Another Stupid Question about resizing 6.5x47 to 6x47

[Badbob]

Hey folks

Just got a no turn neck barrel in 6x47 and 200 rounds of brass so I can start shooting PRS. I think I've read every thread on here about resizing the brass and I'm confused as ever.

One camp says just buy the Forster FL die and resize in one step.

Another camp says use a 6mm bushing die to go half way and then finish up with a 6x47 body die.

First off everyone seems to be sold out of the Forster die.

I have a Whidden 6mmBR bushing neck die. Here is my stupid question. How does the 6.5mm neck fit into the 6mm throat of the bushing die? Or is that what you are doing, resizing the 6.5mm neck by forcing it in the 6mmBR bushinng die? In that case it is advantageous to chamfer the outside of the case neck to help it center into the 6mm opening?

Any guidance would be a huge help. BB

 

[dstoenner]

I just got through this exercise myself. I bought 200 new Lapua cases and then managed to snag another 100 1 time fired 6.5X47 Lapua cases. I use a Whidden 6x47 FL bushing die. I did everything in one pass.

The virgin Lapua brass was exactly at my go gauge so I put the go gauge in my shell holder, went up on the ram till it was at the top of its cycle before it cammed over and then screwed the die down till it just made contact. Tightened things down and checked again. I then took my largest 6mm bushing, .267 and put it in my die. Just leave the shoulder where it is, you do not need to move it.

I use Redding dry lube on the neck and roll the body on a RCBS lube pad. I then sized all in one step.

I am going to use my 6X47 in 1000 yard F-Class so I turned all of my necks. In order to do that I had to expand the neck to go over my mandrel because even the 267 bushings gave me too much neck tension. So I had an extra step of using my 241 Sinclair expander on all of the cases before starting the neck turning step. Part of the 6.5 shoulder ends up in the neck of a 6x47 so when I was turning the necks and I got close to the neck shoulder junction you could really see the brass coming off. I am one that tries to just get maybe a 50% clean up for the worse case. But for these cases, they basically did >90% cleanup or 0%. There was no in between that I found. You will also find that the 6.5 Lapua brass is 1.840 but the newly sized 6x47 brass is now 1.845. DON'T trim them yet. After I have turned the neck, I then resized the neck to .266 for the first fire forming.

Now I am in the process of fire forming. The brass length has shrunk. My cases now measure 1.842 to 1.845. Now I am trimming them to 1.842 to get them consistent. When I look at the neck/shoulder junction under a magnifying glass, I can see now that little part of the original 6.5 is pulled into the shoulder again. But I think since I turned it I may not have any donut issues, but I pretty much seat my boat tails below that point anyway.

As an aside, I had some 6.5 CM brass I picked up at the range one night. I wondered if I could make 6x47 out of them. You can but, at least I am not 100% successful getting the shoulder set back with out putting some creases in them. But here my first operation is to remove the bushing and the stem from the die. This game ets the neck so it is about .250 ID and takes some of the strain off of the neck process. I have found that if I use a very little imperial wax, move the die a little, pull it back, take the case out and rub it again, then go a little more I am getting what looks like perfect 6x47 cases. Then I trim, and then size the neck, expand then turn then resize teh neck down.

HTH

David

 

[Grimstod]

There are no stupid questions conserning sizing 6.5x47 down to 6x47. Its harder then most think it is. Watch for doughnuts.

 

[Badbob]

Hey you guys thanks for the input. I appreciate it. The brass is not cheap and I don't want to screw it up.

David--I'm still confused--it sounds like the 6.5 brass fits into your 6mm Whidden die, correct?

when I look down from the top of my 6mmbr die I can see that the 6.5x47 virgin brass hits the case neck opening. So I'm confused if I will be basically forcing the brass through the small opening--through the keyhole so to speak.


Otherwise, perhaps I need to buy the Whidden 6x47 full lenght die. Thanks BB

 

[dstoenner]

Hey you guys thanks for the input. I appreciate it. The brass is not cheap and I don't want to screw it up.

David--I'm still confused--it sounds like the 6.5 brass fits into your 6mm Whidden die, correct?

when I look down from the top of my 6mmbr die I can see that the 6.5x47 virgin brass hits the case neck opening. So I'm confused if I will be basically forcing the brass through the small opening--through the keyhole so to speak.
View attachment 1027099 View attachment 1027100

Otherwise, perhaps I need to buy the Whidden 6x47 full lenght die. Thanks BB

Bob,

That is correct that the 6x47 die is a forcing cone with the 6.5 brass. Also I only removed the bushing and stem when I was trying to make 6X47 out of 6.5 Creedmoor where I was having to set the shoulder back a bunch.

I just made my 6x47 from 6.5x47 in one simple pass. Will it develop a donut, no clue. I guess time will tell. I am completely new to this caliber to know what to expect.

David

 

[DirtySteve]

I made my brass in one pass as well. Forster dies. Just FYI my load thus far.
105 Berger HVLD 37.6 grs H4350 2.665” 5 shots grouped .425”
105 Berger HVLD 38.0 grs H4350 2.665” 5 shots grouped .301”
At 100 yards. Savage action Rock Creek 1 in 8 twist 20" barrel. New Lapua 6.5 X 47 brass CCI primers.

Edited: I used Imperial Sizing lube.

 

[22DASHER]

I made my brass in one pass as well. Forster dies. Just FYI my load thus far.
105 Berger HVLD 37.6 grs H4350 2.665” 5 shots grouped .425”
105 Berger HVLD 38.0 grs H4350 2.665” 5 shots grouped .301”
At 100 yards. Savage action Rock Creek 1 in 8 twist 20" barrel.

What speeds?

 

[DirtySteve]

What speeds?

I have not yet Chrono'ed them. I don't care about the speed till I have the accuracy as good as I think I can get it. Next trip to the range I will check the speeds. I am happy with those two loads. They did seem pretty zippy for a short barrel. Oh I have a 20 inch barrel on this rifle.

 

[Clancy]

I was very unhappy with my results necking straight down from 6.5 to 6 with the Forster die.

It could have been because this batch of brass had a very poor annealing job, or it could’ve been because I needed an intermediate step.

I’ve suffered through the first firing with some very strange flyers induced by very crooked necks. Second firing everything was fine.

I think next time I’ll do two things, anneal the new brass and use a bushing die for an intermediate step between 6.5 and the 6mm FL die.

 

[Badbob]

David, thanks again for the information and clarification. i wonder if my 6mmbr bushing neck die will work or if I should just invest in the 6x47FL die? Lots of folks, like DirtySteve, like the Forster but it is near impossible to find online right now so I might just splurge and get the whidden. Cheers BB

 

[Clancy]

If you want a FL I’ll sell you mine

 

[DirtySteve]

David, thanks again for the information and clarification. i wonder if my 6mmbr bushing neck die will work or if I should just invest in the 6x47FL die? Lots of folks, like DirtySteve, like the Forster but it is near impossible to find online right now so I might just splurge and get the whidden. Cheers BB

I would recommend using Imperial sizing wax as well. That may be the key to it going smoothly.

 

[dstoenner]

David, thanks again for the information and clarification. i wonder if my 6mmbr bushing neck die will work or if I should just invest in the 6x47FL die? Lots of folks, like DirtySteve, like the Forster but it is near impossible to find online right now so I might just splurge and get the whidden. Cheers BB

B.B.

You are welcome. Hope it helped some.

With regard to the 6x47 FL die. About 5 years ago I wanted to have a 6BR gun and rebarreled my rem700 308. I bought 300 lapua cases. Started out with my usual die combination of Hornady sizer and Redding competition seater. For the life of me I couldn’t get my runout down on loaded ammo. So I started seeing what step was losing the runout. Turned out the sizer. I bought a Redding sizer. No better. Tried a forester. A little better. Then I heard about Whidden so I tried one. Runout was solved. Then I got a 260 and tried the Whidden FL die. The sizing button was pulling too much on the necks. So I got a Whidden FL bushing die. 260 runout is mostly no more than .001. So when I decided to go with the 6x47 that is what I went to. So far so good.

One more point. Brass is springy so. In order to get the most consistent case sizing I screw my sizer down so it always kisses the shell holder on the camover. Then I adjust shoulder set back with a set of Redding competition she’ll holders. Right now on my 6x47 I am using the .010 shell holder which is holding the shoulder at the go gauge.

I believe in FL sizing and trimming every time I cycle my brass. That makes every load cycle and all the cases just like the previous load cycle.

David

 

[JLR]

All I've ever used is a Forster FL sizer and I've been very pleased with the results. Simply lubing up virgin 6.5x47 brass liberally and running them through the die has worked so far. The initial sizing/reducing does create a weird little flare at the case mouth, but it hasn't seemed to cause any issues with the performance.

 

[okie]

definitely NOT a stupid question. Thought 6.5 to 6x 47L was a simple one trip through a FL die... boy was I wrong!!
all experiences i had are detailed above. I have to let kids shoot that brass at spinner targets to straighten it out enough to suit me, and have to trim the ear off of the mouth too. RO is so bad on some it is difficult to chamber! still do not know what is happening....

 

[SG4247]

I struggled with this for months and recieved great advise here on the forum.

After using several dies, including bushing dies, which caused a bulge at the junction and would not allow the the bolt to find battery...I finally got the Forster FL die and formed the brass (even once fired) with ease.

My 6mm brass neck has a slight flare or hourglass shape like JLR mentioned, after forming - that can be reduced by neck turning before sizing to 6mm, and then follow up with a straight .241" mandrel from 21st shooters.

Just stay with it!

 

[Dusty Stevens]

My brass straight in and out of a whidden fl bushing die with no expander is perfect on the first stroke. Never an issue it looks like its fireformed already

 

[Badbob]

I ordered a Whidden FL bushing die. I went this route so I can use a mid-way bushing to take the neck down half way before finishing the case off. I anticipate having to turn the necks, even though this is a no-turn reamer/chamber, to even out any bulgers. In fact, if I can chamber them I might fire form and then re-evaluate having neck turning. We'll see!

 

[okie]

My brass straight in and out of a whidden fl bushing die with no expander is perfect on the first stroke. Never an issue it looks like its fireformed already

tried redding and forster--I should try the whidden

 

[Dusty Stevens]

tried redding and forster--I should try the whidden

Give em a try. Youll switch all your dies out