Would you like to see smaller f open targets?

Discussion in 'Competition Forum (All Calibers)' started by Falfan2017, Aug 3, 2018.

  1. MattPeetz

    MattPeetz Silver $$ Contributor

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    I have no desire to shoot where it’s just pull the trigger. Give me a range with 2-3 minute switches very fast. Work for your score. A hard fought 588 score on a tough range will always be better than a trigger pulling match.
    You become a much better shooter shooting in the wind that tests you as a shooter.
     
  2. rardoin

    rardoin Silver $$ Contributor

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    The same fellow also makes an adhesive X ring repair center. We use both and it makes a change out easy. I agree that the committee should set a standard and if the manufacturer meets that standard, it should be accepted.
     
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  3. damoncali

    damoncali Bullet Maker Site $$ Sponsor

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    We've tried a couple different center options, but nothing has worked as well as cut down full size targets, which is a pain to make and you can't paste them up in the middle of a string without disrupting the shooting. Are the stick on ones the same paper as the regulation targets? we had issues with glare/color and the way the holes punched through (the spotter placement wasn't as good) on a different kind of paper.

    Stick-on 10 rings would solve a lot of these issues very simply provided they match the real targets.

    And yeah, 300 yards is sort of a lost cause. You really need multiple center targets to make that make sense.
     
  4. kohai133

    kohai133

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    Falfan2017 stated "Yes. At the club I shoot at the winner in 600 and 1000 yard f class is frequently decided by x count with a score in the 598-600 range and 45+ x. I just think hitting the x should be a fun and special shot and not one you have to hit every time to win."

    I went back on Bar-3's Facebook (awesome page and looks like a great range!) as far back as the Apr 28th match and compiled stats through current. I have sorted these by Score, X's, Division and Date see attached top 20 scores. Of the 245 match entries during this time only once did the top score for first place in FO require the X count to break the tie, see 23-Jun for the 595-31X & 25X split. The other tie breaker in the top 10% of scores shot was for 3rd place, in FO again, for a pair of 596's with 36x & 33x split. At this range there have been 4 people record 600's, 2 in FO and 2 in Prone, three of which were for 600 yard matches.

    I will say this range has some great shooters as the top 10% of the scores are 594 and above.

    Until F-Class is back to having 10 plus people at a national championship participate in a shoot off due to an unbreakable tie per the current NRA tie breaking rules, ain't nothing broke and leave it alone.

    Cheers,
    Jim


    upload_2018-8-7_15-47-1.png
     
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  5. Puzzaz01

    Puzzaz01 Gold $$ Contributor

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    Changing the size of the targets isnt going to change who wins Nor will it prevent the centers from getting shot out! The only benefit for the complainers is the scores maybe slightly lower / but probably not. The high masters have that designation for a reason.

    Darrin
     
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  6. ljmontano

    ljmontano

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    Keep it simple keep the same targets change the scoring. All rounds that strike the line are scored at a lower score. Either your in or out.
     
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  7. Puzzaz01

    Puzzaz01 Gold $$ Contributor

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    Now that could work.

    Darrin
     
  8. damoncali

    damoncali Bullet Maker Site $$ Sponsor

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    You also get results like this, however. 600-39X was not good enough not make the podium. It's rare now, but if we keep seeing improvemnets, those 600-50X scores could very well turn into 600-60X. Perhaps it will drive people to proper F class - TR :D

    http://www.nebraskafclass.com/results/2016/2016-08-27.pdf
     
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  9. kohai133

    kohai133

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    If we go this way then a new set of records will have to be tracked. At least F-Class. Records scores would be like comparing apples to oranges. Not feasible.
     
  10. kohai133

    kohai133

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    Or ditch all the crutches and shoot Palma rifles. :rolleyes:
     
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  11. R8e8tion

    R8e8tion

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    Speaking of egos, thanks for sparing us yours.
     
  12. R8e8tion

    R8e8tion

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    Scores and X counts would be dropping all over.
     
  13. Steve Blair

    Steve Blair

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    Does that include ditching slings, coats, gloves and fancy sights with lenses? F-TR is probably as close to modern military shooting as Palma. All current shooting disciplines involve impractical aspects, some more than others.
     
  14. kohai133

    kohai133

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    Touché. However I am still not sold on lenses in iron sights. I have to wear prescription glasses so the one in the rear sight is pointless. As for the front... it just makes it a bigger fuzzy ball.
     
  15. Rope2horns

    Rope2horns Norm Harrold Gold $$ Contributor

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    Yeah but 600-39x was good enough to get a extra nice Ruger hat. :D

    @R8e8tion did you shoot this match?
     
  16. pat fulghum

    pat fulghum ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°) Gold $$ Contributor

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    Back to the subject at hand...Smaller f class for mid range

    I think that LR is just fine, but something needs to give at f class mid range around here (Seattle). Every match I’ve gone to was won with a clean with at least 80% X count.

    A 600-40x might get you an honorable mention that’s it.

    It’s a great place to do load development and to learn to read the wind without to much movement.

    The weather isn’t too tricky at the ranges around here.
     
  17. DE-F-Open

    DE-F-Open

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    ___________

    Agreed - as usual, Larry is correct in his analysis.
     
  18. Cakes

    Cakes

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    It's a bit like any sport or activity where there is a winner and 2nd and 3rd and so-forth. All competitors want to improve...nature of history. I've also been a competitive runner for the last 40 years. Look what happened to say the "4 minute" mile and every other track & field record. Technology, nutrition, training regimes all improve. The "cat" is re-skinned every other year! Scores for Mid-range on the open side IMO have all improved over the years. Just like trap shooting. 40 years ago a 100 or 200 straight was a reallly big deal...now 200 gets you and 3-4 others into a shoot-out. 5 years ago 600's on the open side were quite rare. Now fairly common if conditions warrant. Say ...drop the weight down to 8kg and 42x for a maximum scope magnification. That would take our scores back a few years but wouldn't change who does the winning. Just my 2 cents. Eric in DL
     
  19. Lbart

    Lbart Gold $$ Contributor

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    Eric,
    Not a good idea IMHO. It is possible to change most any rule and get away with it. BUT, if you call for reducing the weight of 1 to 5 thousand dollar rifles it will cause a revolt. A wise man (an Olympic shooter) once told me to make rules hard when you first make them because it is easy to relax them, but it is bad when you try to tighten them. It tends to costs people M-O-N-E-Y.

    Unfortunately the Canadians (God Bess them!) who are responsible for starting FC did not see fit have a weight limit. There was only one class ‘Open’ and F/TR was started years later. When the 1st international rules were developed I fought to have the weight limit put at 17 lbs so a 1k BR light gun class rifle could be used in both events. I lost the fight.
     
  20. lawman29

    lawman29

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    First: Smaller target...NO!

    Second: Only those individuals who shoot 600's are allowed to complain about how big the target is, how boring and ho hum it was to do it, that they really don't think that it was much of an accomplishment or in any way noteworthy, that the challenge is gone, that it was just another walk in the park...until then...until the 600 club proclaims this...I chose to ignore this babble....
     
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