding my purchase. for those purists out there, do you consider annealing an essential function of reloading regardless of skill level?

Absolutely not
Lot to learn before annealing becomes important

 

[JimSC]

You anneal not to extend brass life but to create even neck tension.

Annealing does not affect the elasticity (springiness) of the brass. Most people assume it affects neck tension because annealing does affect the hardness of the metal. It also affects the ductility and malleability which makes it easier to bend and allows it to be stretched farther without breaking. If you have issues with your necks cracking and splitting, proper annealing will fix that. If you are doing some major case forming it will help with that also by making the brass softer and easier to bend. Brass used for springs is extremely hard and difficult to work compared to fully annealed brass

H08 C26800 brass is C26800 brass in the H08 (spring) temper. It has the second highest strength and lowest ductility compared to the other variants of C26800 brass. https://www.makeitfrom.com/material-properties/Spring-Tempered-H08-C26800-Brass

OS050 C26800 brass is C26800 brass in the OS050 (annealed to 0.050mm grain size) temper. It has the second lowest strength and highest ductility compared to the other variants of C26800 brass. https://www.makeitfrom.com/material-properties/Annealed-OS050-C26800-Brass

Ask any knifemaker how easy it is to work with spring steel, that is some hard and tough stuff.

 

[Ccrider]

For those of you who say “no” and get more than ten firings on your brass, do you continue to use the same neck bushing and maintain proper tune? If not, and you change to smaller bushings as the brass gets harder, what do you look for to tell you when to change bushing size?

 

[INTJ]

I actually tried both with and without AMP annealing for shooting LR BR. I don't think that it makes a difference all by itself. At least I didn't see any.

I do anneal my LR BR cases. I know that while it may not matter in terms of accuracy, it should help brass life. And with the AMP it is fast and easy.

If you do decide to anneal, then anneal every time. If you don't anneal, then never anneal. The key is a consistent process. The worst thing to do is to anneal every 3-4 rounds as you keep introducing changes that may require tweaking of the load.

 

[JimSC]

, do you continue to use the same neck bushing and maintain proper tune?

using scientific evidence can you explain why harder brass would need a smaller neck bushing ?

in the post above yours I linked to a engineering database that shows that brass used for springs is 1/3 harder than annealed brass but the elasticity is the same

 

[Ccrider]

using scientific evidence can you explain why harder brass would need a smaller neck bushing ?

in the post above yours I linked to a engineering database that shows that brass used for springs is 1/3 harder than annealed brass but the elasticity is the same

I am not making a claim one way or the other. I am asking.

 

[Ccrider]

The studies on Amp’s website are informative.

 

[rjtfroggy]

I don't anneal, I feel no need when I can buy new brass for a buck apiece.
Before I started to make this post I looked up the price for an Amp annealer, $1400 plus any accessaries.
I shoot on a regular basis 3 different calibers so for $1500 I can get 500 of each and they would more than likely out last me ( I'm 68 now).
I would say out of all the short range bench shooters I have asked over the last couple of years most say they DO NOT anneal, it just is not worth the time or money to them, and they all shoot better than I do. A lot better.

 

[Dub]

since buying my BenchSource annealer, I do anneal every time I load. It is quick, painless and it make me confident in my rounds.

 

[Evan]

For those of you who say “no” and get more than ten firings on your brass, do you continue to use the same neck bushing and maintain proper tune? If not, and you change to smaller bushings as the brass gets harder, what do you look for to tell you when to change bushing size?

I run 0.001" under the loaded neck size on all my bench guns. For example, I use a 0.289" bushing on my 6.5x47 and my loaded rounds come out 0.290". My chamber is 0.293". I don't have 10 reloads on this set yet as the gun is pretty new but at 5 reloads, everything is fine. My 22BR and my 20 Vartarg are set up the same and they have more than 10 reloads. Haven't changed my bushings. I have adjusted powder charge for ambient conditions and seating depth as a barrel ages. I don't anneal, but I keep rounds religiously sorted so that the same 50 pieces of brass all stay together and have the same number of cycles on them. I don't mix boxes.